As a person who happens to like Lois Lane better than Wonder Woman or Superman it's time to let BP/Storm marriage stuff go.Lois and Clark after 70+ years and an adoring fan base and Comic-wise D.C. has moved on. Comparably together five minutes and a base that never supported it (for reasons good and bad) why in the hell would they put that mess back together unless they want to ensure the books a miserable failure?
The best gift to this book Marvel could give is pairing T'Challa with a dynamic other love interest so their friendship could resume unencumbered and his base bitterness be assuaged.
::) I wish this series well, and since Pak is a “name” player, I guess it will get more than perfunctory support, at least for now. But I don’t respect how the marriage was dissolved, and I have zero interest in seeing Ororo paired romantically with various folks that fall into the “anybody but a black man at all costs.. Doop is single, right?” category. In full disclosure I’ve been on a comics-buying hiatus for the past 2 years, and so I wouldn’t be buying this in general. >:( >:(
restore the marriage.
This sounds like how I envision her...
[url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url] ([url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url])
This is exciting! :)
Or, Marvel could just write Storm and Black Panther like professionals instead of acting like racist cock-blocking nincompoops when it comes to showing a regal black man and a regal black woman in love with each other.Cosign this.
I will forever call Marvel (and DC) out for their racist bullsh*t, and I'll keep doing it right in their faces, too, as I've been doing.
Anyway interested in hearing g what the first arc is going to be about...
I could so do without that horrible mohawk.
Or, Marvel could just write Storm and Black Panther like professionals instead of acting like racist cock-blocking nincompoops when it comes to showing a regal black man and a regal black woman in love with each other.
Or, Marvel could just write Storm and Black Panther like professionals instead of acting like racist cock-blocking nincompoops when it comes to showing a regal black man and a regal black woman in love with each other.
All of this. If they're not going to be lovers, why couldn't they have at least stayed friends?
And LOLing at rabid Storm fans coming to this place thinking that HEF would give even 1/64ths of a single f*ck about anything Storm-related. Not because of the dissolving of the marriage, but because of everything after. You couldn't pay me to read this sh*t. Anybody supporting this crap has even LESS pride than Black Panther fans who are still throwing money at Marvel.
I'm proud to say that Marvel has not gotten a dime of my money in years, and they sure as hell won't be getting it now. I'll read Klaws of the Panther before I ever read a Storm mini.
The truth you spit is brutally honest and to the point.
I don't think Storm is a suitable character for solo stories.
I don't think the general readership is remotely interested in the kind of character work
that would go into making Storm into a suitable character for solo stories.
That said, I hope it does well.
The character has lots of fans who have been clamoring for a series and if the book crashes and burns outright, it will be just that much harder for characters like Kamala Khan, Misty Knight or Vixen to get a solo.
Other than that, I have no stake in Storm's sucess or failure.
I don't think Storm is a suitable character for solo stories.
I don't think the general readership is remotely interested in the kind of character work
that would go into making Storm into a suitable character for solo stories.
That said, I hope it does well.
The character has lots of fans who have been clamoring for a series and if the book crashes and burns outright, it will be just that much harder for characters like Kamala Khan, Misty Knight or Vixen to get a solo.
Other than that, I have no stake in Storm's sucess or failure.
Ummm, Kamala Khan already has a solo monthly ongoing.
It's called Ms Marvel. ;D
I like Pak just fine (loved his work on the Hulk), but I just don't trust Marvel when it comes to Storm. Conflicted!
I like Pak just fine (loved his work on the Hulk), but I just don't trust Marvel when it comes to Storm. Conflicted!
I think Pak is going to knock it out of the ball park. I'm thinking of buying two of each issue that gets published to support the title.
The best gift to this book Marvel could give is pairing T'Challa with a dynamic other love interest so their friendship could resume unencumbered and his base bitterness be assuaged.
I agree with this.
The best gift to this book Marvel could give is pairing T'Challa with a dynamic other love interest so their friendship could resume unencumbered and his base bitterness be assuaged.
I agree with this.
I don't. It sounds like punking out, I don't think we should roll over just because some fans are afraid of a Black power couple. There are plenty of people that hate Superman and Wonder Woman together, that doesn't stop their book from being great or selling well.
Buy it! It will be epic and it needs your support. :)
Buy it! It will be epic and it needs your support. :)
Nah... ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/33.gif[/url])
I like Pak just fine (loved his work on the Hulk), but I just don't trust Marvel when it comes to Storm. Conflicted!
I think Pak is going to knock it out of the ball park. I'm thinking of buying two of each issue that gets published to support the title.
As will I. And if Pak writes something that I think paints Storm (or Black Panther) in a bad light, I'm definitely going to write him a letter.
If I'm ever disappointed by something written or drawn by Marvel, I'm definitely going to let them know about it...especially since they are always asking for feedback anyway.
Buy it! It will be epic and it needs your support. :)
Nah... ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/33.gif[/url])
If it is epic, then it wouldn't need anyone's support. It would have all the support it needs.
I like Pak just fine (loved his work on the Hulk), but I just don't trust Marvel when it comes to Storm. Conflicted!
I think Pak is going to knock it out of the ball park. I'm thinking of buying two of each issue that gets published to support the title.
As will I. And if Pak writes something that I think paints Storm (or Black Panther) in a bad light, I'm definitely going to write him a letter.
If I'm ever disappointed by something written or drawn by Marvel, I'm definitely going to let them know about it...especially since they are always asking for feedback anyway.
Money, write that letter now. Don't wait. Tell him the exact points you have stated and if he's as what people are saying, he will not go there. But like others have said. I just don't trust Marvel. They way they put this book out and the price tag isn't helping the book.
Though the editor David K. never seem like a hater. He seemed like he liked that Storm was Queen of Wakanda. I just don't think he had much power at the time. That might have changed, especially since he is co-editor of Uncanny Avengers with Brevoort and the addition of Mike Marts.
The book is going to fail anyway, let's get real. It's a female lead title in the midst of the other Marvel Now titles She-Hulk, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, Ms. Marvel and Elektra. They all can't be winners, it will probably last a year.
As a reader I want to see Black Panther in the title, but most of all I don't want Pak to forget she's Black.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
Thing is, there has already been an established precedence with Storm's character being devalued for him to look good. To be honest, racism is not the main reason why the Storm fans turned against the Storm/T'challa relationship. Personally, I agree with you that BOTH characters should be written in way that is true to themselves and both written well. Thing is, there is too much emotional baggage here for the time being. That's why I say wait about a year until T'challa (or Cyclops) shows up in her book for an issue or two as a guest-star to give the book every advantage of being successful. People are so angry about the Storm/T'challa thing right now that they are close-minded to it no matter how well it is done. Give them time. Let Storm shine in the way people are used to see her shine (but, this time, enhanced!). Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see. Instead, if you want to see a strong friendship between the two, let it happen gradually during year 2 of the series.
"If my girl can’t do what I want, I don’t want the girl,” ~ Donald Sterling
^ I don't know if you guys really read what you just wrote, but the conversation seems vaguely familiar...
do fan-boys feel this way, too? do they want Storm all to themselves? if so, the BP & Storm break-up makes since, now!
([url]http://cdn.necolebitchie.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Magic-Johnson-and-Donald-Sterlings-girlfriend.jpg[/url])
"It will always be that way....It bothers me a lot that you're associating with black people. You're supposed to be a delicate white or a delicate Latina girl. You don't have to have yourself walking with black people." ~ Donald Sterling
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
Thing is, there has already been an established precedence with Storm's character being devalued for him to look good. To be honest, racism is not the main reason why the Storm fans turned against the Storm/T'challa relationship. Personally, I agree with you that BOTH characters should be written in way that is true to themselves and both written well. Thing is, there is too much emotional baggage here for the time being. That's why I say wait about a year until T'challa (or Cyclops) shows up in her book for an issue or two as a guest-star to give the book every advantage of being successful. People are so angry about the Storm/T'challa thing right now that they are close-minded to it no matter how well it is done. Give them time. Let Storm shine in the way people are used to see her shine (but, this time, enhanced!). Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see. Instead, if you want to see a strong friendship between the two, let it happen gradually during year 2 of the series.
Storm being "devalued" in order for Black Panther to look good is a lie spread by Black Panther detractors because they wanted to use every excuse in the book as to why they did not want Storm with that black man known as T'Challa but would drool and get wet whenever the pairings of Storm and Namor, Storm and Dr. Doom, Storm and Thor, Storm and Wolverine and Storm and any white man in the Marvel Universe is mentioned in terms of romance, babies and marriage.
Storm being "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good is a lie spread by Black Panther detractors who probably never read Hudlin's book, or just read one panel from a book, read it out of context and spun lies off that one panel to prove that they were "right."
And yes, racist fans will always be close-minded to Storm being with a black man, despite how well it is done, because they are racist. And I don't like rewarding racists by keeping black women and black men apart. That sort of thing is not my bag.
And yes, they are still emotional because they always get emotional whenever they see Storm being in a loving relationship with a black man as intelligent, charismatic, noble, strong, independent and handsome as T'Challa, because she has actually found someone worthy of her love. They'd much rather see her getting her vagina stretched out by a white man.
Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see? Don't force readers to see a black man and a black woman together in a title? Don't force readers to see a black woman and a black man being respectful toward each other in a title? You've got to be joking. Tell Marvel not to force readers to read about a black woman punching a black man in the face, an image that some Storm fanatics are STILL posting gleefully in Appreciation threads as recently as Thursday. Tell Marvel to not force readers to see the ultimate destruction of a black marriage out of the blue all so that it could be part of the stupid AvX storyline.
To say that Marvel shouldn't force readers to see Storm and Black Panther in a book is incredibly insulting, since Marvel and some fanatic Storm fans have been incredibly insulting US and those who want to see a black man and a black woman in a loving marriage and/or a loving relationship, and they've been insulting us for YEARS with their racist bullsh*t.
Don't talk to me about force and what shouldn't be shown to racist readers and Marvel who caters to racist readers.
>>>Rutog98
How many times are you going to keep writing the same cornball replies over and over and over again?
You're more repetitive than my turntable avatar. ;D
Speaking of comic book shops, this weekend I just happen to be cruising down the boulevard and passed by the one and only comic shop in Flo-Town around my way. In front of this shop, I see these white dudes dressed up as superman and didn't quite catch what the other dudes were dressed as... but they were wearing these silly, colorful costumes trying to attract people to enter the shop.
Have you ever thought of doing a gig like that to get readers at their 'local comic shops right now telling their comic supplies to add the new upcoming "Storm" title to their pull list'?
Think about it:
You can dress up as Storm! Y'know, wearing a caped black, S&M outfit with a platinum wig and high heels. Oh, and y'know what...?
You can shoot this on high definition digital video, do your Storm promotion thing and then upload to YouTube!
That will get readers into their local comic shops adding the new upcoming ''Storm" title to their pull list! I can assure you of that! :)
Speaking of comic book shops, this weekend I just happen to be cruising down the boulevard and passed by the one and only comic shop in Flo-Town around my way. In front of this shop, I see these white dudes dressed up as superman and didn't quite catch what the other dudes were dressed as... but they were wearing these silly, colorful costumes trying to attract people to enter the shop.
Have you ever thought of doing a gig like that to get readers at their 'local comic shops right now telling their comic supplies to add the new upcoming "Storm" title to their pull list'?
Think about it:
You can dress up as Storm! Y'know, wearing a caped black, S&M outfit with a platinum wig and high heels. Oh, and y'know what...?
You can shoot this on high definition digital video, do your Storm promotion thing and then upload to YouTube!
That will get readers into their local comic shops adding the new upcoming ''Storm" title to their pull list! I can assure you of that! :)
Nah, I don't wanna take your job. My bodily features and mannerisms are far too masculine to pull it off. While I am a very handsome guy, I would be an eyesore of a woman. :) If you get tired of your job, though, maybe you can get your daddy to dress up like that and hang out in the streets of New York telling folks to buy comics.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough?? I'm sick and damn tired of black men and black women being purposely kept apart, both in real life and in comic books, TV shows and movies because of racist, close-minded, biased, bigoted, insensitive, fanatical, arrogant, delusional and irrational attitudes of certain segments of the population.
I'm taking a stand and I don't care who has a problem with it or who it pisses off.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough?? I'm sick and damn tired of black men and black women being purposely kept apart, both in real life and in comic books, TV shows and movies because of racist, close-minded, biased, bigoted, insensitive, fanatical, arrogant, delusional and irrational attitudes of certain segments of the population.
I'm taking a stand and I don't care who has a problem with it or who it pisses off.
Hey, I bought every issue of Black Panther and have been a member of this board since the issues leading up to the marriage. There is nothing I am saying now that I did not say back then. That said, I was always rooting for the marriage to work. It did not work, so I moved on. I've tried to be fair and honest about everything from my perspective. That said, I've always wanted Storm to have her own ongoing title. This is a dream come true for me. I've enjoyed being a member of this board and wish this whole family could share in my joy of her getting her own ongoing. It would be nice if everyone would try out just the first 4 issues of the title to see if they like it. Just because she and BP broke up with each other doesn't mean the book should not get a chance. There isn't going to be a Storm/Wolverine relationship since they've already broken up and Logan is about to die. (I am SO glad they aren't going to be in a relationship. I agree with you guys on that point.) There isn't going to be an Ororo/Scott relationship either. I know that Genki posted a cover where Storm and Cyclops were kissing (no, just no, Marvel) and I don't know what that was about. I have only read about 7 issues in the last 2-3 years because the X-Men writing was so bad.
You guys sound like some of the Storm fans who kept knocking the BP title long after they gave up on it and they didn't know that things got better. You're knocking something you haven't even tried. I've started a pull box at my comic store again. This is something I haven't done ever since "Doom War" in the BP title. "Storm" is the only book on my pull list. This book is going to rock and you guys are going to be sorry when you finally catch on that you missed the first issues and your comic shop will be fresh out of the books you will have missed. I'm doing you a favor right now in talking this sense to you. Support the book! :)
...or did RIP
...or did RIP
In case you weren't paying attention, that's exactly why rutog98 brought up Mr. McDuffie's name... ([url]http://media.ign.com/boardfaces/20.gif[/url])
---as in, not gonna happen.
...or did RIP
In case you weren't paying attention, that's exactly why rutog98 brought up Mr. McDuffie's name... ([url]http://media.ign.com/boardfaces/20.gif[/url])
---as in, not gonna happen.
Which shows just how disingenuous his argument is.
>>>Battle, I was trying to keep things kosher. You started in with the personal attacks on me just a few posts ago with the McDuffie thing. You attacked me and I have a right to defend myself. With my last post, I wasn't thinking of trying to get people interested in the book. The post I made above was me taking a shot back at you and the other guy who took a personal shot at me. Again, it was not an attempt at all to try and get people buy the upcoming "Storm" book.
Now, something else I wanted to say on the whole Storm/BP marriage break up thing. (Spoilers: This has nothing to do with buying the "Storm" book.) While I understand why people are upset about the break up (I think it would have been nice if the marriage was handled in such a way that both Storm and Black Panther fans could be happy with and would have supported), it is imperative to look at ALL of the contributing factors that led up to the annulment of the marriage. It is so easy to try and write it all off as just comicbook reader racism, but when taking a closer look at the situation, there were several different criticisms leveled against the ordeal revolving around the treatment of the character, Storm. In order to get to the truth, one must take a hard look at these criticisms and weigh them fairly to see if there is any validity behind them. While there was a racist faction out there against the marriage for the wrong reasons, there was a far larger outcry about Storm being devalued to make T'challa look good. If you go back a page or two on this thread, I posted an article written by some guy (don't remember who) who outlined what he believed were the problems with the marriage of the two characters. What he posited reflects how most Storm fans who turned against the marriage really felt about the whole thing. Many of those Storm fans that turned against the marriage were Black, by the way. While I do not agree with everything the author of that article said (I addressed some of my points of contention with his piece on that post), there was a lot of merit to some of what he said. I say this as a Storm fan who got into comics because of my love for the character and will only read comics that features Storm in a very visible role. Other than that, I have no interest in comics. You will not find a bigger Storm fan than me nor will you find anyone who has a more comprehensive, encyclopedic knowledge base of the character than I do. On top of that, I supported the marriage and always advocated for it to get better and better and it did get better as their story together progressed. I bought all of the issues of BP from when Storm first started appearing in the title till the end of "Doom War". So, when I say that there are merits to some of the complaints made from the perspective of Storm fans, I speak from a very knowledgeable POV.
Some of you on here are hoping for the marriage to be repaired. The definition of an idiot is somebody who does the same thing over and over again while hoping for a different result. If the people who want the marriage to be reconstituted, or , at least a romantic relationship between the two characters established in the future, and wish for the long term success of that reunion, one must examine both the strengths and weaknesses of the handling of the relationship and marriage the first time around so as to avoid making the same mistakes over again IF a relationship between the two is to be attempted once more in the future. Otherwise, you'll get the same results and the relationship and/or marriage will fail again with the readership.
Just like some of you (like Moneyspider) don't trust the X-office with Black Panther, many of the Storm fans don't trust a relationship between Storm and T'challa to be fair to her because of many of the many mistakes that were made with the handling of the character at the beginning of the ordeal the first time around. By the time the book started getting better, the Storm fans had already booked off. Right now, it would be bad for business for the two characters to get together again. It won't have a lot of support. Storm doesn't need to be in a relationship right now, she needs to be alone to get herself together and come once more into her own. This upcoming solo title is a good opportunity for her in this regard. Let the Storm fans get their confidence back in Marvel regarding their favorite character before attempting to put her in a relationship with anyone. That would be the smart play, to be honest. Afterwards, if Marvel wants to try and put the two characters back together, they should examine the strengths and weaknesses of the first attempt to strengthen what was good and eliminate what was weak and replace those weak points with something better.
The reason I've been rehashing old issues is I'm trying to shed a light on the SOME of the truths of the matter that resulted in disaster for the marriage. I see that many people here are disgruntled about the whole thing, and I get that, but I try to offer a fair and balanced perspective on the whole issue. To do that, examples from the past have to be brought up. As far as the racist element goes from some of the protesters of the marriage, there is no point in spending much time on that in discussion. You acknowledge that its there, but then you move on from it. Don't dwell on those people. It will rob you of your peace of mind. You'll never be able to reason with a racist. Instead, look at the other things outside of the racist people that can be worked on, and improve where things can be improved. In bringing in a balanced understanding to the reality of the Storm/Panther marriage failure with the readership, I hope to alleviate some of the cross feelings about the whole thing so people can just move on and hope for a brighter future. It may not happen right away, but coming back to these boards after being out of comics for about 2-3 years and feeling the tension here about the way the marriage thing ended up, I felt it would be good for me to put my perspective out there. Given time, maybe SOME of the posters will who are not happy with the ordeal will come to see certain things and the atmosphere around here will start to feel brighter. That said, I am in total agreement with those of you who are not happy with the way the marriage was ended. I was not happy with the way the marriage was rushed into either, though. Those two instances will always be weakpoints to the whole ordeal.
Personally, I think Hudlin took on a daunting task in writing a Storm/T'challa marriage in the Black Panther title. Storm is larger than life and is truly an epic comicbook character. She has one of the biggest names in the genre and has one of the richest histories/background stories of all characters. (She certainly has the richest and most exciting history of all the X-Men characters!) Trying to balance a title centered on a marriage between these two characters is challenging to do since she could very easily overshadow the Black Panther. At the same time, Storm has to be allowed to shine as the great and monumental character that she is. Not an easy task, but Hudlin took on the challenge and the book was getting better and better.
There is no wonder that whenever Storm is included on an X-Men roster under Claremont, she is always going to be front and center. She has a tendency to even overshadow most of her big named X-Men teammates when written by this scribe who has a great love for the character. She overshadows them many times because her character is so rich, wonderful and powerful that and he puts her inner self and power levels up on display for everyone to see. The other X-Men characters simply can't compete! :)
(Hey, don't hold it against me for that last paragraph. I'm a Storm fan, I have to sometimes indulge and tell the truth just like it is!)
It's funny how you put the blame of the "slights" to Storm to everyone but the people who've written her recently as a X-Man. You're real quick to say how she was sub servant to T'Challa by Hudlin she has been written actually being sub servant to Logan( across two books ), Cyclops( who under Gillen's pen told her she needs him more the Logan ), Emma who basically has slapped her around in every panel they've had together and Kitty/Rachel who under the great savior Brian Wood have told her she ain't *ish. It's apparently ok however since they're all X-Men and his holiness Claremont brought her to the forefront decades ago( which also gets his questionable stuff a pass or out right ignored ).
You have done the exact same thing other lovers of Storm have done in that it's T'Challa's fault, no one cares about Shuri, Natasha/Khamla/Carol have stolen her spotlight and you fans are bitter then turn right around and say no I wasn't taking any shots at anyone or throwing shade at other characters( that have nothing to do or are even under x-office authority ) and despite showing anger and bitterness swear there is none coming from the end you stand on( while then at the same time telling us to buy this comic just cause and ignore the shade you've thrown out ).
Nah... ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/33.gif[/url])
I've done all I can.
The word you're looking for to describe many fans of Black Panther and Storm here is 'disgruntled', not your word choice.
Nah... ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/33.gif[/url])
I'll see your "nah" and raise you a...
([url]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_KI9gcT8Agi4/TMiqZpYGKxI/AAAAAAAAAkE/TXuuMf4tyCE/s1600/no+no+no.gif[/url])
And should someone ask why such a hardcore Storm fan would reject such a project, the answer is simple:
([url]http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/01/5e/72/015e72e1370a9692df76d071e7d267d5.jpg[/url])
...and any Storm fan who IS looking forward to this tripe deserves the most vicious of ridicule. Rutog98, the minute I create an invention that will allow me to kick you in your ass every time you post, you (and your ass) are going to be in a world of hurt.I've done all I can.
Yes, you have. You can always go back to CBR with this nuthugging bullsh*t. HEF has become a little too Drake-like for my tastes, but you? You take the delusional cake, candles, plate, knife AND baker.The word you're looking for to describe many fans of Black Panther and Storm here is 'disgruntled', not your word choice.
Betrayed is the word I would use, but that's not why I'm not buying the book. I'm not buying the book because the way Storm has been portrayed after the marriage. As in, right motherf*cking now. Who's she going to f*ck in THIS mini? Again...
([url]http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/I+do+not+give+a+single+f[/url]*ck.+I+am+the_520e0a_3647047.jpg)
...or did RIP
In case you weren't paying attention, that's exactly why rutog98 brought up Mr. McDuffie's name... ([url]http://media.ign.com/boardfaces/20.gif[/url])
---as in, not gonna happen.
Which shows just how disingenuous his argument is.
...or shows just how desperate the two of you are to make up crap I did not say. Neither of you can say that I brought up McDuffie prior to Princesa's post. It shows that your arguments are shallow and you can't refute my points sincethe both of you have been reduced to making false claims about things I said to try and win a point over. You sound like bitter sore losers. I've already gone into depth on this stuff on the "IGN Storm/Black Panther Marriage" thread. Perhaps, if you are really sincere, you should go reread what I posted there to brush up on your facts. I doubt you will since all you want to do is sling accusations which you know are lies. For the record, again, I already stated that if Maberry had focused on Storm instead of Shuri when he came on board, I believe the marriage would still be in tact today. Anyway, I'm not going through all of that again. I posted my feelings on this on that other thread. The point I was agreeing on with Princesa was McDuffie would have been an even better pick than Maberry, but I had not thought of it until she brought it up. Making blunders like this gives you away. You're irrational and delusional. You're just sore about the whole marriage thing and your emotions are getting in the way of logic.
Yes, racism from readers was an issue during the marriage, however, there were mistakes made with the handling of Storm at the beginning of the whole project that alienated fans of the character. Again, I've already explained all of this. If you are so sure of your ground, why don't you man up and point out to me specifically what I have said in my posts where I have gone wrong? If you are seriously man enough to take me on, don't just make general comments about things I supposedly said or what I think, do a post and quote things specifically I've said in my posts that were inaccurate. I try to be honest and fair in my assessment of the whole situation. I seriously doubt you will take me up on this since you know I can back up my position and it doesn't go along with your feelings. Grow up.
Nah... ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/33.gif[/url])
I'll see your "nah" and raise you a...
([url]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_KI9gcT8Agi4/TMiqZpYGKxI/AAAAAAAAAkE/TXuuMf4tyCE/s1600/no+no+no.gif[/url])
And should someone ask why such a hardcore Storm fan would reject such a project, the answer is simple:
([url]http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/01/5e/72/015e72e1370a9692df76d071e7d267d5.jpg[/url])
...and any Storm fan who IS looking forward to this tripe deserves the most vicious of ridicule. Rutog98, the minute I create an invention that will allow me to kick you in your ass every time you post, you (and your ass) are going to be in a world of hurt.I've done all I can.
Yes, you have. You can always go back to CBR with this nuthugging bullsh*t. HEF has become a little too Drake-like for my tastes, but you? You take the delusional cake, candles, plate, knife AND baker.The word you're looking for to describe many fans of Black Panther and Storm here is 'disgruntled', not your word choice.
Betrayed is the word I would use, but that's not why I'm not buying the book. I'm not buying the book because the way Storm has been portrayed after the marriage. As in, right motherf*cking now. Who's she going to f*ck in THIS mini? Again...
([url]http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/I+do+not+give+a+single+f[/url]*ck.+I+am+the_520e0a_3647047.jpg)
The book is going to fail anyway, let's get real. It's a female lead title in the midst of the other Marvel Now titles She-Hulk, Black Widow, Captain Marvel, Ms. Marvel and Elektra. They all can't be winners, it will probably last a year.
As a reader I want to see Black Panther in the title, but most of all I don't want Pak to forget she's Black.
I think the book can do better than the other female titles put out by Marvel. It has the potential to do very well. Guest-starring T'challa in the title will reduce the book's chances at making it. For the first year of the title, T'challa doesn't need to show up at all. Marvel should do everything it can to make sure the book is a success especially its first twelve issues. That means keeping T'challa far away from the title.
If the book does very well the first year, then I would not mind the Black Panther showing up the next year for an issue or two as a guest-star.
Also, what do you mean he doesn't need to forget she's Black? Elaborate. Classic Storm is just fine the way she is and always should be (I'm ignoring this business about Cyclops and Wolverine recently). She got a lot of fans that way. If by Black, you mean written like she was in the EJD mini, then I wholeheartedly disagree. That Storm will DEFINITELY fail if trying to carry her own title. That was not Storm at all. Keep her speaking patterns formal and keep her regal. I don't want a stereotypical portrayal of Black people with Storm. It's racist, divisive and its not the character that I and others fell in love with. Not all Black people act and talk the same way and that should be reflected in the medium. I think its wonderful and inspiring to see a Black character like Storm speaking as eloquently as she does while having all the regal bearing of a goddess and possessing that fierce, indomitable will and personality backed by her enormous power levels. This is why she is arguably the most popular female comicbook character with her only real rival being Wonder Woman and this needs to remain untouched. She's a character that breaks through the color barriers and one that millions of readers can relate to.
All this goes to show that I'm smarter than you.The very idea that you think that you are smarter than me over a COMIC BOOK just proves that you are so far beneath me on the intelligence scale that you would have to look up just to be in the range of retard.
Its not my fault you didn't have the sense to stop keeping up with what was going on in the title while those x-writers were destroying Storm's character AFTER the marriage.
^^^^ you need a hug!
Your claims are ridiculous.
I already said that I've all but dropped comics over the last 2-3 years because of the treatment of Storm. I am just now getting back into them
I had stopped reading X-Men, actually, during the Matt Fraction run on the book and was pretty much only reading Black Panther.
When Claremont's alternate reality X-book, X-Men Forever, came out, I read that title and haven't really read anything since that book's cancellation.
I've already given my opinion on the Storm/Woverine relationship in the other thread. I am writing that off as Storm, in an emotionally vulnerable state, scraping the bottom of the barrel and rebounding hard by being with Wolverine.
I stated this earlier and I went even further than this. If you are going to make a claim about my position on something, at least try and be honest about it.
Don't try and muddy what I say just because I don't agree with every gripe you have.
Your claims are ridiculous.
Of course you'd say thatI already said that I've all but dropped comics over the last 2-3 years because of the treatment of Storm. I am just now getting back into them
Yet you have no problem throwing other characters under the bus to prop Storm up and her unreleased comic
Also, I've stated several times that while she was in Hudlin's book, she became mere wallpaper in the X-Men titles during that time.
I had stopped reading X-Men, actually, during the Matt Fraction run on the book and was pretty much only reading Black Panther.
When Claremont's alternate reality X-book, X-Men Forever, came out, I read that title and haven't really read anything since that book's cancellation.
I've already given my opinion on the Storm/Woverine relationship in the other thread. I am writing that off as Storm, in an emotionally vulnerable state, scraping the bottom of the barrel and rebounding hard by being with Wolverine.
I stated this earlier and I went even further than this. If you are going to make a claim about my position on something, at least try and be honest about it.
Don't try and muddy what I say just because I don't agree with every gripe you have.
If you're so easily offended, then you should not have thrown a punch at me first.
If you disagree with my position, you could have and should have responded to it in a civil manner.
There's no point in trying to discuss anything with you.
Wait... wait... wait... :)
Watch this character rutog98 throw up another 'wall of text' in response !
Watch! ;)
What really pisses me off with idiots like this is that they have the audacity to talk as if Storm fans are all one large monolithic group.
I grew up reading the original X-book that she featured in back in the 1970's and followed her adventures for years before the internet even existed ,so for this clown to come on here and start pontificating about the virtues of a Storm who's been thoroughly devalued in the X-universe is nothing more than a truly pathetic joke.
What really pisses me off with idiots like this is that they have the audacity to talk as if Storm fans are all one large monolithic group.
I grew up reading the original X-book that she featured in back in the 1970's and followed her adventures for years before the internet even existed ,so for this clown to come on here and start pontificating about the virtues of a Storm who's been thoroughly devalued in the X-universe is nothing more than a truly pathetic joke.
Agreed 100%. 8)
You cannot allow yourself to get emotionally involved with characters like that. The only exception is when you're laughing at them.
Remember what I wrote about comicbook fanatics? How irritating they are? They are the only people like this on planet Earth.
Them and video game fanatics....
...and Star Trek fanatics...
... and Star Wars fanatics...
Most people classify them as 'nerds' but that's getting old. ([url]http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a384/themarbleintheoatmeal/smilies/character0303.gif[/url]) Hell, a lot of pop culture phenoms I enjoy are nerdy but not like these types. Fanboys is what they are. Real creepy types. :-[
Wait... wait... wait... :)
Watch this character rutog98 throw up another 'wall of text' in response !
Watch! ;)
Wait... wait... wait... :)
Watch this character rutog98 throw up another 'wall of text' in response !
Watch! ;)
You, sir, are correct.
If you're so easily offended, then you should not have thrown a punch at me first.
The f*ck are you talking about? Since when is "nah, I'll pass" a punch?QuoteIf you disagree with my position, you could have and should have responded to it in a civil manner.
You're taking it up the ass for Marvel and getting nothing in return but pubic burn on your chin. I'm merely pointing that out. Don't like it, stop doing it.QuoteThere's no point in trying to discuss anything with you.
Nobody cares about what you're prattling about, and as long as you keep prattling, you're going to keep getting cock slapped. And you're right. You and I have nothing to discuss - for any reason - as long as you're here at HEF. I don't converse with corporate whores.
*adds Rutog98 to the (n)ignore list*
I love how people who don't care, care enough to tell you they don't care. :o
I love how people who don't care, care enough to tell you they don't care. :o
If they hadn't been insulted first maybe some would care
Watch this character rutog98 throw up another 'wall of text' in response !
still up wrapping gifts... how do you wrap a skateboard?
devil's advocate... i joined this forum to learn more about storm & BP. i was gonna publish an unauthorized version of ororo & t'challa. instead, i decided to become a student of the characters/ storyline & history. my focus is not so-much on the past... only the future of the beloved black superheroes. the wakandan legacy is truly legitimate. that's why it means so much to all of us.
anyway, i say all this to say, i plan to remain in a student position & learn. my grievances & fan-insight stretch beyond blogs or forums. i have taken my artistic creativity to convey my own message about our heroes. my artwork of storm & BP is just an extension of my position & opinion. the art is no different than any written post made on this site. in fact, it's exactly the same thing, only in a different format.
before i dive deep into written declarations about the characters, i need to be clear that my thought process has been intentionally developed to think 'outside' the box. making an unauthorized story was my way of blogging. for now, i've haulted on the project to study. i'd rather pay respects for what already has been done before i blindly move forward. i'm not here to sell or promote anything... only to network, be advised & promote alternative ideas for the legacy.
still a newbie...
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OMG YOU ARE DOPE, SON!!
Honestly I wouldn't have picked Clarmont period l'm also not a fan of OVERPOWERED heroes (one reason I don't love Superman comics). So we'll see. I'm moderately optimistic.
Honestly I wouldn't have picked Clarmont period l'm also not a fan of OVERPOWERED heroes (one reason I don't love Superman comics). So we'll see. I'm moderately optimistic.
I don't think there is anything wrong with Storm being written that powerfully at all. Just make sure the villains are powerful enough to pose a realistic threat to her. Would you agree with that?
You think she is powerful enough to beat Doomsday, more powerful than Magneto, TPG should view her as an equal, and so on. You think she is more powerful than anyone and if he writes anyone as being a challenge or superior, you are going to write a five page article explaining why the writer is wrong and Storm should have taken down the villain effortlessly.
Honestly I wouldn't have picked Clarmont period l'm also not a fan of OVERPOWERED heroes (one reason I don't love Superman comics). So we'll see. I'm moderately optimistic.
I don't think there is anything wrong with Storm being written that powerfully at all. Just make sure the villains are powerful enough to pose a realistic threat to her. Would you agree with that?
You think she is powerful enough to beat Doomsday, more powerful than Magneto, TPG should view her as an equal, and so on. You think she is more powerful than anyone and if he writes anyone as being a challenge or superior, you are going to write a five page article explaining why the writer is wrong and Storm should have taken down the villain effortlessly.
[url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url] ([url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url])
This is exciting! :)
[url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url] ([url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url])
This is exciting! :)
RUUUUUTOOOOOG WHASSUP BRUH!!
Hopefully Storm will get her just due. I was a fan of the marriage and still think the annulment was a bad idea. The Wolverine-Storm romance didn't do anything for me. I liked Pak's work on World War Hulk and War Machine so I'm guardedly optimistic that he can deliver a Storm series worthy of the character.
Right now is not a good time to restore the marriage. She is just getting her own solo title. She needs some time alone to establish herself before she gets into any relationships. We need to see Storm as Storm. Let her have her moment in the spotlight for a while. I've only bought about 7 comics in the last 2 years or so because Storm was just wallpaper. Now that she finally has the opportunity to shine in a big way, I don't want her to share the spotlight with anyone right now.
This sounds like how I envision her...
Honestly I wouldn't have picked Clarmont period l'm also not a fan of OVERPOWERED heroes (one reason I don't love Superman comics). So we'll see. I'm moderately optimistic.
I don't think there is anything wrong with Storm being written that powerfully at all. Just make sure the villains are powerful enough to pose a realistic threat to her. Would you agree with that?
You think she is powerful enough to beat Doomsday, more powerful than Magneto, TPG should view her as an equal, and so on. You think she is more powerful than anyone and if he writes anyone as being a challenge or superior, you are going to write a five page article explaining why the writer is wrong and Storm should have taken down the villain effortlessly.
::) I wish this series well, and since Pak is a “name” player, I guess it will get more than perfunctory support, at least for now. But I don’t respect how the marriage was dissolved, and I have zero interest in seeing Ororo paired romantically with various folks that fall into the “anybody but a black man at all costs.. Doop is single, right?” category. In full disclosure I’ve been on a comics-buying hiatus for the past 2 years, and so I wouldn’t be buying this in general. >:( >:(
[url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url] ([url]http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2014/04/27/greg-pak-storm-comic-book-excluisve/8253687/[/url])
This is exciting! :)
RUUUUUTOOOOOG WHASSUP BRUH!!
Hey, long time, no see. Been out of comics for a few years and just getting back into them. This board is a different place from when I left it for a while. The mood around here is more solemn now. It used to be bright and happy. I am hopeful that the mood will pick back up to where it used to be, though. :)
Or, Marvel could just write Storm and Black Panther like professionals instead of acting like racist cock-blocking nincompoops when it comes to showing a regal black man and a regal black woman in love with each other.
All of this. If they're not going to be lovers, why couldn't they have at least stayed friends?
And LOLing at rabid Storm fans coming to this place thinking that HEF would give even 1/64ths of a single f*ck about anything Storm-related. Not because of the dissolving of the marriage, but because of everything after. You couldn't pay me to read this sh*t. Anybody supporting this crap has even LESS pride than Black Panther fans who are still throwing money at Marvel.
I'm proud to say that Marvel has not gotten a dime of my money in years, and they sure as hell won't be getting it now. I'll read Klaws of the Panther before I ever read a Storm mini.
Or, Marvel could just write Storm and Black Panther like professionals instead of acting like racist cock-blocking nincompoops when it comes to showing a regal black man and a regal black woman in love with each other.
All of this. If they're not going to be lovers, why couldn't they have at least stayed friends?
And LOLing at rabid Storm fans coming to this place thinking that HEF would give even 1/64ths of a single f*ck about anything Storm-related. Not because of the dissolving of the marriage, but because of everything after. You couldn't pay me to read this sh*t. Anybody supporting this crap has even LESS pride than Black Panther fans who are still throwing money at Marvel.
I'm proud to say that Marvel has not gotten a dime of my money in years, and they sure as hell won't be getting it now. I'll read Klaws of the Panther before I ever read a Storm mini.
Still love you.
@Supreme Illuminati,
To be frank, I don't want to see T'challa show up first in an Avengers movie. I think he needs a solo movie first. To level with you, the whole idea of Wakanda is wild, exotic and primal based on its local and everything. I think it would appeal to the larger movie-going audience as its fascinating. It would be awesomely impressive to see T'challa traversing the Astral Plane and talking to the Panther God while on that place as TPG endows him with power. There should be a whole movie devoted to BP to define for everyone who he is and what Wakanda is all about as we get wonderful visuals of that mythical country. They can make Wakanda as splendiferous as they please. Picture this massively advanced technological wonder of a nation out there centered in the wild jungles of Africa otherwise untouched and tell me that doesn't sound like a wonderful sight. The special effects in a movie like this can be breathtaking.
After an introduction like this, then plop him onto the cast of an Avengers movie, otherwise we will not be able to get all the dimensions of the character.
I don't ever recall doing a Storm vs. Doomsday debate. LOL! I don't read DC. Storm is definitely more powerful than Magneto. He needs a machine to boost his power just to turn off the lights around the world. In "Magneto War", Magneto created a machine to boost his powers to do just this feat. When the machine was destroyed and he was forced to control all of that energy on his own, he nearly lost his life and was lucky to walk away from the incident with just his mutant powers being permanently burned out from the ordeal. If you try and bring up "Fatal Attractions" where Magneto caused a world wide blackout before this instance in "Magneto War", the only reason he was able to do that there was because Forge's machine was used to skewer the EM field to such a degree that if Magneto had come within the Earth's atmosphere and attempted to use his powers, the fields would have fedback on him instantly killing him. He blasted the skewered geomagnetic field from space while it was warped to this extreme which resulted in the global EMP. Canon has shown that he doesn't have this kind of power under the merits of his own power. He needs technology to do feats that are far below what Storm can do naturally without anything hiking up her powers. Magneto lost credibility years ago. Its become common practice at Marvel that whenever a character more powerful than he faces him in combat, said character's powers levels are adjusted downward to make him a big bad. There are examples of this with other characters besides Storm.
That said, the average hurricane is about 500 miles across and they generate enough power to power supply the entire planet. Storm has controlled hemisphere-sized hurricanes before and continent-sized blizzards.So, she has controlled more energy than it would take to power supply the world exponentially. On another occassion, she created a gamma-powered weather shield around the whole Earth to deflect a planet-destroying blast from the sun. She redirected the full power of Sienna Blaze who's powers were strong enough to split the planet like a ripe melon. All of this, and I still haven't said it all. So, yeah, Storm is MUCH more powerful than Magneto. I don't know why you would bring that up against me when you know I can debunk it. Even Magneto himself has stated that Storm has the power to beat him, but she holds back.
Regarding TPG, what I said was Storm and TPG were Wakanda's two most powerful protectors back when she and T'challa were married.
That said, Storm should be VERY powerful and pitted against villains strong enough to challenge that power. A hero is only overpowered when the opposition is too weak to challenge them. Well, it depends on how you look at it. I don't see Storm as being overpowered as much as I see her being pitted against characters that have no business challenging her. The MU has villains of varying power levels ranging from characters to fight with the likes of Spiderman and Luke Cage all the way up to sparring partners for the likes of Silver Surfer, Thor...and even Galactus, etc. There is definitely a place for a hero as powerful as Storm.
Quote from: Rutog98
I don't ever recall doing a Storm vs. Doomsday debate. LOL! I don't read DC. Storm is definitely more powerful than Magneto. He needs a machine to boost his power just to turn off the lights around the world. In "Magneto War", Magneto created a machine to boost his powers to do just this feat. When the machine was destroyed and he was forced to control all of that energy on his own, he nearly lost his life and was lucky to walk away from the incident with just his mutant powers being permanently burned out from the ordeal. If you try and bring up "Fatal Attractions" where Magneto caused a world wide blackout before this instance in "Magneto War", the only reason he was able to do that there was because Forge's machine was used to skewer the EM field to such a degree that if Magneto had come within the Earth's atmosphere and attempted to use his powers, the fields would have fedback on him instantly killing him. He blasted the skewered geomagnetic field from space while it was warped to this extreme which resulted in the global EMP. Canon has shown that he doesn't have this kind of power under the merits of his own power. He needs technology to do feats that are far below what Storm can do naturally without anything hiking up her powers. Magneto lost credibility years ago. Its become common practice at Marvel that whenever a character more powerful than he faces him in combat, said character's powers levels are adjusted downward to make him a big bad. There are examples of this with other characters besides Storm.
That said, the average hurricane is about 500 miles across and they generate enough power to power supply the entire planet. Storm has controlled hemisphere-sized hurricanes before and continent-sized blizzards.So, she has controlled more energy than it would take to power supply the world exponentially. On another occassion, she created a gamma-powered weather shield around the whole Earth to deflect a planet-destroying blast from the sun. She redirected the full power of Sienna Blaze who's powers were strong enough to split the planet like a ripe melon. All of this, and I still haven't said it all. So, yeah, Storm is MUCH more powerful than Magneto. I don't know why you would bring that up against me when you know I can debunk it. Even Magneto himself has stated that Storm has the power to beat him, but she holds back.
Regarding TPG, what I said was Storm and TPG were Wakanda's two most powerful protectors back when she and T'challa were married.
That said, Storm should be VERY powerful and pitted against villains strong enough to challenge that power. A hero is only overpowered when the opposition is too weak to challenge them. Well, it depends on how you look at it. I don't see Storm as being overpowered as much as I see her being pitted against characters that have no business challenging her. The MU has villains of varying power levels ranging from characters to fight with the likes of Spiderman and Luke Cage all the way up to sparring partners for the likes of Silver Surfer, Thor...and even Galactus, etc. There is definitely a place for a hero as powerful as Storm.
Yeah, you stated that Storm would hurl Doomsday into orbit way back on the AOL boards.
For TPG, you stated that she should not have submitted to judgment regarding the marriage and she should have made that clear to TPG.
You just proved my point. You won't be happy if he writes her as anything less than an ultimate power.
I agree that Storm is immensely powerful but she is counterbalanced by being physically human. Unlike most powerhouses in those upper levels like Thor, Hyperion, Iron Man, she doesn't have heighten physical abilities. Even Magneto can use his powers to increase his physical abilities so He could go toe to toe with Colossus in a fist fight. Green Lantern is constantly shielded. Yes she can shield herself better than the Scarlett Witch Who apparently now In Storm 's class but it isn't equal to Thor 's body.
It is one of the things that keep her interesting.
Those scans have no credibility. Storm was able to defeat a Sentinel above New York City with a hurricane capable of leveling the whole city, yet her control was such that only the robot was hurt while leaving NYC unharmed. Storm has had this degree of control from the get-go as it happened in Uncanny 98. That issue wrote Storm down for Val.
In regards to the Storm/Doomsday thing, sounds like me. That sounds like an argument I would make proving Storm can beat Doomsday. Hmmm...you've got my creativity thinking on that now.
My stance has always been that just because Ororo is a mutant does not immediately or automatically negate the possibility that she really IS a Goddess. She took a white man's words as the TRUTH when he would know less about who she really is than she does.
Course, she won't read 'em anyway. So we'll just have to inform her of our opinions and allat on this Forum.
Oh yeah...I seriously do NOT get down with the general feeling that RH turned Ororo into a cheerleader for TChalla. There's a big difference between being down for your man and being a door mat for your man. Queen Ororo is nobody's door mat, and wasn't written that way. Cheerleaders don't stand down Iron Man, go toe to toe with Death, and rescue [ several times ] from serious extremis the person whom they are the helpless feckless second fiddle for...by overcoming foes that the lead guy didn't. Cheerleaders don't usher in the next Black Panther...and the first in 616 continuity living reigning FEMALE Black Panther...while bringing the Wakandan Council to heel, either.
Juss sayin.
Those scans have no credibility. Storm was able to defeat a Sentinel above New York City with a hurricane capable of leveling the whole city, yet her control was such that only the robot was hurt while leaving NYC unharmed. Storm has had this degree of control from the get-go as it happened in Uncanny 98. That issue wrote Storm down for Val.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
Thing is, there has already been an established precedence with Storm's character being devalued for him to look good. To be honest, racism is not the main reason why the Storm fans turned against the Storm/T'challa relationship. Personally, I agree with you that BOTH characters should be written in way that is true to themselves and both written well. Thing is, there is too much emotional baggage here for the time being. That's why I say wait about a year until T'challa (or Cyclops) shows up in her book for an issue or two as a guest-star to give the book every advantage of being successful. People are so angry about the Storm/T'challa thing right now that they are close-minded to it no matter how well it is done. Give them time. Let Storm shine in the way people are used to see her shine (but, this time, enhanced!). Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see. Instead, if you want to see a strong friendship between the two, let it happen gradually during year 2 of the series.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
Thing is, there has already been an established precedence with Storm's character being devalued for him to look good. To be honest, racism is not the main reason why the Storm fans turned against the Storm/T'challa relationship. Personally, I agree with you that BOTH characters should be written in way that is true to themselves and both written well. Thing is, there is too much emotional baggage here for the time being. That's why I say wait about a year until T'challa (or Cyclops) shows up in her book for an issue or two as a guest-star to give the book every advantage of being successful. People are so angry about the Storm/T'challa thing right now that they are close-minded to it no matter how well it is done. Give them time. Let Storm shine in the way people are used to see her shine (but, this time, enhanced!). Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see. Instead, if you want to see a strong friendship between the two, let it happen gradually during year 2 of the series.
I do understand that there are people with legit gripes about the way that Storm has been written and her past has been retconned. Specifically with EJD's stories in combination with specific books that RH wrote. There are legit differences here.
I think EJD did a MAGNIFICENT job with his [ imo WELL BEYOND OVERDUE VASTLY NEEDED MORE REALISTIC AND SUPERIOR IN EVERY WAY ] retelling. I jousted with two of our premier ladies...Princesa and Jenn...about this very series, IIRC. Neither was particularly enthused, but for different reasons. Jenn, IIRC, wasn't happy with the whole sex thing. Princesa and IIRC Rutog saw no need to retell the story with TChalla coming to Storm's rescue, rather than vice versa.
However.
Couple of big HOWEVERS.
The fact is, the entire X-Office has ALWAYS BEEN DISTINCTLY INHOSPITABLE TO BLACK MEN. So have many of their fans. If they held Black Panther in disregard, it's because MARVEL HELD BLACK PANTHER IN DISREGARD up until the arrival of the epic run of PRIEST. Period. Point blank. Had they known of who The Black Panther ACTUALLY is, and were they NOT inspired by racial animus, their behavior would change drastically once they became aware of just what a nearly unbeatable truly amazingly O.G. our TChalla really is.
The above comments are in no way speculative. Remember how Storm fans came over to wreck HEF in its previous incarnation? We engaged in many a zesty fiery debate which rather quickly and pleasantly evolved into genuine discussion...and that's how I met and became friends with the Oracle Of Ororo, our very own Rutog.
Now. The people braying against The Marriage and TChalla are THE SAME people who brayed against ANY BLACK PERSON PERIOD. These are THE SAME PEOPLE who INSIST that Ororo IS NOT BLACK but a "quiltwork of humanity". Not knowing how truly racist such a comment is, because Afrikans are literally the font and foundation...the thread from which any quiltwork of humanity must be crafted. All races can be must be and are drawn from the Afrikan root. No non-Afrikan can produce an Afrikan. So, simply by embracing her Blackness...and NO OTHER SCIENTIFICALLY FACTUAL WAY...would these most strident X-fans embrace also the entirety of humanity.
But they rabidly reject the notion that Storm's Afrikan race and heritage in fact means that she herself is Afrikan. In so doing, those who take that stance clearly expose their own unstinting, colossal racism. Those who support that stance do the same. There is no getting around or sugar coating this fact.
So what do we have here?
1. One. Marvel dissed Panther and made him someone that [ under McDuffy's pen...may he R.I.P....] was referred to by the whole of the MU in the same way that The Maestro had The Wizard refer to both Panther and Ororo:"...C-Listers at best...pretensions to relevancy...".
2. This whole pattern has been consistent in Marvel. The Black male hero...if there was one...was a distinct and distant second to the White males. Heroes AND name villains, for the most part. Falcon to Cap. TChalla to Cap. Everyone to Cap. Daredevil>TChalla. The standard pretty much is and was: White Male Hero>Black Male Hero. In short? Racism. For TChalla it began in earnest right after CJP and later RH were removed from the BP helm, and every attempt was made to tear down this newly risen superpowerful Black man. We saw it again with BLUE MARVEL and literally every time we see Afrikans are consistently portrayed as equal to, or superior in any way to, the previously lily White rank of MU A-Listers.
3. The X-Office and their supporters exceeded all others in their debasement of Black males, and did it regularly and often. Usually to great cries of titillation joy pleasure and happiness from their fans. Nowhere else do I recall a ex-cape couple having the woman snipe at the male with such savagery. Denigrating his sexual performance. Intimating that he was an abuser. Racing to exchange TChalla with The Troll. Sleeping with Namor. Leading an invasion force into the country she ruled as Queen. Murdering thousands of previously invincible Afrikans without a peep of retaliation until Hickman [ GOOOOOOO HICKMAN!! ] came along, and greeting these deaths of heroic innocents with snide racist remarks. Remarks that...as one of our legendary posters so ably emphasized...were deafening in their silence and conspicuous in their absence when Wakanda [ led by SHURI, not our TCHALLA ] finally launched just retribution vs Atlantis. Etc etc
Hopefully we are seeing that...over and above, under and below, surrounding and buttressing...whatever [ relatively minor ] legit issues that the genuine Storm Faithful have had. Differences we can respect. Some hated EJD's retcon of the meeting between Ororo and TChalla. Understandable. Some felt that Ororo was CONSISTENTLY portrayed as a cheerleader to TChalla. My response? Show the books that spawned your concerns, and...honestly...Storm was getting more quality face time vs bigger names in a bigger role doing bigger things and was being more prominently featured in bigger crossovers when she was with RH than she had been prior to being under his pen. Real talk.
The legit concerns are, in short, not that big [ although they should be satisfactorily addressed ] and the legit concerns are overwhelmed by the army of Goliaths riding the mastodons in the room.
The Racist Mastodon.
But moneyspider does bring up a good point: it does seem like all the white gods are shown to be legit, or at least uber-powerful, meanwhile the gods of other mythologies are seen as lesser for the most part.
I really hope they keep BP out of the "Storm" title for a while. This is a very hot button issue and I want the title to do well. Storm is a bigger character than Black Panther. There is too big a risk of her character being devalued to make him look good. If this happens, it will alienate readership from the book and there will be another internet uprising behind it reinforcing to Marvel to keep these characters apart.
That said, I think it would be nice if Ororo and T'challa were good friends, but its not an interaction that needs to occur in her title anytime soon. Give the book a chance and let it get some steam first before T'challa shows up for an issue or two...if he even shows.
Why risk her title with something like a Storm/BP reunion when so many of her fans who will be supporting the book HATE it? There is no point to prove in forcing something on the readership they don't want to see. All it will do is tick them off and alienate them ensuring the book's failure.
To me, the bottom line is the X-books don't have a problem putting Black Panther in their books when they want to trash him, but somehow we should NOT want him to show up when we want Greg Pak and other writers to write him well?
That may not be what you meant (and I don't really think that is what you mean), but that's kind of what it sounds like. It sounds like "if Black Panther is not getting outright trashed in an X-book, then Storm fans will be upset, and we shouldn't upset them, because we want Storm's ongoing book to do well."
So many of her fans are pssing me off and have been pissing me off for years over their biased attitudes against Black Panther that I really don't care what they want, because all those types of fans want is for no black man to appear in any of their books, especially when Storm is concerned.
I'm not interested in appeasing Storm's fans, the majority of whom need their heads examined.
And why would her character have to be "devalued" in order to make Black Panther look good? How about writers and editors make them BOTH look good, like professionals should? It doesn't have to be an either/or thing, and neither character has to look bad.
What Marvel should be doing (and should have been doing from the get-go) is making both characters shine, just like their original creators intended instead of turning Storm and Black Panther into an episode of Real Housewives or a reality show on VH1.
And if Marvel and fans keep wanting that, AND WON'T BE HAPPY AND WON'T SUPPORT THE BOOK IF BLACK PANTHER SHOWS UP IN IT AND IS WRITTEN AS RESPECTFULLY AS SHE IS, then both parties should and WILL be called out for their stupidity.
Hasn't Marvell catered to stupidity and racism enough??
Thing is, there has already been an established precedence with Storm's character being devalued for him to look good. To be honest, racism is not the main reason why the Storm fans turned against the Storm/T'challa relationship. Personally, I agree with you that BOTH characters should be written in way that is true to themselves and both written well. Thing is, there is too much emotional baggage here for the time being. That's why I say wait about a year until T'challa (or Cyclops) shows up in her book for an issue or two as a guest-star to give the book every advantage of being successful. People are so angry about the Storm/T'challa thing right now that they are close-minded to it no matter how well it is done. Give them time. Let Storm shine in the way people are used to see her shine (but, this time, enhanced!). Don't force things on the readership they don't want to see. Instead, if you want to see a strong friendship between the two, let it happen gradually during year 2 of the series.
I do understand that there are people with legit gripes about the way that Storm has been written and her past has been retconned. Specifically with EJD's stories in combination with specific books that RH wrote. There are legit differences here.
I think EJD did a MAGNIFICENT job with his [ imo WELL BEYOND OVERDUE VASTLY NEEDED MORE REALISTIC AND SUPERIOR IN EVERY WAY ] retelling. I jousted with two of our premier ladies...Princesa and Jenn...about this very series, IIRC. Neither was particularly enthused, but for different reasons. Jenn, IIRC, wasn't happy with the whole sex thing. Princesa and IIRC Rutog saw no need to retell the story with TChalla coming to Storm's rescue, rather than vice versa.
However.
Couple of big HOWEVERS.
The fact is, the entire X-Office has ALWAYS BEEN DISTINCTLY INHOSPITABLE TO BLACK MEN. So have many of their fans. If they held Black Panther in disregard, it's because MARVEL HELD BLACK PANTHER IN DISREGARD up until the arrival of the epic run of PRIEST. Period. Point blank. Had they known of who The Black Panther ACTUALLY is, and were they NOT inspired by racial animus, their behavior would change drastically once they became aware of just what a nearly unbeatable truly amazingly O.G. our TChalla really is.
The above comments are in no way speculative. Remember how Storm fans came over to wreck HEF in its previous incarnation? We engaged in many a zesty fiery debate which rather quickly and pleasantly evolved into genuine discussion...and that's how I met and became friends with the Oracle Of Ororo, our very own Rutog.
Now. The people braying against The Marriage and TChalla are THE SAME people who brayed against ANY BLACK PERSON PERIOD. These are THE SAME PEOPLE who INSIST that Ororo IS NOT BLACK but a "quiltwork of humanity". Not knowing how truly racist such a comment is, because Afrikans are literally the font and foundation...the thread from which any quiltwork of humanity must be crafted. All races can be must be and are drawn from the Afrikan root. No non-Afrikan can produce an Afrikan. So, simply by embracing her Blackness...and NO OTHER SCIENTIFICALLY FACTUAL WAY...would these most strident X-fans embrace also the entirety of humanity.
But they rabidly reject the notion that Storm's Afrikan race and heritage in fact means that she herself is Afrikan. In so doing, those who take that stance clearly expose their own unstinting, colossal racism. Those who support that stance do the same. There is no getting around or sugar coating this fact.
So what do we have here?
1. One. Marvel dissed Panther and made him someone that [ under McDuffy's pen...may he R.I.P....] was referred to by the whole of the MU in the same way that The Maestro had The Wizard refer to both Panther and Ororo:"...C-Listers at best...pretensions to relevancy...".
2. This whole pattern has been consistent in Marvel. The Black male hero...if there was one...was a distinct and distant second to the White males. Heroes AND name villains, for the most part. Falcon to Cap. TChalla to Cap. Everyone to Cap. Daredevil>TChalla. The standard pretty much is and was: White Male Hero>Black Male Hero. In short? Racism. For TChalla it began in earnest right after CJP and later RH were removed from the BP helm, and every attempt was made to tear down this newly risen superpowerful Black man. We saw it again with BLUE MARVEL and literally every time we see Afrikans are consistently portrayed as equal to, or superior in any way to, the previously lily White rank of MU A-Listers.
3. The X-Office and their supporters exceeded all others in their debasement of Black males, and did it regularly and often. Usually to great cries of titillation joy pleasure and happiness from their fans. Nowhere else do I recall a ex-cape couple having the woman snipe at the male with such savagery. Denigrating his sexual performance. Intimating that he was an abuser. Racing to exchange TChalla with The Troll. Sleeping with Namor. Leading an invasion force into the country she ruled as Queen. Murdering thousands of previously invincible Afrikans without a peep of retaliation until Hickman [ GOOOOOOO HICKMAN!! ] came along, and greeting these deaths of heroic innocents with snide racist remarks. Remarks that...as one of our legendary posters so ably emphasized...were deafening in their silence and conspicuous in their absence when Wakanda [ led by SHURI, not our TCHALLA ] finally launched just retribution vs Atlantis. Etc etc
Hopefully we are seeing that...over and above, under and below, surrounding and buttressing...whatever [ relatively minor ] legit issues that the genuine Storm Faithful have had. Differences we can respect. Some hated EJD's retcon of the meeting between Ororo and TChalla. Understandable. Some felt that Ororo was CONSISTENTLY portrayed as a cheerleader to TChalla. My response? Show the books that spawned your concerns, and...honestly...Storm was getting more quality face time vs bigger names in a bigger role doing bigger things and was being more prominently featured in bigger crossovers when she was with RH than she had been prior to being under his pen. Real talk.
The legit concerns are, in short, not that big [ although they should be satisfactorily addressed ] and the legit concerns are overwhelmed by the army of Goliaths riding the mastodons in the room.
The Racist Mastodon.
Wait....how is Storm more powerful in the moisture manipulation department than Iceman, if he (with just that powerset) was classified (semi-recently) as being an Omega Level Powered Mutant. While Storm with ALL her weather manipulation powers, wasn't? It doesn't add up that "she's more powerful than Iceman" in this regard. Especially when you see all the recent displays of his powers where he can create gargantuan sized ice behemoths/constructs, and instantly flash freeze entire warm areas to the point that the ice is as thick as it is in the North Pole.
When has Storm done anything remotely close to that?
Wait....how is Storm more powerful in the moisture manipulation department than Iceman, if he (with just that powerset) was classified (semi-recently) as being an Omega Level Powered Mutant. While Storm with ALL her weather manipulation powers, wasn't? It doesn't add up that "she's more powerful than Iceman" in this regard. Especially when you see all the recent displays of his powers where he can create gargantuan sized ice behemoths/constructs, and instantly flash freeze entire warm areas to the point that the ice is as thick as it is in the North Pole.
When has Storm done anything remotely close to that?
Storm has instantly flash frozen large areas as well. Storm can control moisture to the point where she can shape water droplets to isolate specific wavelengths of the EM spectrum via a specially crafted water lens. She can control ocean currents and also create sculptures out of ice. The reason I say Storm is much more powerful than Iceman is when she controls the weather, she is controlling heat and moisture in concert with a bunch of other forces he does not control like electrical fields and impulses, the EM field/energies, pressure gradients, etc. Storm has global and cosmic feats under her belt. Her powers have been compared with that of Dark Phoenix. This is a woman who has summoned the full power of millions of stars and planets and contained all of that energy inside of her body. The issue where she did that said it was an easy feat for her, too. So, when Storm is controlling weather on a continental scale, hemisphere scale or global scale (she's accomplished all of this), that means she is controlling the same things Iceman controls PLUS all of those other forces as well on that huge scale. Her powers are limited only by the force of her will and body, and her body is only a temporary limitation as she can potentially transcend her physical limitations and evolve into a true goddess. We have seen this happen twice in canon and she has commented that she can potentially evolve one day to a true goddess. Don't get me started on her indomitable will. I can go on and on about that. This woman even had the will to contain the essence of Eternity in her body, something that would have killed even the Silver Surfer had he attempted it. She has also been catagorized as an omega potential mutant. To me, "omega" lost any real meaning ever since Iceman got that label. With his powerset, it should be impossible for him to be classified as an omega mutant, but Marvel did it. Storm is much more powerful than he.
Wait....how is Storm more powerful in the moisture manipulation department than Iceman, if he (with just that powerset) was classified (semi-recently) as being an Omega Level Powered Mutant. While Storm with ALL her weather manipulation powers, wasn't? It doesn't add up that "she's more powerful than Iceman" in this regard. Especially when you see all the recent displays of his powers where he can create gargantuan sized ice behemoths/constructs, and instantly flash freeze entire warm areas to the point that the ice is as thick as it is in the North Pole.
When has Storm done anything remotely close to that?
Storm has instantly flash frozen large areas as well. Storm can control moisture to the point where she can shape water droplets to isolate specific wavelengths of the EM spectrum via a specially crafted water lens. She can control ocean currents and also create sculptures out of ice. The reason I say Storm is much more powerful than Iceman is when she controls the weather, she is controlling heat and moisture in concert with a bunch of other forces he does not control like electrical fields and impulses, the EM field/energies, pressure gradients, etc. Storm has global and cosmic feats under her belt. Her powers have been compared with that of Dark Phoenix. This is a woman who has summoned the full power of millions of stars and planets and contained all of that energy inside of her body. The issue where she did that said it was an easy feat for her, too. So, when Storm is controlling weather on a continental scale, hemisphere scale or global scale (she's accomplished all of this), that means she is controlling the same things Iceman controls PLUS all of those other forces as well on that huge scale. Her powers are limited only by the force of her will and body, and her body is only a temporary limitation as she can potentially transcend her physical limitations and evolve into a true goddess. We have seen this happen twice in canon and she has commented that she can potentially evolve one day to a true goddess. Don't get me started on her indomitable will. I can go on and on about that. This woman even had the will to contain the essence of Eternity in her body, something that would have killed even the Silver Surfer had he attempted it. She has also been catagorized as an omega potential mutant. To me, "omega" lost any real meaning ever since Iceman got that label. With his powerset, it should be impossible for him to be classified as an omega mutant, but Marvel did it. Storm is much more powerful than he.
First off, nice. That was a speedy response.
Secondly, have there been any panels in the last 10, 15, or 20 years that have shown that she can do any of what I mentioned about what Iceman can do or greater, on the regular? Creating sculptures isn't creating a walking skyscraper sized giant out of ice. Or has her strength cap been silently retconned and lowered to a more "realistic" level like Spiderman? Who has been able to pick up entire locomotives with ease in the past, but certainly can't do anything like that now? Which doesn't take away from the fact that he's still incredibly strong.
Lastly, she's never been classified as an Omega Level Mutant. Just a possible one. Which wasn't followed up years later, she was arguably stronger and next to Bobby.
I mean, even Magneto has been able to fully shield himself from the Dark Phoenix's blasts in the past. While Storm was flatout fricasseed.
Magneto's power levels are a joke compared to Storm's. I already went through that on an earlier page on this thread in my response to KIP. That said, Magneto has no credibility. It has become common practice at Marvel to pit Magneto against stronger character than himself and then devalue them by adjusting their power levels downwards to give him the win. Since you brought up Magneto/Phoenix, I will give you an example of this with the two very same characters. When Phoenix first came out, she battled against Firelord, a Herald of Galactus, and beat him by using blasts backed by the power of stars. A few issues later, when she fought Magneto, her powers were scaled down to only rival Xavier's and Magneto beat her (barely) by tapping into the geomagnetic fields. He was barely able to overpower her. Had she been written at the levels she was at when she fought Firelord, she would have been tapping into stars and which is a MUCH more powerful power source than the Earth's EM fields Magneto was tapping into. Notice, Phoenix was much more powerful than Magneto, yet she was pitted against Magneto anyway and her powers were scaled down. In that same issue where Magneto overpowered Phoenix, he also fought Storm. Magneto admitted in that story that Storm would have beaten him if she did not hold back. Storm herself stated that she was afraid of going all out against Magneto because if she did and lost control of her attack, she would kill him and she did not want to kill him.
All that said, it doesn't matter if Storm has been labelled officially an omega mutant or not. She already fulfills the definition of one. She has the potential to wield unlimited power. Iceman, on the other hand, has the label, but it makes no sense with him. An omega mutant, by its original conception, is supposed to be a mutant who can potentially evolve and wield power to match and beat characters like Galactus. To say Iceman can potentially do that with the kind of power set he has is a joke. Lobdell was such a hack of a writer.
Magneto's power levels are a joke compared to Storm's. I already went through that on an earlier page on this thread in my response to KIP. That said, Magneto has no credibility. It has become common practice at Marvel to pit Magneto against stronger character than himself and then devalue them by adjusting their power levels downwards to give him the win. Since you brought up Magneto/Phoenix, I will give you an example of this with the two very same characters. When Phoenix first came out, she battled against Firelord, a Herald of Galactus, and beat him by using blasts backed by the power of stars. A few issues later, when she fought Magneto, her powers were scaled down to only rival Xavier's and Magneto beat her (barely) by tapping into the geomagnetic fields. He was barely able to overpower her. Had she been written at the levels she was at when she fought Firelord, she would have been tapping into stars and which is a MUCH more powerful power source than the Earth's EM fields Magneto was tapping into. Notice, Phoenix was much more powerful than Magneto, yet she was pitted against Magneto anyway and her powers were scaled down. In that same issue where Magneto overpowered Phoenix, he also fought Storm. Magneto admitted in that story that Storm would have beaten him if she did not hold back. Storm herself stated that she was afraid of going all out against Magneto because if she did and lost control of her attack, she would kill him and she did not want to kill him.
All that said, it doesn't matter if Storm has been labelled officially an omega mutant or not. She already fulfills the definition of one. She has the potential to wield unlimited power. Iceman, on the other hand, has the label, but it makes no sense with him. An omega mutant, by its original conception, is supposed to be a mutant who can potentially evolve and wield power to match and beat characters like Galactus. To say Iceman can potentially do that with the kind of power set he has is a joke. Lobdell was such a hack of a writer.
I was going to comment on the first paragraph, but then I read the bold. Which is where the problem lies with your line of thought. She doesn't fulfill the definition of an Omega, because each time that it's been time to define her as one, Marvel has said "Hell no she's not!" And they (Marvel) deals out the cards and decide what's official/canon, whether you like it or not. Since Storm isn't real and doesn't write herself, unless what you claim is actually stated on the page, then it's little more than irrelevant Storm Fanfiction. You can't just make up labels for her and grant her made up feats because she's done something that's loosely associated with the requirements. Because by that logic you could say that "Since Storm is somewhat good at H2H, that she is on the same level as Black Widow, Gamora, Karnak, Iron Fist, Punisher, or Elektra." Which is preposterous as she's never been shown to be on that level, or has been given a label/title that shows her as being up there.
And Galactus isn't Omega Level, so that's a bad example. Because you're wrong. He's above Omega at Cosmic level. Right up there with other god characters like Blackheart, Odin, C'thon, and Shuma-Gorath. Iceman, has been officially labeled as Omega, while Storm still lags behind. This is canon. Storm Fanfiction be darned.
One part I have seen in the definition of an Omega level mutant is that using their powers has no negative impact on their body. That is not true for Storm. Her power had had negative impacts on her health. The Rogue Storm incident nearly killed her. Didn't we see the results of over using her power in X-Men the End? (Can't remember. )
However since this is a made up word, the definition could change depending on who is writing. That is probably why Vulcan is claimed to be above an Omega level mutant.
One should note that being an Omega level mutant doesn't mean powerful. Mr. Immortal is an Omega level and his only power is that he keeps coming back to life. Not exactly powerful there.
Similar to Geoff John's (who writes a great BP btw) or Bendis (who doesn't) , McDuffie is a name and brings his own audience.
Similar to Geoff John's (who writes a great BP btw) or Bendis (who doesn't) , McDuffie is a name and brings his own audience.
Geoff John wrote BP? I freakin love GJ!! When did he write BP?
Similar to Geoff John's (who writes a great BP btw) or Bendis (who doesn't) , McDuffie is a name and brings his own audience.
Geoff John wrote BP? I freakin love GJ!! When did he write BP?
During his short Avengers run( Red Zone )
I know it's gotten the stamp of approval by others but all I know Johns from is his GL and Flash stuff and as a Kyle and Wally fan his writing of them didn't endear himself to me
Is she still with Logan or not because if she is I'm not spending a dime on this book.You should see the panel of Logan saying the classic line of "you're too good for me" despite the fact that I slept with you.
You should see the panel of Logan saying the classic line of "you're too good for me" despite the fact that I slept with you.
I'd like to see some African gods and goddesses show up in her book...Shango and Oya, for starters.
Shango is the Yoruba god of fire, thunder and lightning, and Oya is the Yoruba warrior goddess connected to wind, lightning, fertility, fire and magic.
Oya:
([url]http://i668.photobucket.com/albums/vv42/moneyspider1/Oya.jpg[/url])
Shango:
([url]http://i668.photobucket.com/albums/vv42/moneyspider1/Shango.jpg[/url])
You should see the panel of Logan saying the classic line of "you're too good for me" despite the fact that I slept with you.
"You're too good for me but I hit it anyway LOLOLOL BYE BITCH!"
(might not be an exact quote)
I noticed in the latest solicits of one of his ten books they were "finally" going on a date and I'm thinking I'm not here for this bullish.
I'd like to see some African gods and goddesses show up in her book...Shango and Oya, for starters.
Shango is the Yoruba god of fire, thunder and lightning, and Oya is the Yoruba warrior goddess connected to wind, lightning, fertility, fire and magic.
Oya:
([url]http://i668.photobucket.com/albums/vv42/moneyspider1/Oya.jpg[/url])
Shango:
([url]http://i668.photobucket.com/albums/vv42/moneyspider1/Shango.jpg[/url])
In my instructionals, I used these very images to show specifically how the knowledge brought about by our African spiritual practices has the most profound impact on our martial arts arsenal, technique application, tactics, strategies, and much more. Much more. I specifically point out that lack of knowledge of the orixas will wholesale prevent you/us/whoever from practicing African martial arts like Kipura...miscalled Capoeira.
Devalued powers? Of course. She has the capabilities of the gods but not considered a goddess. How is Thor a god but she’s not?
..............
Because being a god in the Marvel Universe has nothing to do with power. Mostly it is about what species you are born into and a mystical nature. Since both her parents are human and her powers are science based then she isn't. Of course there have been times in Marvel where they say that Thor and the rest really aren't gods either, at least not in the religious sense.
Hulk, even Spider - Man is more powerful than some of the Asgradians, but even Galactus isn't a god.
Devalued powers? Of course. She has the capabilities of the gods but not considered a goddess. How is Thor a god but she’s not?
..............
Because being a god in the Marvel Universe has nothing to do with power. Mostly it is about what species you are born into and a mystical nature. Since both her parents are human and her powers are science based then she isn't. Of course there have been times in Marvel where they say that Thor and the rest really aren't gods either, at least not in the religious sense.
Hulk, even Spider - Man is more powerful than some of the Asgradians, but even Galactus isn't a god.
Storm is headed to the Caribbean where Yoruba is still heavily practiced, along with Vudun (Voodoo). She may be viewed as a witch or a sorceress, by the locals.
The X-writers may choose to suppress her character but run into dangerous territory when they suppress an entire cultural belief system. Imagine Storm being worshipped as a black goddess for & by black people. That’s way too much for fan-boys to handle. I never thought it was racism... just culturalism, classism, mutualism. It’s still an “ism” & isms are usually followed by discrimination.
Just so you guys know (and/or remember), there are african gods that exist in the Marvel Universe other than Bast and his relatives ([url]http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/godsegpt.htm[/url]).
Introducing The Vodu ([url]http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/africg.htm[/url])!
Today, Voodoo has been laced with dozens of deviations & down-right corruptions. That’s why modern Voodoo is full of “Mojo-bags” Spells, potions, shrunken heads, voodoo dolls & is considered African witch-craft. I believe, these corruptions were intentionally added (to the belief system) to further demonize African Culture.
^^
Agreed. All religions have this issue.
Wow, just, wow! Amazing graphics & concepts. I keep forgetting how spectacular these video games have become.
so bad but yet so good
([url]http://media.blizzard.com/d3/media/artwork/artwork-witch-doctor02-large.jpg[/url])
Have we seen any artwork from the book yet?
Anyone have good samples of the artist's work?
Have we seen any artwork from the book yet?
Anyone have good samples of the artist's work?
[url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=53210[/url] ([url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=53210[/url])
It’s not about big action & emotionality. It’s about intensity & creativity.
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^ this or that?
It’s not about big action & emotionality. It’s about intensity & creativity.
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_liycu5Nfwp1qe6an0o1_1280.jpg[/url])
^ this or that?
NOT IF I BEAT YOU TO IT!!
You realize that those beautiful sistahs are reading this post and will slap the teeth out of either or both of us if we came at them and said anything, right? Lol.
Mmm-mm!
([url]http://media.ign.com/boardfaces/54.gif[/url])♥♥♥♥♥♥♥~~~♥
I'll take 'em all! ;D
Acceptable [url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url] ([url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url])
Acceptable [url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url] ([url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url])
Acceptable what?
I used to think Forge was afro Cuban. I'd rather seen Storm with a woman but Forge would be acceptable to most.
I used to think Forge was afro Cuban. I'd rather seen Storm with a woman but Forge would be acceptable to most.
Why would you rather see Storm with a woman.
I think Storm is definitely bisexual and this isn't me projecting its always been part of her presentation. Even Hudlin shaded her and Yuriko.
Just like a Storm fan to throw shade on another female that doesn't inhabit the x-world
Talking about Rut throwing Carol Danvers under the bus, Rut's thirst is very strong
I tend to confuse those two.I think Storm is definitely bisexual and this isn't me projecting its always been part of her presentation. Even Hudlin shaded her and Yuriko.
You mean Yukio. Yuriko is a different character, entirely.
Acceptable [url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url] ([url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url])
Talking about Rut throwing Carol Danvers under the bus, Rut's thirst is very strong
Storm ain't iconic, she ain't a flagship, she ain't a goddess
She's a mutant aka a X-Man and when Marvel tried to move her beyond that "fans" like yourself threw a hissy fit and Marvel stopped and she became a non factor as they went with other X-Men. No one else is to blame, not Carol, not T'Challa, not Wanda, not Jen Walters, not Elektra only those who wanted the same old stuff.
Acceptable [url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url] ([url]http://www.comicbookresources.com/prev_img.php?pid=22766&disp=ilib&oty=1&oid=53490[/url])
Absolutely. FAR better to be with a man who left you sobbing on a floor while he stood over you, berating you. At least he's not black!
Double damn triple damn true. I mean...I hated what Forge did to Storm. She should stuff a sleet and hail storm up his native parts.It's funny you say that about Storm but at the same time she rarely had any appearances outside of the x-verse until she got married. Showing up with the X-Men don't count
You are DEAD ON correct. But. They Tea Party'd RH for bringing Ororo to the forefront again.
Storm ain't iconic, she ain't a flagship, she ain't a goddess
She's a mutant aka a X-Man and when Marvel tried to move her beyond that "fans" like yourself threw a hissy fit and Marvel stopped and she became a non factor as they went with other X-Men. No one else is to blame, not Carol, not T'Challa, not Wanda, not Jen Walters, not Elektra only those who wanted the same old stuff.
That said, Storm's role is stepping up. She's being primed to take Wolverine's place when he dies in Wolverine and the X-Men, she's getting her own solo and she's a member of "Amazing X-Men" authored by Chris Yost who has a great love for the character and writes her well. She went through a slump, but she's coming out of it.A 30+ year slump?
QuoteThat said, Storm's role is stepping up. She's being primed to take Wolverine's place when he dies in Wolverine and the X-Men, she's getting her own solo and she's a member of "Amazing X-Men" authored by Chris Yost who has a great love for the character and writes her well. She went through a slump, but she's coming out of it.A 30+ year slump?
When I said that Storm is really Marvel's top female, I made the statement because she is their most recognizable female character to the world at large. Marvel may try and promote Carol Danvers or somebody else, but the everyday person would know Storm way before they would recognize the others.
As a side note, one thing Greg Pak said in an interview that got me excited was he proclaimed Storm to be the most powerful female character in Marvel. I just thought it was awesome that he felt that way. :)
QuoteThat said, Storm's role is stepping up. She's being primed to take Wolverine's place when he dies in Wolverine and the X-Men, she's getting her own solo and she's a member of "Amazing X-Men" authored by Chris Yost who has a great love for the character and writes her well. She went through a slump, but she's coming out of it.A 30+ year slump?
When I said that Storm is really Marvel's top female, I made the statement because she is their most recognizable female character to the world at large. Marvel may try and promote Carol Danvers or somebody else, but the everyday person would know Storm way before they would recognize the others.
As a side note, one thing Greg Pak said in an interview that got me excited was he proclaimed Storm to be the most powerful female character in Marvel. I just thought it was awesome that he felt that way. :)
I wonder if Black Widow is now more recognizable after the Avengers, Iron Man and Cap movies and cartoons than Storm. If there is a premiere female hero in Marvel, it is Black Widow, not Captain Marvel or Storm. After all, Black Widow became actually got a team-up animated movie; a higher profile than Storm ever had. (And for some reason Punisher is being pushed in these animated movies too; first teaming up with Iron Man (and Black Widow is in that animated video too, and now he team up with Black Widow.) She's so popular, there is talk of a solo movie for her.
[url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url] ([url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url])
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Oh giddy Storm is fighting African militias again. Next arc she'll fight a possessed character from the shadow king.
Oh giddy Storm is fighting African militias again. Next arc she'll fight a possessed character from the shadow king.
Oh giddy Storm is fighting African militias again. Next arc she'll fight a possessed character from the shadow king.
In real life, one of the major issues in the Black community has to do with Black women complaining about how Black men don't respect them. There is a lot of merit to this as well. Indeed, many Black women are now dating White men because of this and are being treated better by White men in those relationships than the Black men treated them when they dated Blacks. I hope we are not seeing a microcosm of that here. I hope this is not the mentality being shown by some of you (not all of you), but its starting to look that way.
Actually, she's in the Caribbean, not Africa. Secondly, you (and the others) had no problems with Storm fighting rogue African militants when BP was trying to get her to marry him, but now, all of a sudden, you do. Stop with the double standards, guys. This is getting old.
Seriously, Storm and the Black Panther broke up. You people are complaining about all the shots taken at T'challa after the break up, yet Storm was treated WORSE at the beginning of the whole project to bring the two characters together and you guys have no problems with that.Again why are you bringing BP apart of the discussion? He has nothing to do with this. You're reaching.
In real life, one of the major issues in the Black community has to do with Black women complaining about how Black men don't respect them. There is a lot of merit to this as well. Indeed, many Black women are now dating White men because of this and are being treated better by White men in those relationships than the Black men treated them when they dated Blacks. I hope we are not seeing a microcosm of that here. I hope this is not the mentality being shown by some of you (not all of you), but its starting to look that way.What in the hell? Now you're talking about BP and then suddenly "black women leave black men" because how they are treated? Isn't based on the choices some of those women made? Don’t bother trying to make up mess out of your ass as you come along like what you are doing now.
Lets put things in perspective, the shots T'challa took after the marriage was done is NOTHING compared to the way Storm was disrespected at the beginning of the marriage project. Some of you on here (Black men, at that) are even hoping for Storm to be humiliated by a White woman in the relationship department concerning Wolverine which totally flies in the face of the rhetoric you guys are spewing here...which makes it just that, rhetoric. So, let me get it straight, its okay for Storm to be disrespected because she is a Black woman, but not T'challa because he is a man?
Most of you guys on here are simply trying to hide behind race issues on this. Its just a stick you try and use to attack Marvel for breaking up Storm and T'challa. Stop being pretenders on this. If you were real about your "concern" in the treatment of Black characters, you would have shown this same outrage when Storm was being disrespected in that Dickey mini and everything. I mean, what Dickey basically said in his mini in having Ororo and T'challa have sex as children is that Black girls are whores. He glorified this in his story and portrayed it as being something epic. This is made worse by the fact Storm was 12 and T'challa 16 in that abominable mini. That story also devalued Storm in many other ways as well. To top all of this off, Dickey didn't do this to just any Black female character, but a Black woman who was put on a pedestal even above her White female counterparts for many years by the writer who wrote the original Storm/T'challa story. Storm was untouchable and almost beyond mortal men in the way she was originally portrayed. I remember an e-mail I got from Claremont years ago during the whole "Invasion Arc" in X-Treme X-Men where Khan wanted to marry Storm. CC said to me" What's a girl to do? This man likes her, but she has no interest in him. Problem with pairing Storm in a relationship is nobody is good enough for her." See how she was put up on a pedestal? And then, Dickey did this thing in the mini. No outrage on the part of many of you about any of this who are complaining about stuff now. Also, there are a few examples early on in the marriage where Storm lost her voice. She lost that indomitable, independent spirit that is her trademark. Of course, some of these issues got better over time. The true victim of the whole thing is Storm, not T'challa as the atrocities visited upon her character were much worse than this pettiness about her making unflattering comments about him after the annulment.
Just by going through this man's website; the books he writes has a tendency to deal with sex, cheating, and the drama that comes with it in some form or fashion. SMH. I haven't touched the book when I heard the announcement. Still makes me wonder how in the hell he got a glyph award
Im still trying to understand how a writer whom is known to write the "hood dramas" was even allowed to write the storm mini?
Personally, I think its a good thing that the two were broken up as her character was being hurt by the marriage. She was being held back A LOT. Don't wanna except this? Try this on for size, even when T'challa was put out of commission by Dr. Doom, it was Shuri who got the shine instead of Storm. In other words, Storm played second fiddle to a third string character. She would have continued to play second fiddle in this book, too, as the precedence had been established for this with the Shuri thing. I mean, Shuri? Really? There was a lot of potential with this marriage, but it was screwed up. That's just reality.
Finally, Storm is getting her own ongoing. Finally, she has the opportunity to shine like never before. Also, she is going to fight White characters in her book and not only Blacks, so its not a slight on Blacks that she is fighting dark-skinned characters in her title. Get over it. This book is a good thing and something that should be supported. If you really cared about Black characters, you people should be rooting for a well-written, successful book about the premier Black character in comicbook history. Black Panther has Black villains in his rogues gallery (Killmonger, Achebe anyone), but Storm can't have Black sparring partners?Read my point of buying black characters that isn’t from marvel earlier.
Did the Storm/BP marriage need to end? The answer is a loud and resounding "YES!". Do I like the way the marriage was ended? No. However, you guys are getting petty. I mean, you make a mountain out of a mole hill. Take for instance what the Amazing X-Men Annual that came out earlier this month where Storm said she did not want or need T'challa's help to deal with a personal, family matter. You guys got all up in arms over that and overreacted. I already gave my counter to that with the T'challa/Doom situation where he told Storm not to interfere in that fight and also showed where Storm did the same thing to the X-Men when she confronted Candra in X-Men issues 60-61. However, even barring those facts, to get up in arms like you guys did because she said she didn't want or need T'challa's help was petty as that pales in comparison to the disrespect Storm's character endured on several different occasions.
Also, she is iconic. I don't care what anybody says. The X-Men books are Marvel's biggest book and Storm is the undisputed first lady of the X. She is large and in charge.Emma, Jean, Jubliee, Rogue, Pixie, hell even Magik.
Most of you guys on here are simply trying to hide behind race issues on this.
Its just a stick you try and use to attack Marvel for breaking up Storm and T'challa. Stop being pretenders on this. If you were real about your "concern" in the treatment of Black characters, you would have shown this same outrage when Storm was being disrespected in that Dickey mini and everything.
I mean, what Dickey basically said in his mini in having Ororo and T'challa have sex as children is that Black girls are whores.
The X-Men books are Marvel's biggest book and Storm is the undisputed first lady of the X. She is large and in charge.
Rut...you like Storm, looking forward to the book...enjoy it. Personally I like what I like and don't give a flying fcccc what folks think that aren't doing anything for me. It's really not that deep. Ill probably give it a chance but cot damn.
Rut...you like Storm, looking forward to the book...enjoy it. Personally I like what I like and don't give a flying fcccc what folks think that aren't doing anything for me. It's really not that deep. Ill probably give it a chance but cot damn.
Princesa,
The post was not directed at you. I made sure to say "some of you guys". You are not one of the people I was referring to. Regarding the other post you made, I'm going to say this and let it go: To me, one of the best kept secrets of the Black community is that Black woman. There is no woman in the world that is as nurturing, strong and sacrificing (where family is concerned) as that confident, strong Christian Black woman. While you have good women in every race, that none compares to a special Black woman. This is my opinion on the matter and it is fact as far as I am concerned. I am not interested in debating it because I am right. Case closed. I say this because you mentioned in your post "White men/White women". While there are many good Black men out there as well, however, there is a problem in the community with quite a few Black men not showing Black women the respect they deserve. Its a huge enough problem that it is a big concern for many Black women. I'm merely pointing out a parallel here between real life and what appears to be going on here. Nobody that is hating on Storm now was hating on Panther when Storm was being disrespected way back when to prop him up. As a huge Storm fan, I didn't hate him either. I blamed the writing and just hoped things got better. Now, if a person is excited about Storm getting a shot at having her own book and wants to express that on this board, there is a faction of people here who want to ridicule you for it. Again, some people, not everyone. This is what I am getting at. If people don't want Storm to have her own book or if they are a hater of the character, why come to a thread about the book just to hate on her and hate on the title? This is not the thread for that.
I don't know how to multi-quote people to respond to many different posts, so I'll respond to some of the points right now on this post.
First off, I did not bring up BP in this discussion. Others did when they posted scans of the BP/Storm fight in response to the preview pages from the upcoming "Storm" issue I presented. After that, it was followed by the same old rhetoric about the "X-offices don't respect Black men because Storm is fighting some Black criminals in her first issue and she punched BP in the face." What I am talking about is hypocrisy. People are inserting race into the break up between Storm and T'challa talking about how he is getting the shaft because he is a Black man and he is being disrespected as a Black man. This is a position that is tenuous at best, to be frank. The sale numbers of the BP book were on a sharp decline, Storm was made to play second fiddle to a third string character in the book when Shuri took over and as a result of poor characterization of Storm that took place at the beginning of the whole ordeal, many of her fanbase were very resentful of the marriage. Her role in the title was declining and her character held back. The marriage needed to end. I don't think anyone here disputes that the way the marriage ended was bad, however, to always insert race into anything having to do with Storm's book in a negative way to victimize Black men is tired and old. The hypocrisy comes in when these same passionate feelings/arguments were not made when Storm truly was being disrespected in many ways early on yet these same people were oblivious to that and offered praise for it when it happened. If they are going to keep pushing this racial thing with Black Panther, then I'm gonna call them on that...especially when they are bringing this negativity to a thread that is supposed to be an uplifting thread about Storm's upcoming book.
Either you're one of the "new blacks" or you're white. Either way, I think it's pretty safe to say that most of us here don't give 1/64th of a single f*ck what you think about our so-called racism. What the f*ck do you know about any of us, anyway?
If STORM is the first lady of the X, I can't imagine how horrible the portrayal of the other X-Women are. Being the first lady of the X is like being the bottom bitch in a stable of whores. Is anybody even talking about this mini? Has it even come out? I haven't heard one thing about it.
The Storm ONGOING title (not mini) will be out July 27th.
In response to Storm not being iconic: Ororo is probably the most iconic woman from the Marvel Universe. We are used to seeing her as a warring character (even the name has a certain ring to it, "Storm"). However, her origins place her as a bringer of life in Africa rather than a violent warrior. ~Greg Pak
BAM!
There has been A LOT of hype about this book on the internet. Here is an interview with Pak on the Storm book that just recently came out: http://marvel.com/files/podcasts/mcom_this_week_marvel_now_storm.mp3 (http://marvel.com/files/podcasts/mcom_this_week_marvel_now_storm.mp3)
Between 10:15 and 10:30 on the interview link, he states that Storm has the power to go toe-to-toe with any of Marvel's big guns. I don't care what any of you haters have to say, this man is singing my song and I am going to buy this book. Its going to rock and if you don't buy it, you'll just miss it.
Regarding the first thing you said, actually, I'm not a "new Black" as I've been Black all my life. I am the epitome of Blackness and you would do well to show some respect. You are probably still trying to find your way while I have grown up with the council of wise elders making me wise. When I speak on the subject, you should close your mouth, take out some pencil and paper and write down the words of wisdom as I impart them as you marvel at my awesome insights so you can grow out of your foolishness. I just scanned through the parts of my post that you responded to. I did not read your responses to most of them save the two that I've posted here. I did that because you are obviously disagreeing with me on what I said based on your opening response to me. There was no need to read your retorts since I am right in what I said which makes you wrong. You should be trying to learn from me all about Blackness because there is nothing you can tell me on the subject. That said, you obviously missed the jist of what I said by singling out the quote you responded to with your opening jab.
You're a hard-headed, stubborn person, but I'm in it for the long haul. Stick with me, Maxine, and one day you, too, will be wise. Educating you is hard work, but somebody's gotta do it.
tl;dr
You're a hard-headed, stubborn person
, but I'm in it for the long haul. Stick with me, Maxine, and one day you, too, will be wise. Educating you is hard work, but somebody's gotta do it.
Which is partly why she's the most "iconic" woman in the MU. Storm is "safe" for the readership.
Which is partly why she's the most "iconic" woman in the MU. Storm is "safe" for the readership.
And why the public was so enraged when she started f*cking a black man. It sullied her in their eyes. Rutting with some dude in a locker room to subconscious stick it to your ex - now THAT'S class.
I don't know how to multi-quote people to respond to many different posts, so I'll respond to some of the points right now on this post.No you caught feelings and got mad it is what is. You can sit here and pretend that "I didnt bring up BP" even though in your post after my quote you talked BP numerous of times. Next your so called "facts" about black relationships comes out. As for the sales decline and the so called second fiddle who was at fault again? All I am seeing so far is your whining in why Storm wasn't in charge to possibly become BP herself.
First off, I did not bring up BP in this discussion. Others did when they posted scans of the BP/Storm fight in response to the preview pages from the upcoming "Storm" issue I presented. After that, it was followed by the same old rhetoric about the "X-offices don't respect Black men because Storm is fighting some Black criminals in her first issue and she punched BP in the face." What I am talking about is hypocrisy. People are inserting race into the break up between Storm and T'challa talking about how he is getting the shaft because he is a Black man and he is being disrespected as a Black man. This is a position that is tenuous at best, to be frank. The sale numbers of the BP book were on a sharp decline, Storm was made to play second fiddle to a third string character in the book when Shuri took over and as a result of poor characterization of Storm that took place at the beginning of the whole ordeal, many of her fanbase were very resentful of the marriage. Her role in the title was declining and her character held back. The marriage needed to end. I don't think anyone here disputes that the way the marriage ended was bad, however, to always insert race into anything having to do with Storm's book in a negative way to victimize Black men is tired and old. The hypocrisy comes in when these same passionate feelings/arguments were not made when Storm truly was being disrespected in many ways early on yet these same people were oblivious to that and offered praise for it when it happened. If they are going to keep pushing this racial thing with Black Panther, then I'm gonna call them on that...especially when they are bringing this negativity to a thread that is supposed to be an uplifting thread about Storm's upcoming book.
Which is partly why she's the most "iconic" woman in the MU. Storm is "safe" for the readership.
And why the public was so enraged when she started f*cking a black man. It sullied her in their eyes. Rutting with some dude in a locker room to subconscious stick it to your ex - now THAT'S class.
They were also enraged because "she and said black man had no prior romantic history and fell in love quickly". Unlike the now favored Forge. Who isn't a Native American that is always drawn to look like a 100% white guy, and who she had a long history with/spent a lot of issues with prior to their falling in....oh wait.
Oh giddy Storm is fighting African militias again. Next arc she'll fight a possessed character from the shadow king.
"Epitome of Blackness"
Wow. That has got to be in the list of ways not to build any good will.
Nevermind telling a black woman to "show some respect" and "shut her mouth". For someone talking about treasuring black women and how "some of us" are misogynist hypocrites, that's a very bad look.
"Epitome of Blackness"
Wow. That has got to be in the list of ways not to build any good will.
Nevermind telling a black woman to "show some respect" and "shut her mouth". For someone talking about treasuring black women and how "some of us" are misogynist hypocrites, that's a very bad look.
I used to think Forge was afro Cuban. I'd rather seen Storm with a woman but Forge would be acceptable to most.
Never mind Black males, we haven't seen Storm in a friendship with any Black females since
the Stevey Hunter days 30 friggin years ago.
And since Stevey was more Kitty's friend, you could argue that she shouldn't even count.
Storm's realtionships with Black folks period outside of the Black Panther series, has been her saving hapless tribes folk from menacing Warlords. Even the recent Xmen annual stuck to this pattern.
Storm only returns to Africa to save her relatives who are tribesfolk (there are cities in Kenya) from a serial murderer with a grudge.
Male or Female, Storm in the Xbooks can only save other Black folk or beat them up. They aren't allowed to be her peers, or friends or lovers.
Bishop was retconned into being Australian, so the only countering evidence is Stevey Hunter, a 30 year old character who no longer appears in the Xbooks and Gentle, a sparsely appearing character who has been in outright limbo since Schism started.
People who care about how Black characters are portrayed in media might not have much to look forward to
with a Storm book.
Storm herself doesn't count, that is almost the whole point of her now.
Well she did have dinner at a restaurant with Misty Knight (who I'm indifferent towards, at best), Colleen Wing, and Jean Grey....one time.
Other than that, drawing a blank.
Well she did have dinner at a restaurant with Misty Knight (who I'm indifferent towards, at best), Colleen Wing, and Jean Grey....one time.
Other than that, drawing a blank.
Who remembers the time when Cecelia Reyes addressed Ororo as "Sista" only to have Ororo inform her that she was NOT her sista, sister or any such?
Cece wasn't "family material" as far as patchwork quilt Storm was concerned.
Which is partly why she's the most "iconic" woman in the MU. Storm is "safe" for the readership.
And why the public was so enraged when she started f*cking a black man. It sullied her in their eyes. Rutting with some dude in a locker room to subconscious stick it to your ex - now THAT'S class.
They were also enraged because "she and said black man had no prior romantic history and fell in love quickly". Unlike the now favored Forge. Who isn't a Native American that is always drawn to look like a 100% white guy, and who she had a long history with/spent a lot of issues with prior to their falling in....oh wait.
As much as Rutog seems to be going on some inane tangents and comes off a bit delusional, In his defense Maxine did say some pretty hardcore things to him...it's her choice and style but wishing violence on dude and cursing at him might be considered a pretty bad look too...not that she cares or even should. Do you.
That said, though she doesn't know it, I actually like her though we are in disagreement on the idea of supporting Storm's book.
I can have some fun while I'm at it poking at the hornet's nest and getting a tirade out of her while making light of what she says through selective reading of her posts.
Ororo as written for much of her existence (pre-Christopher Priest, Reginald Hudlin and Dwayne McDuffie) has always been portrayed as being "above" her innate Africaness because most of the X-writer who've chronicled her exploits have mostly been obsessed with hyping up her exotic mutant status above everything else.
The fact that every other prominent X-man's heritage and ethnic background has been celebrated whilst Storm' has been all but buried, is an irony that's obviously lost on the singular imbecile posting in this forum who finds it convenient to run his mouth about people "hiding behind race" to point out the clear racial agenda that Storm's character is being used to push in the X-books.
Ororo was a joke before Reginald Hudlin introduced her into the Black Panther mythos and she's now an even bigger joke since being returned to the X-book segregationist ghetto.
All day, every day.
([url]http://i46.tinypic.com/25f12ra.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i48.tinypic.com/w22hxz.jpg[/url])
It's like...Storm is what white people think elegant black people should be. They think it's a compliment, the way they depict her. Kind of like when white people talk about how articulate they are. You know they mean well, but it still bugs like hell.
For the rest of you, I've been holding onto some knowledge for quite some time that I have not divulged. Of all the characters Storm has established bonds with, the Black Panther ranks like second or third on Pak's list as his favorite Storm bond. I think the Storm/Kitty relationship was his absolute favorite. He also likes the character of Black Panther. He's not going to "disrespect" him. Many of you guys are so negative and so full of anger that it boggles the mind. You're knocking on a book that hasn't even come out yet, wow!
[url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url] ([url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url])
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That's what I meant when I said I liked you. You have entertainment value. Nothing else.
The last thing I'm going to do is sit here and go full out against a female. Its not very masculine and its not worth it even if you were a man.
Seriously, you're wound so tight emotionally its a wonder you don't have high blood pressure or that you can actually function day to day with all of this emotional stuff you have going on. Its gotta be holding you back in life from focusing on some positive things you could do to better yourself in life.
That said, in real life, I wouldn't have much to do with you. I prefer the company of people with class, no offense, but you need to wash your mouth out. ;)
If you'll notice, in my posts, I NEVER use profanity. Not here, not on any board and not in real life. I keep things clean, kosher and G-rated.
That said, I now choose not to respond to any of you oafish posts. What would be the point of it?
Also, I remember the photo you posted of yourself. You're not ugly, but you're my type...at all.
So, no worries, I wouldn't be showing up on your doorstep for any reason whatsoever.
I for one appreciate this Good Fellow's restraint.
That the Black Panther "ranks like second or third on Pak's list as his favorite Storm bond." is quite the earth shattering revelation.
.... >:( shuddup you crickets! I can hear you chirping out there.
It’s not negativity, racism or anger! It’s a lack of cultural sensitivity & understanding.
There is a tragic history of depicting black people as “BUG-EYED”. They have to be careful with the imagery, as well as the writing.
It's like...Storm is what white people think elegant black people should be. They think it's a compliment, the way they depict her. Kind of like when white people talk about how articulate they are. You know they mean well, but it still bugs like hell.
Yeah, I've said on CBR a few times that Storm is like white people's idealized version of a black person. Contrast all her "safe extremes" with other black heroes. Then compare their levels of popularity with her's, how often they're used period, and how much hostility they generate when they often do anything impressive/of merit compared to Storm.
Nicolas Sarkozy, now ex president of France divorced his wife.Fun!
Silvio Berlusconi, now ex Prime Minister of Italy -who once said something about President Obama "having a nice tan"...some such nonsense- divorced his wife.
6000 years of Royal marital excellence shot to hell.
I'll bet neither divorcee engaged in hot sex with an ugly, hairy troll before the ink on their divorce decrees had dried. Storm stands alone in that regard.
During the days I trod the CBR lunatic landscape I was told more than once that Storm was not black...neither was Monet St Croix, and questions regarding C. Reyes race/ethnicity swirled like gnats in those foul confines. While many view Ororo as a multi-racial bisexual, her "blackness" has always been disputed. Which of course, is the reason why so many viewed her relationship with jet-black T'Challa with disdain.
It’s not negativity, racism or anger! It’s a lack of cultural sensitivity & understanding.
There is a tragic history of depicting black people as “BUG-EYED”. They have to be careful with the imagery, as well as the writing.
Argh, don't post that sh*t. Rutog probably jacks off to it every night. Besides, there's nothing wrong with being angry or negative about yet ANOTHER "Storm vs black people" story. I mean...they broke up the marriage for THIS sh*t?
that "bug-eyed" sh*t is border-line. angry or negative? whatever it may be, it's motivated by a lack of cultural sensitivity & understanding.
Fun!
Of course, It happens. Marriage is no longer sacred. Still, dealing with percentages & not blanket statements, we’re talking about a very low single-digit percentile, in a 6000 year history. Heads of State, Royalty & marriage is an African tradition. They were the first to establish it. Fact!
The King of a sovereign African nation would not abandon his civic duty to up-hold that tradition. A writer for a fictional comic would. They couldn’t wait for her to leave Tchallah & drop her panties for Logan. African heritage is disregarded. You have to understand non-black-people have difficulty accepting the real history of Africa & ancestral glory. Fan-boy corruption!
Marvel is a company
I don't blame the company, I blame the people working for the company.
White males?
White males?
I have several comics of “ Spider-Man” India. They could make provisions, spin-offs & alternate versions (of characters) if they wanted.
For the rest of you, I've been holding onto some knowledge for quite some time that I have not divulged. Of all the characters Storm has established bonds with, the Black Panther ranks like second or third on Pak's list as his favorite Storm bond. I think the Storm/Kitty relationship was his absolute favorite. He also likes the character of Black Panther. He's not going to "disrespect" him. Many of you guys are so negative and so full of anger that it boggles the mind. You're knocking on a book that hasn't even come out yet, wow!
It’s not negativity, racism or anger! It’s a lack of cultural sensitivity & understanding.
There is a tragic history of depicting black people as “BUG-EYED”. They have to be careful with the imagery, as well as the writing.
([url]https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRcFe2f0w7tLwRZvBo477uvWREHLrSIQTDSmkCE4StlJlsIkkE2[/url]) ([url]http://black-face.com/images/Willie-Best-small.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://black-face.com/images/MantanMoreland-small.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://black-face.com/images/Billie-Buckwheat-Thomas-2x.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/-_swtbIi2F0/mqdefault.jpg[/url])
([url]https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ7982JpZ1rZOx6EhDUVP7WTUPBno7A-5m2dv0MGOXsakNKbENx[/url]) ([url]https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRSZymkGKVTpXHc7FXwb4hloBw23mXk6zIhQXAJoCS_XHgxkiEV[/url]) ([url]https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSrieb6OUs4yCq4v2KRmI9RUt2MFvGqVYswoBdDifgeLAkUaJ5v[/url]) ([url]https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRq4NXjTujdyshDgDZsmWNzedJ7dRy7359F0UWanBig2o_lqGy0[/url])[url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url] ([url]http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html[/url])
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Quit using blanket statements. You’re making accusations. It's rude! Address the arguments & not your made-up beliefs. I’ll hit you with an avalanche of historical facts to support any statement I make. That's not "knocking"... that's clear observation.
Fact #1: Heads of State & Royalty do not divorce. 6000 years of proof!
Fact #2 : Heads of State & Royalty do not divorce. 6000 years of proof!
Keepin’ It Real” means being honest. The truth is essential when critiquing culture related issues.
Freedom of Speech & Expression for You, Max, Greg, Victor & everyone else.
Bendis is not feeling the X fans right now he's weary of their "persecuted and put upon" mentality.I don't blame him. It is a disaster to be a writer for a book dealing with self-righteous "fans" whom want to pretend they have "ownership" into something they have no control over.
^ I agree but...
White males? Marvel is a company. I don't blame the company, I blame the people working for the company.
I have several comics of “ Spider-Man” India. They could make provisions, spin-offs & alternate versions (of characters) if they wanted.
I don't think it's white & black. I think it's comic nerds uniting. it's mutualism! It's a corrupt fan-boy agenda. Revenge of the nerds!
Paviitr Prabhakar (Peter Parker) Aunt Maya & Uncle Bhim?
([url]http://www.spiderfan.org/comics/images/spiderman_india/004.jpg[/url])
Meera Jain? nice.
([url]http://www.comicbookreligion.com/imgr/Jain.jpg[/url])
they could do the same for Ororo & Tchalla.
Switch (From The Matrix) "Not like this. Not like this--"
Agent Smith "Never send a human to do a machines' job."
I wish Spider-Man India lasted longer, loved that series
For the rest of you, I've been holding onto some knowledge for quite some time that I have not divulged. Of all the characters Storm has established bonds with, the Black Panther ranks like second or third on Pak's list as his favorite Storm bond. I think the Storm/Kitty relationship was his absolute favorite. He also likes the character of Black Panther. He's not going to "disrespect" him. Many of you guys are so negative and so full of anger that it boggles the mind. You're knocking on a book that hasn't even come out yet, wow!
It’s not negativity, racism or anger! It’s a lack of cultural sensitivity & understanding.
There is a tragic history of depicting black people as “BUG-EYED”. They have to be careful with the imagery, as well as the writing.
(https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRcFe2f0w7tLwRZvBo477uvWREHLrSIQTDSmkCE4StlJlsIkkE2) (http://black-face.com/images/Willie-Best-small.jpg) (http://black-face.com/images/MantanMoreland-small.jpg) (http://black-face.com/images/Billie-Buckwheat-Thomas-2x.jpg) (http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/-_swtbIi2F0/mqdefault.jpg)
(https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQ7982JpZ1rZOx6EhDUVP7WTUPBno7A-5m2dv0MGOXsakNKbENx) (https://encrypted-tbn2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRSZymkGKVTpXHc7FXwb4hloBw23mXk6zIhQXAJoCS_XHgxkiEV) (https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSrieb6OUs4yCq4v2KRmI9RUt2MFvGqVYswoBdDifgeLAkUaJ5v) (https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRq4NXjTujdyshDgDZsmWNzedJ7dRy7359F0UWanBig2o_lqGy0)http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html (http://www.newsarama.com/21442-storm-1-first-look-blows-away-her-enemies.html)
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Quit using blanket statements. You’re making accusations. It's rude! Address the arguments & not your made-up beliefs. I’ll hit you with an avalanche of historical facts to support any statement I make. That's not "knocking"... that's clear observation.
Fact #1: Heads of State & Royalty do not divorce. 6000 years of proof!
Fact #2 : Heads of State & Royalty do not divorce. 6000 years of proof!
Keepin’ It Real” means being honest. The truth is essential when critiquing culture related issues.
Freedom of Speech & Expression for You, Max, Greg, Victor & everyone else.
The people in the scans you used from the upcoming Storm book were not depicted as bug-eyed. I have not seen a single bug-eyed Black character in the x-books. Storm, Frenzy, Maggot, Bishop, Stevie Hunter, etc, none of them have been bug eyed.
Regarding your comment about "Heads of State & Royalty do not divorce...", I have to take issue on that. Henry the 8th, anyone? In the olden days, one of the ways out of the marriage was through murder. Today is much improved, though murder still happens. Glad to see that Wakanda was depicted as a modern country instead of one stuck back in the stone age.
Here is the problem I am having: Many posters here seem to think that Blackness means Storm has to be married to Black Panther, a Black man. If she is with a White man, or a man of any other ethnicity, it makes her less Black. That is the vibe I am getting. To be honest with you, that kind of mentality is stupid and ignorant. Personally, I don't think Marvel's plan for breaking up Storm and T'challa was to put her with Logan. While I think pairing her with Wolverine was a VERY BAD idea, I think the reason Marvel made this move is because there is a certain enmity between the two men. Most Storm fans were very upset about the Storm/Panther marriage (and a lot of that anger is justified, to be frank, from much of what happened to her character as a result of bringing the two together), so I think Marvel paired her with Logan as a way to show her fans that the marriage between Ororo and T'challa is truly over and that the two will not be getting back together. Its not a mere cool off. I think it was an overkill that was out-of-character for Storm. The Storm/Wolverine pairing, I believe, was done as an afterthought.
Getting back to the whole notion of Storm having to be with a Black man to validate her Blackness is all kinds of messed up. She was no more Black when she was married to him than she was at any other point in her history. For starters, she's an X-Man which means she is in a book with predominately White characters. The likelihood of her being with a Black character is very slim. She should not have a mentality where she says, "I only date men of one race." Blackness is a made up term. Its not something innate. As such, different people have different ideas of what Blackness is. Want to know what it is at its core? Blackness, at least in this country, is centered around the church and the Bible. For so long, the church was the corner stone of the Black community and the Black pastor was the most respected person in that same community. As an African-American, one thing I am PROUD to say (and something all of us should be proud of) is that for MANY decades, it was the Black community that truly represented what Christianity was in this country. While you certainly had Whites who were on fire for God, proportionally, I believe that the Black community reflected this much moreso. Unfortunately, lately, the community has been moving away from its Biblical heritage. I can go on and on about this, but then it will become a digression. My point is, one of the things the Bible teaches is its okay to have interracial marriages and relationships. Look at the story of Ruth. Look at the story of Queen Esther who was a Jewish woman that married a Persian king. Look at Moses who was married to an Ethiopian. While I am well aware of the plight of Blacks in this country and understand the feelings many have concerning Black/White relationships, its something that's really at odds with our heritage.
When considering being in a relationship with someone, it should be about the individual themselves regardless of the color of their skin. If a Black is with a non-Black, I have no problems whatsoever with it as long as its for the right reasons and its not an issue of the Black trying to look down upon his/her own. A Black person can be with someone of another race and be very confident in their own skin, comfortable with their ethnicity and comfortable/respectful of others of their same ethnicity. Storm represents this to me. She does not favor one race over another and she is very comfortable with herself. She is very welcoming and accepting of people of every ethnicity be it her own or a different one. She's a shining example of what everyone should aspire to be. She looks at the individual. This is one reason, I feel, she connects well with readers of various backgrounds. Storm is proof that there is a place for everyone, not just the Scott's and Jean Grey's like we saw in the early days with the original 5 X-Men. While race is an aspect of the character, she is not solely defined by that. If she ends up with a White man or somebody non-Black, its not because that character is a non-Black, it would be more like she just happened to do so because he just happened to be a good fit for her. This Logan thing is simply her being written out-of-character to show her fanbase that the marriage is and truly over. This is not a cool off period between her and Panther. I'm writing it off as her rebounding from the marriage by scraping the bottom of the barrel to be with him. Mercifully, Logan is dying soon anyway.
All of that said, I will state it again, Storm an Black Panther needed to be broken up. The Storm fans were justified in their anger over this marriage. At first, they were open to the idea of this union eventhough it came out from left field without any realistic build up. Didn't the marriage issue get 70,000 sales, or something like that? As I've stated time and again, too much damage was done to Storm's character early on that alienated the readers from the Dickey mini to Storm not being portrayed as an equal partner in the marriage to T'challa and awkward writing in some of the earlier issues. One example of this would be the story where T'challa and Ororo visited Namor. Clearly, Storm operated there as a cheer leader for her husband and sat there side lined on the "important talks". She should have had an equal voice in that discussion to Namor and T'challa. Plus, her speech patterns were out-of-character. The Inhuman issue was also awkward. I don't want to keep bringing up instances of this, but all of this came on the heels right after the mini...a mini that went on for 6 months. While things got better with time in BP, the Storm fans had already booked off and weren't coming back as a result of what happened early on. When Maberry took over the book, there was a spike in sales which quickly dropped again because readers picked up the book under the new writer and saw a Shuri book. Nobody wants to read about her. The fact that sales spiked with the change of writers means that people were against Hudlin, not the IDEA pairing of the two characters. That sales spike really throws a monkey wrench in the whole "its all based on race" theory many of you hold. While there were a few racists thrown in the mix, overwhelmingly, I can tell you that the reason most were against the marriage (at least, on the internet) was because they perceived Storm was being devalued by being written out-of-character to prop up the Black Panther. She was portrayed more like Sue Richards than Ororo Munroe personality-wise in some of those earlier issues. Again, this improved with time. Many of those fans you guys are criticizing and calling "racist" are Black, by the way. I can recall one of them, an internet friend of mine, telling me during an IM conversation, "Down with Hudlin!" I responded with, "Huh?" Her:" He's going to make Storm the head of a harem. That's all the Dora Milaje is. Just look at how he messed up her personality?" When I tried to console her (this is a Black female) and tell her that I think Hudlin genuinely likes Storm and is just new to her character, she responded with, "Don't tell me that, Rutog. You just wait and see. Look at that god awful mini. She already gave it up for him when she was a kid. I can't believe they did that to her. Dam@ that Hudlin! You know he and Dickey got together on that. This is going to be terrible and I'm not going to stick around to see it. I'm giving up on Marvel. I love Storm too much." She was one of the Storm fans who came to this board early on back when I came here to "let the board have it for their disrespect for Storm", LOL! She told me verbatim, just like that in an IM conversation that she was going to get an account here and let you have it. As you can imagine, this young lady is a riot to talk to. I love her. ;) I met her back on the old Wizard boards where I first encountered Jenn. She never wanted to hear anything about BP in our conversations. If I tried to tell her about anything going on in the book, she didn't wanna hear it. Her mind was made up from the mini and some of the earlier issues of BP. She's not the only one like this either, but I shared this instance with you guys since I find it funny.
Anyway, I'm just trying to let you guys know that you are going overboard with the whole "Marvel broke Storm and BP up because they are Black and everyone who wanted to marriage to be dissolved is a racist too" claims.
Apex, of course, this was not all directed towards you, but at the board at large.
Many Storm fans, angered because she'd become the wife and the Queen of T'Challa, the Black Panther and had through the process of becoming such, rediscovered the paternal side of her family, had reunited with the maternal side of her family, had become the beloved Daughter of her new Wakandan family and had seemingly shed herself of that dysfunctional, incestuous mess of a "family" known as the X-Men refused to give the relationship a ghost of a chance and immediately set forth to destroy the Black Panther comicbooks featuring Storm as Wakandan Queen by not patronizing the book, villifying the author, et al.
Storm's beginnings had been in the X-Men...a book practically devoid of a black presence save for a pimp here and there for Ororo to humiliate by creating mini hurricanes over his head...stuff like that there. She was safe in a cocoon of whitefolks and whiteness...a circumstance X-Fans might defend as "colorblindness". Storm's romance and marriage with the Black Panther ripped her away from all that and suddenly, Ororo was surrounded by nothing but blackfolks. Well, there's lots of so-called black people living in Wakanda and throughout Africa. What did they expect?
Storm's wedding was an event attended by the Watcher himself signifying it as something of great importance. Anti-Marriage fans reacted with a "meh... ::)" and determined to not support the Wedding or the comicbook. Prof X prounounced Storm as the most important mutant in the world by virtue of her Marriage to T'Challa. X-Fans still whined about "RoLo" being derailed by Storm's attachment to a C-List character. Storm fans complained that she was second fiddle to a third rate character even though more than once her position as Queen of Wakanda put her in situations of greater gravitas than any period of her being an X-Man had done. Want proof? Start with Ororo's decision making and holding Wakanda together after the assassination attempt against T'Challa and read backward from there.
Now, this new book will have Ororo doing essentially the types of things she would have been doing had she remained Queen of Wakanda and because of this, her fans are geeked and are soliciting support for the book. I have a great deal of respect for the poster Hypestyle. I read his comments and confess to being mildly surprised. I too have been on a comicbook-purchasing hiatus and fully agree with his decision not to support the Storm ongoing.
Her origin isn't even "hers". It's a shameless and blatant rip-off of Modesty Blaise's.
And pretty much any fictional character can be written to go toe-to-toe with anyone. Storm being constantly pedestaled and propped up as the exotic, token, black, weather based, female, version of Goku, whose-ethnicity-is-really-only-talked-about-to-show-how-bad-practically-all-other-black-people-are-in-contrast-to-her, just makes it easier than most. Which is partly why she's the most "iconic" woman in the MU. Storm is "safe" for the readership.
And we should imo unquestionably support Storm's new ongoing until we have legit issues with her portrayal and whatnot. Because the fact of the matter is? Pak can write his hindquarters off. For those who have reservations about him writing a Black person? Remember how he just KILT IT on WAR MACHINE.
Pak can do this.
Storm has long needed a series. And we can have the history making happenstance of a Black female lead in her own solo break into the shelves and be profitable. Thus opening up the market for more women of color, and more people PERIOD.
Learn to say YES to good things, people.
I never even heard of Modesty Blaise before I read this quote.
I never even heard of Modesty Blaise before I read this quote.
It's somewhat obscure, but it's one of my favorite series to come out of UK. The parallels between her origin and Storm's were so obvious, and Claremont flat out admitted that he intentionally copied it. Because he was a fan of the series as well.
[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modesty_Blaise[/url] ([url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modesty_Blaise[/url])
I just completed a comic about the “Chinese Valentine’s.” I’m black! Do you think I depicted any stereo-typical images or concepts of Asians?
I'm not trippin' or taking it too seriously. It's just a harsh-critique for an important subject matter. recognize!
The "Illumination". As usual, a logical, compelling; engaging read. And as is usually the case, I was inclined to walk in lock-step with my Dear Brother, Supreme. But in this instance, the following pierced the sole of my big flat foot as the thorn into the lion's paw: And we should imo unquestionably support Storm's new ongoing until we have legit issues with her portrayal and whatnot. No, Brother. Not this time.
The HEF, never known as an assembly of monolithic thinkers, seem to have rendered the decision regarding this matter with one voice. Support Storm? Absolutely. Support the Storm ongoing with full knowledge of how writers have portrayed her in the past and with only rhetoric to try to convince us that this time all will be different and this new writer will portray an Ororo...THE Ororo...we haven't seen since the inception of her character? We can't do that "unquestionably", Supreme. We have more answers at this point than we have questions, Brother. History...30 years of consuming the swill of a less than positive, respectable, consistent portrayal of this magnificent character Ororo Munroe with only the brief respite during her reign as Queen of Wakanda...30 years of that mess have convinced most of us beyond any shadow of doubt that where Storm is concerned, where those who write her character are concerned and considering the expectations of the audience - the LCBRD - those writers are trying to appease...we stand convinced that we can only expect more of the same.
We need time, Supreme. Hudlin could have written Storm as well, if not better than this "Pak", but the LCBRD didn't want that "Too Black, Too Strong" version of Storm...a Storm that if that lot had been as open-minded as many HEF members are (I recuse myself ;)), would have entertained the diverse mass of comicbook fans, not simply the so-called black comicbook fan. But no. The LCBRD...spiced with a bit of black pepper sprinkled in if we are to believe some folks...didn't seem to want this. Hudlin was accused of planning to disgrace Ororo by having her become a member of his "harem" and worse nonsense than that did they spew. The LCBRD and friends were amenable to the images of Ororo in the Arena, in sexually suggestive posture with Yukio, disgraced and imprisoned. T'Challa's "harem" disgusted the LCBRD, but Ororo as just another...what did Jenn call it? "nut bucket" for Logan not only appealed to them; they LUSTED after it.
So now, Storm's "fans" (enablers is what they truly are, Dear Brother),...they come to the HEF asking for our support of this ongoing. I'd rather listen to Tupac than to eminem. I'd rather listen to Little Richard than to Pat Boone. I'd rather listen to Louis Armstrong than I would Bix Beiderbecke and to Chick Webb - the TRUE King of Swing - than I would to Benny Goodman. And I'd have rather read what R. Hudlin could have done with Ororo's character than read what Pak might do with Ororo's character.
We can't support the ongoing "unquestionably", Supreme. Knowing the HEF - and I think I know it well enough - some will purchase the book and share their opinion of what they have read. At that point, with more information and having at least a few questions answered, Storm's fans might be able to expect a softening of opinion and possible support for this ongoing.
Then this show wont last too long
...and do you know what would happen if you depicted stereo-typical imagery of Asians?
Anyone remember a television show in the early 90s called 'All American Girl' starring comedian Margaret Cho? Korean Americans and Asians in general, thought that the show depicted Asians unfavorably and protested the showrunners so heavily that by the end of the 1st season, the show couldn't get a renewal.
Of course, none of the accusations were true but that incident should give you an idea of what would happen, APEXABYSS.
Some many months ago, I remember a discussion in forum, a recurring component of which was the movie Django Unchained. For some reason, I had immediate negative impressions toward the movie and decided against watching it. I have yet to do so. Indicating my reservations regarding the movie but still ready to condemn a movie I had not yet seen, I received gentle admonishment from our Salustrade who wisely counseled that I watch the movie, become properly informed and then render an informed decision.
Not wanting to spend the money to purchase a cheap pre-viewed copy of the movie and not wanting to rent the movie either, I still haven't watched it. Recently however, a person offered to make a loan of the movie to me so that I could watch it.
I respect the HEF. I respect its members. I respect the opinions and decisions by those who have revealed them to us regarding the Storm ongoing. I have the highest regard for Salustrade, which is why the next time I see the person who offered to make loan of Django Unchained to me, I will accept the offer and view the movie. And because I also have the same high regard for Supreme Illuminati I will plan to purchase the first two issues of the Storm ongoing. I would give a new Black Panther ongoing at least one chance. Storm deserves that same chance.
I had no problem with Chris Claremont's depiction of Ororo interceding on T'Challa's behalf in the original 1980's story that chronicled their first meeting.
EJD's re-imagining of that meeting was an unnecessary retcon that did nothing to enhance said meeting but in fact, ended up providing cannon fodder for haters of the marriage to use in taking pot-shots at what Reginald Hudlin went on to accomplish with T'Challa and Ororo moving forward.
Everyone has their own idea as to what constitutes as being great storytelling but in this regard, EJD mesed up royally.
Peace.
Some many months ago, I remember a discussion in forum, a recurring component of which was the movie Django Unchained. For some reason, I had immediate negative impressions toward the movie and decided against watching it. I have yet to do so. Indicating my reservations regarding the movie but still ready to condemn a movie I had not yet seen, I received gentle admonishment from our Salustrade who wisely counseled that I watch the movie, become properly informed and then render an informed decision.
Not wanting to spend the money to purchase a cheap pre-viewed copy of the movie and not wanting to rent the movie either, I still haven't watched it. Recently however, a person offered to make a loan of the movie to me so that I could watch it.
I respect the HEF. I respect its members. I respect the opinions and decisions by those who have revealed them to us regarding the Storm ongoing. I have the highest regard for Salustrade, which is why the next time I see the person who offered to make loan of Django Unchained to me, I will accept the offer and view the movie. And because I also have the same high regard for Supreme Illuminati I will plan to purchase the first two issues of the Storm ongoing. I would give a new Black Panther ongoing at least one chance. Storm deserves that same chance.
Jut like \i didn't waste my money on buying D'Jango Unchained, I will not be spending a brass farthing on the Storm solo ongoing.
I have better thing to do with my money.
Some many months ago, I remember a discussion in forum, a recurring component of which was the movie Django Unchained. For some reason, I had immediate negative impressions toward the movie and decided against watching it. I have yet to do so. Indicating my reservations regarding the movie but still ready to condemn a movie I had not yet seen, I received gentle admonishment from our Salustrade who wisely counseled that I watch the movie, become properly informed and then render an informed decision.
Not wanting to spend the money to purchase a cheap pre-viewed copy of the movie and not wanting to rent the movie either, I still haven't watched it. Recently however, a person offered to make a loan of the movie to me so that I could watch it.
I respect the HEF. I respect its members. I respect the opinions and decisions by those who have revealed them to us regarding the Storm ongoing. I have the highest regard for Salustrade, which is why the next time I see the person who offered to make loan of Django Unchained to me, I will accept the offer and view the movie. And because I also have the same high regard for Supreme Illuminati I will plan to purchase the first two issues of the Storm ongoing. I would give a new Black Panther ongoing at least one chance. Storm deserves that same chance.
Jut like \i didn't waste my money on buying D'Jango Unchained, I will not be spending a brass farthing on the Storm solo ongoing.
I have better thing to do with my money.
Your statement is respectfully received and understood.
I will look upon the purchases of those 2 issues as a self-imposed penance.
Too many times I have depended upon your excellent scans and commentary as a means of keeping informed about stories in books I refused to buy myself.
I haven't made a comicbook purchase in well over a year. I suppose I have a few dollars I could throw at the first 2 issues of this book.
I probably would have spent some of that money on losing lottery tickets anyway ;)
I had no problem with Chris Claremont's depiction of Ororo interceding on T'Challa's behalf in the original 1980's story that chronicled their first meeting.
EJD's re-imagining of that meeting was an unnecessary retcon that did nothing to enhance said meeting but in fact, ended up providing cannon fodder for haters of the marriage to use in taking pot-shots at what Reginald Hudlin went on to accomplish with T'Challa and Ororo moving forward.
Everyone has their own idea as to what constitutes as being great storytelling but in this regard, EJD mesed up royally.
Peace.
I have perpetual respect for you, Salustrade, and many members of the HEF.
This is just one of the rare issues we will perpetually disagree on. I'll respectfully leave it at that.
The amount of civility and respect you guys display inside HEF is a shining example of how to agree to disagree politely.
There are times I wish I possessed your level of intelligence, gentlemen.
I'm still learning.
Then this show wont last too long.
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
And we should imo unquestionably support Storm's new ongoing until we have legit issues with her portrayal and whatnot. Because the fact of the matter is? Pak can write his hindquarters off. For those who have reservations about him writing a Black person? Remember how he just KILT IT on WAR MACHINE.
Pak can do this.
Storm has long needed a series. And we can have the history making happenstance of a Black female lead in her own solo break into the shelves and be profitable. Thus opening up the market for more women of color, and more people PERIOD.
Learn to say YES to good things, people.
A black woman without a black-man? That’s not cultural appreciation. What legacy & who’s legacy is that representing? That's foreign interpretation & manipulation.
“Power concedes nothing without a demand.”[/i] ~ Freddrick Douglas. Who’s demanding that a strong independent black women duke-it-out with other black people & be their savior?
Is it a business move or a passive opportunity to continue to control the image of black characters? They are monopolizing Storm. The idealism/ concepts (of the storm solo ) is already dysfunctional & distorted because it's not speaking to issues facing women of color. Just fan-boys, who don’t want to acknowledge... What doors are opening & who has all the keys... for a black female character? fan-boys... hhhmmmmm
They (the public) wants President Obama to appeal to a broader audience & not just blacks. The fan-boys only want Storm to appeal to them & not broader audiences. Am I right or wrong? Diversity!
Not the same ol’ same. Pak has the right to produce the comic as he sees fit. But when it comes to culture (African / Afro Cuban/ Caribbean) he has to come-up to a cultural standard & responsibility. Not go down to please his demographic jus to secure sells. i'll wish them well, while I give them hell. Defending our women is our duty. We're fighting with them side by side. The solo has her fighting us. The same way she fought BP. It's a bad start. Skating on thin-ice for sure.
I just completed a comic about the “Chinese Valentine’s.” I’m black! Do you think I depicted any stereo-typical images or concepts of Asians?
I'm not trippin' or taking it too seriously. It's just a harsh-critique for an important subject matter. recognize!
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
Having Ororo attack Black men is per the course in X-books.
Pak is just continuing that good ol' boys tradition.
Yeeeehaaaaaaaw!
>>>Sinjection1
Well, it's obvious that the current stable of writers at MARVEL know absolutely nothing about African American relationships dealing with love.
What these writers do seem familiar with is interracial relationships.
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
Having Ororo attack Black men is per the course in X-books.
Pak is just continuing that good ol' boys tradition.
Yeeeehaaaaaaaw!
Having so-called black men at odds somehow with so-called black women seems per the course in Marvel Comics period.
Nothing ever proceeds normally.
Ororo and T'Challa marry and then the marriage is annulled.
T'Challa is engaged to Monica Lynne. T'Challa is grievously injured and during his long recovery, Monica meets, falls in love with and becomes with white reporter Kevin Trudeau.
In some battle...it might have been during Civil War...Monica Rambeau squares off against Bishop.
Doctor Voodoo is only able to establish a romance with Monica Rambeau through magicks and chicanery, not through mutual attraction and interests.
Meanwhile, the recently single Misty Knight - clad most of the time in a teeny-weeny red bikini - practically throws herself at Daredevil as they team up to take down a man with whom Misty must have had a brief relationship. The man was so-called black and a criminal...naturally.
Now, there was Claire Temple and Luke Cage, but that relationship probably happened before most of you were out of diapers.
All this from a company who allows an albino so-called black super-villian who derives her power from her ability to generate extreme hatred to somehow fall in love with the white racist villian Grim Reaper...who eventually kills her.
The same company who had the lovely Calypso, another so-called black female, fall in love with a white villian - Kraven the Hunter or was it Kraven's son? Whoever it was, that white villian killed Calypso.
This same Marvel Comics which has never seemed to keen to establish a normal romantic relationship between a black female character and a black male character, marries a black male homosexual to a white male homosexual superhero, breaks up a romance between a black male mutant and his Asian mutant girlfriend only to "evolve" his character into a bisexual with a thing for a character resembling the Jolly Green Giant's offspring....this same Marvel Comics who killed off the black male mutant Synch just as his character was moving closer to a possible romance with the female mutant Monet St Croix...this same Marvel Comics who had a white male mutant who resembled a vulture impregnate a female mutant of color and who produced a love story featuring the animal mutant Beast slobbering into the mouth of black female mutant Cecelia Reyes...this same Marvel Comics who for decades has had the character Tyrone Johnson aka Cloak, involved in an unrequited love relationship with his blonde hair, blue eyed partner Tandy Bowen, aka Dagger.
This same Marvel Comics seems to have an unwritten but ironclad directive that no so-called black male/female intimate relationship should be established, let alone endure.
yeeeehawwww.
>>>Sinjection1
Well, it's obvious that the current stable of writers at MARVEL know absolutely nothing about African American relationships dealing with love.
What these writers do seem familiar with is interracial relationships.
Do they (these writers), truly seem familiar with interracial relationships...or are they more comfortable portraying such relationships because there is at least one white character - a character in their comfort zone - they can cling to? Maybe these writers feel that black-on-black violence sells, but black love repels.
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
Having Ororo attack Black men is per the course in X-books.
Pak is just continuing that good ol' boys tradition.
Yeeeehaaaaaaaw!
Having so-called black men at odds somehow with so-called black women seems per the course in Marvel Comics period.
Nothing ever proceeds normally.
Ororo and T'Challa marry and then the marriage is annulled.
T'Challa is engaged to Monica Lynne. T'Challa is grievously injured and during his long recovery, Monica meets, falls in love with and becomes with white reporter Kevin Trudeau.
In some battle...it might have been during Civil War...Monica Rambeau squares off against Bishop.
Doctor Voodoo is only able to establish a romance with Monica Rambeau through magicks and chicanery, not through mutual attraction and interests.
Meanwhile, the recently single Misty Knight - clad most of the time in a teeny-weeny red bikini - practically throws herself at Daredevil as they team up to take down a man with whom Misty must have had a brief relationship. The man was so-called black and a criminal...naturally.
Now, there was Claire Temple and Luke Cage, but that relationship probably happened before most of you were out of diapers.
All this from a company who allows an albino so-called black super-villian who derives her power from her ability to generate extreme hatred to somehow fall in love with the white racist villian Grim Reaper...who eventually kills her.
The same company who had the lovely Calypso, another so-called black female, fall in love with a white villian - Kraven the Hunter or was it Kraven's son? Whoever it was, that white villian killed Calypso.
This same Marvel Comics which has never seemed to keen to establish a normal romantic relationship between a black female character and a black male character, marries a black male homosexual to a white male homosexual superhero, breaks up a romance between a black male mutant and his Asian mutant girlfriend only to "evolve" his character into a bisexual with a thing for a character resembling the Jolly Green Giant's offspring....this same Marvel Comics who killed off the black male mutant Synch just as his character was moving closer to a possible romance with the female mutant Monet St Croix...this same Marvel Comics who had a white male mutant who resembled a vulture impregnate a female mutant of color and who produced a love story featuring the animal mutant Beast slobbering into the mouth of black female mutant Cecelia Reyes...this same Marvel Comics who for decades has had the character Tyrone Johnson aka Cloak, involved in an unrequited love relationship with his blonde hair, blue eyed partner Tandy Bowen, aka Dagger.
This same Marvel Comics seems to have an unwritten but ironclad directive that no so-called black male/female intimate relationship should be established, let alone endure.
yeeeehawwww.
Ugh! ([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/47.gif[/url])Then here is some more bad news. Right now ABC has a comedy with pretty much every minority now
You're right...
Randall Park who plays Governor Chung on 'Veep' seems to be a lead character on that show you just posted. The show doesn't appear to be as ground breaking as 'All American Girl'; At least Margaret Cho had guest stars on her show (Tarantino comes to mind).
I'm one of the few on this board who openly acknowledges that I liked the STORM miniseries. My kids' mother likes the miniseries. My oldest daughter likes the miniseries [ she's 17 ]. All of her friends who've read my miniseries [ which my daughter took it upon herself to share without asking me to do so ] also like the miniseries.
Many comic fans were repulsed from jumpstreet, though. Did a lot of that repulsion have a lot to do with a combination of ignorance of, disrespect for, and racism and resentment toward Black Panther as the premier Black male superhero in comics?
Yes. There is no denying such. Even when the Storm fans first rushed HEF to besiege us, the inital purpose and interaction was definitely confrontational. And this is on top of the Three Headed Monsters and Lovecrafties of the world.
Okay. Let's look at the EJD sex scene. Because that's the real static that people have.
(http://worldofblackheroes.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/storm4-1.jpg)
Is that disrespectful of the characters? No. However, when we project various AMERICAN VALUES upon it, will SOME PEOPLE get offended? Yes, of course.
Are AMERICAN VALUES the operating dominant moral compass of these AFRIKAN HEROES with deeper souls, and of lineagesat least 8000 years older than America is actually operating off of American values? No. There ya are. Stop being Ugly Americans.
And kill that statutory rape nonsense, because that's not the law in traditional Africa. Stop superimposing Americanized, Westernized morals and ignorance upon a much older and much more mature AFRIKAN NOT AMERICAN civilization. Before that? The people who had already decided to dislike the idea of the book and the marriage and these two characters who are clearly a terrific and nigh perfect match for each other actually could only hang their hat on the rather dubious and essentially substanceless argument that EJD didn't have TChalla get saved by Ororo.
Yeah. The Crown Prince of a civilization that's rockin Top 100 Tech in the galaxy...reeeaaaallllly doesn't need to be saved by a young lady who hasn't yet gotten a grip on her powers yet. Which brings me to this question here. Does the original story reflect the supergenius of TChalla? Would a GROWN ADULT SUPERGENIUS SUPERSTRATEGIST PRINCE of THE GREATEST HUMAN CIVILIZATION IN HUMAN HISTORY actually dress talk and act like this?
(http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/ororotchalla2.jpg)
Hell naw. That's what's wrong with the whole original story, and that's why the whole original story needs to get retconned.
Would that same princeling on his Walkabout, seeking to hide his actual identity from easy visual determination, blending into the general masses and thus without his hypertech, retinue of servants warriors bodyguards powerful sorcerers etc...[ the Walkabout is an actual tradition in Africa which is similar to one of the Rites of Passage that we celebrate in my own family btw ]...dress and act like THIS, given the time period and the prevalent political climate of the world and Africa?
(http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/ororotchalla9.jpg)
(http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/ororotchalla10.jpg)
Yes.
That rendition is much more sensible and realistic.
He doesn't need to be saved by a girl who hasn't gotten a grip on her powers yet. And given the Marvel canon about mutant powers manifesting during the teenage years? That tack taken by EJD rings true, too. However. Once said young lady locks in her powers? Yeah. THE GALAXY needs to be saved by her. THE UNIVERSE TOO. Multiple times. And let's not forget...she saved an entire city, and a whole countryside...inclusive of TChalla...by the end of the book. And clowned her rival. With class, I might add.
She wasn't the slowest zebra anymore.
So yeah. The critics of the EJD miniseries? They all have different reasons for their repulsion...but. Bottom line? I think there's a lot of skipping of a lot of content in the miniseries in order to harp and imo blow out of proportion the sex scene and the fact that TChalla wasn't a D-Lister in need of help from anyone...and at that point in their lives? He SHOULD enjoy a PRONOUNCED advantage over Ororo, until her control of her powers kick in.
None of that stuff I mentioned gets addressed.
Let me tell you something else that the sex scene made clear: Black Love is still threatening to a lot of people in the LCBRD. It wasn't just bad enough that EJD showed that two teenagers who loved each other actually had sex [ because that NEVER happens across the world, across racial ethnic political class cultural and other lines; nope ] what really got their goat was that Ororo was ALSO bangin TChalla in RH's miniseries. Maxine Shaw once had a sig that read: "Ororo, Queen of Wakanda. She's Black AND F#ck!ng" or something to that effect.
(http://oi41.tinypic.com/103hdvo.jpg)
And that reality liked to have scoured the flesh off of most people having a problem with The Marriage. Because these two being Black, Afrikan, unbowed, without needing any White character leading anything at all or even being anywhere at all in their general cast, more powerful than any married cape couple in Marvel history, and featured everywhere in the big crossover events...was just too much.
Despite all that shade, EJD still sold in the low to high 20k's. Had the shade been ameliorated even a little? He'd have hit round 40k monthly. And the BP ongoing would have hit even more.
http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2006/2006-03.html (http://www.comichron.com/monthlycomicssales/2006/2006-03.html)
Was Ororo playing second fiddle in the talks TChalla and Namor had? Nope. Was she less involved in the discussion than TChalla was? Yep. She did not know the real reason that TChalla joined The Avengers, so she couldn't act like she DID know something that SHE DID NOT know. However, it was she...not TChalla...who checked Namor. In Atlantis. In his throne room. And...uh...she was getting infinitely more shine, a much more prominent position, and possessed of far more relevancy MU wide as Queen of Wakanda than at any time she ever spent in the X-books. Literally. Not even CC got close to what Hudlin did for Ororo. Real talk.
This is how THEY introduced Storm:
(http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-lNFdcpcj-PA/TdIXFKpwbAI/AAAAAAAAKhU/MedMs5BZHCA/s1600/gs%252Bxmen%252B1%252Bstorm.jpg)
Not from the unashamed mature humanity embracing body beautiful cultural perspective of Africa, but from the sexually titillating fetishist perspective dominant in the psyche of most White Americans and especially White young to middle age males at the time this pic was crafted.
With Reginald Hudlin...in 6 or so issues...RH had such far reaching impact that Ororo was featured in every major Marvel event and in multiple books that wouldn't even touch her before. At her most popular, under CC's pen? Storm was a NONENTITY outside of the X-books.
Reginald Hudlin, in the space of 6 issues, had Ororo doing more than the X-office had her do in nearly 20 years. When was the last time that Ororo squared off with someone Clor-like?
(http://bp0.blogger.com/_cq-h1RCj4yI/SEJagkkq9CI/AAAAAAAAAxc/4p-QCnhJmGk/s1600-h/ororo.gif)
Yep. The Asgardian Wars. 20 or so years ago. Pause and let that marinate. TWENTY OR SO YEARS AGO. And remember? Loki CLOWNED HER with ONE MOVE. Didn't Claremont write that? Yes, he did. Under Reginald Hudlin's pen? Storm backs down Iron Man when he shows up at the Wakandan Embassy trying to be a boss.
Under RH's pen, STORM DROPS CLOR WITH A EMP.
(http://arousinggrammardotcom.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/thorstorm1.jpg)
Now. Who's being the most appreciative of and respectful to Storm, again? Didn't THIS happen under Chris Claremont?
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/2/29818/689102-storm40.jpg)
When you look at the substance of the work of RH and the benefits of Ororo being married to TChalla which afforded other writers the option to use Ororo too. Adn it's clear that everyone knows that Ororo is an equal partner in her marriage with TChalla. McDuffie wrote it...
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/1/18863/2532277-screen_shot_2012_08_14_at_3.31.41_pm.png)
RH wrote it...
(http://www.dailyraider.com/comics/readytodie/malcolmx.jpg)
And haters...who didn't read RH's book, mind you, for the most part...hated it with that special intensity that only abysmal ignorance can bring.
Don't forget. For the first time in world comic book history, we see a royal Black superheroic married couple traveling the cosmos WITHOUT having to rely on White folks for anything. We see at last this heterosexual couple frequently on panel together [ seriously, think back. When was the last time that you saw two Black superheroes together forming thee most powerful married couple in comics, both from The Big Two, both deeply in love and constantly shown on the same panel together. Supportive of each other. For not just pages or books but arcs and whole runs? Answer: NEVER EVER. None before RH. None after him ] showing them working together as a team that has not only the power to defeat enemies physically...
[ and you know that I can't pass up the fact that THIS pic giving TCHALLA vastly overdue props got the LCBRD hooowwwwlliiiing with hatred ]:
(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y37/Nightmareman95/NM95/wow5uz9.jpg)
And THESE got shade, too, although not as much as the previous SS arm bar:
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11112/111123445/3269365-49a2b56884cbab459335b9855b6fe070_zps59f2c97a.jpg)
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111119363/3483144-parker+1.jpg)
(http://i1050.photobucket.com/albums/s417/KingMichael777/Comics/1289773-untitled1_zps87602d99.jpg)
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11111/111119363/3726645-compare.jpg)
TChalla and Ororo also showed the brilliance resources strategic cunning teamwork and knowhow to pull leverage on powerful extraterrestrial entities
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5VgL6ZXwkaw/RhPANEbqteI/AAAAAAAAB_0/Nq9BXQJ5F4s/s1600/Fantastic%2BFour%2B544-2.JPG (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_5VgL6ZXwkaw/RhPANEbqteI/AAAAAAAAB_0/Nq9BXQJ5F4s/s1600/Fantastic%2BFour%2B544-2.JPG)
queen Ororo is an equal above and everywhere else. She is NOT a cheerleader. She is NOT second fiddle. And she is presented as NOT being second fiddle by RH and everyone else who respects and "gets" the character.
So let's see. A guy who is in canon being shown having contingency plans to take on Galactus like Black Panther is...
(http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/50188/1086966-bp_contingency_plan_for_galactus.jpg)
Really ain't worried about Norrin Radd aka Silver Surfer, who owes his power to Galactus.
However, the LCBRD haaaateed on TChalla. Despite his capability in that regard being well well established in canon...buut they are cool with the idea of Hawkeye taking on Ultron
(http://www.comicbookmovie.com/images/users/uploads/60479/HawkeyeEE.jpg2.jpg)
Now. When has Hawkeye EVER shown any aptitude or ability to take on Ultron?
I'm waiting.
Never? Thought so. But Hawkeye taking on Ultron is "cool". TChalla taking on SS is catches shade like the dark side of the moon.
Like sin and Sal said. Most of the static isn't rooted in legit issues dealing with legit characterization and story plot. Most of the rabid backlash comes from deep seated dual desires: to keep Ororo as 'their" exotic wallflower piece unsullied by any Black man, aaand "their" deep discomfort with TChalla because of who and what he is. Especially when a skilled Black scribe is writing him.
Ororo will catch a very similar level of intense shade when she permanently takes herself off of The Fetish Farm and establishes herself as a true Afrikan superhero who is every bit as much a mutant as she is regal, Afrakan, and unconquerable. Like Yost said...she doesn't have to choose between Worlds Apart. She symbolizes Worlds United.
Her LCBRD fanbase though? Not so much.
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
Having Ororo attack Black men is per the course in X-books.
Pak is just continuing that good ol' boys tradition.
Yeeeehaaaaaaaw!
Having so-called black men at odds somehow with so-called black women seems per the course in Marvel Comics period.
Nothing ever proceeds normally.
Ororo and T'Challa marry and then the marriage is annulled.
T'Challa is engaged to Monica Lynne. T'Challa is grievously injured and during his long recovery, Monica meets, falls in love with and becomes with white reporter Kevin Trudeau.
In some battle...it might have been during Civil War...Monica Rambeau squares off against Bishop.
Doctor Voodoo is only able to establish a romance with Monica Rambeau through magicks and chicanery, not through mutual attraction and interests.
Meanwhile, the recently single Misty Knight - clad most of the time in a teeny-weeny red bikini - practically throws herself at Daredevil as they team up to take down a man with whom Misty must have had a brief relationship. The man was so-called black and a criminal...naturally.
Now, there was Claire Temple and Luke Cage, but that relationship probably happened before most of you were out of diapers.
All this from a company who allows an albino so-called black super-villian who derives her power from her ability to generate extreme hatred to somehow fall in love with the white racist villian Grim Reaper...who eventually kills her.
The same company who had the lovely Calypso, another so-called black female, fall in love with a white villian - Kraven the Hunter or was it Kraven's son? Whoever it was, that white villian killed Calypso.
This same Marvel Comics which has never seemed to keen to establish a normal romantic relationship between a black female character and a black male character, marries a black male homosexual to a white male homosexual superhero, breaks up a romance between a black male mutant and his Asian mutant girlfriend only to "evolve" his character into a bisexual with a thing for a character resembling the Jolly Green Giant's offspring....this same Marvel Comics who killed off the black male mutant Synch just as his character was moving closer to a possible romance with the female mutant Monet St Croix...this same Marvel Comics who had a white male mutant who resembled a vulture impregnate a female mutant of color and who produced a love story featuring the animal mutant Beast slobbering into the mouth of black female mutant Cecelia Reyes...this same Marvel Comics who for decades has had the character Tyrone Johnson aka Cloak, involved in an unrequited love relationship with his blonde hair, blue eyed partner Tandy Bowen, aka Dagger.
This same Marvel Comics seems to have an unwritten but ironclad directive that no so-called black male/female intimate relationship should be established, let alone endure.
yeeeehawwww.
Greg Pak?
[url]http://www.gregpak.com/war_machine/[/url] ([url]http://www.gregpak.com/war_machine/[/url])
The guy who took a overlooked Black tech armor guy and actually made him somebody unique with his own profile and removed him from being a knockoff Iron Man?
[url]http://www.newsarama.com/1502-greasing-the-gears-greg-pak-talks-war-machine.html[/url] ([url]http://www.newsarama.com/1502-greasing-the-gears-greg-pak-talks-war-machine.html[/url])
Maybe not "yeehaaaw" for HIM. "Yeehaaawww" for most of Marvel insofar as overall presentation and whatnot?
Yeah I can see that.
Pak? Mmmm...we have his written books wherein he writes a Black superhero quite well indeed. And that's what he's fixin to do with STORM.
Pak has a proven POSITIVE history in this area. So...I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until he writes some garbage about Storm or somebody else of color.
He wrote that Green Guy purrty good...[url]http://them0vieblog.com/2012/04/27/greg-paks-run-on-the-incredible-hulk-with-jeff-parker-fall-of-the-hulks-review/[/url] ([url]http://them0vieblog.com/2012/04/27/greg-paks-run-on-the-incredible-hulk-with-jeff-parker-fall-of-the-hulks-review/[/url])
And so did one of my favorite guys, Peter David, who is waaaaayyyy too overlooked. Peter David is an AMAZING talent.
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire evil human army (where you can see their faces), and not have said army be black men?
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
It's the only kind of army she can beat, white ones use one man who always leave her unconscious, tied up, de powered and drooling on the floor
And the fans stay silent until a year later then you'll see a casual mention of not liking that here and there
>>>Sinjection1
Well, it's obvious that the current stable of writers at MARVEL know absolutely nothing about African American relationships dealing with love.
What these writers do seem familiar with is interracial relationships.
Do they (these writers), truly seem familiar with interracial relationships...or are they more comfortable portraying such relationships because there is at least one white character - a character in their comfort zone - they can cling to? Maybe these writers feel that black-on-black violence sells, but black love repels.
combo of all 3. great eye, brutha
And what hurts the most, is that there are still some amongst us who stay making endless excuses for what can only be described as being a sustained resistance to the portrayal of Black on Black heterosexual love within the 616 MU.
([url]http://i61.tinypic.com/10crn1z.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i60.tinypic.com/6g94b4.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i43.tinypic.com/2cqbqso.jpg[/url])
You get every single variation on love in the MU other than Black-on-Black but some amongst stay championing the X-office as being dedicated to diversity.
What a joke. :smh:
([url]http://i44.tinypic.com/2rqyibm.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i40.tinypic.com/2urrqja.jpg[/url])
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
I don't know about Storm taking out a normal human army of non-Blacks, but I know she's taken out the X-Men and "killed" Cyclops.
[url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url] ([url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url])
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
I don't know about Storm taking out a normal human army of non-Blacks, but I know she's taken out the X-Men and "killed" Cyclops.
[url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url] ([url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url])
I have to add one more thing: X-Treme X-Men issue 1 (or 2), Storm took out an entire squad of the Guardia, a premier elite, secretive military force in Spain with an electromagnetic pulse. No Blacks in that group.
>>>Sinjection1
Well, it's obvious that the current stable of writers at MARVEL know absolutely nothing about African American relationships dealing with love.
What these writers do seem familiar with is interracial relationships.
I’m not supporting anything representing women of color (storm) fighting black-men. We fight together not each other. have her fight them...
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/668d1139f76c1bebf3f592bd85079dd3/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso7_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://31.media.tumblr.com/9cb696ec3bf7a953ec2d375988ddf14c/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso4_400.jpg[/url])
([url]http://37.media.tumblr.com/335d48653d1f8bcaf8d9df6534548491/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso1_400.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/9a126958ac7147de03537dc3d6b2a660/tumblr_n4sou9vpJr1t0taiso6_400.jpg[/url])
let the master teacher tell it...
Having Ororo attack Black men is per the course in X-books.
Pak is just continuing that good ol' boys tradition.
Yeeeehaaaaaaaw!
Having so-called black men at odds somehow with so-called black women seems per the course in Marvel Comics period.
Nothing ever proceeds normally.
Ororo and T'Challa marry and then the marriage is annulled.
T'Challa is engaged to Monica Lynne. T'Challa is grievously injured and during his long recovery, Monica meets, falls in love with and becomes with white reporter Kevin Trudeau.
In some battle...it might have been during Civil War...Monica Rambeau squares off against Bishop.
Doctor Voodoo is only able to establish a romance with Monica Rambeau through magicks and chicanery, not through mutual attraction and interests.
Meanwhile, the recently single Misty Knight - clad most of the time in a teeny-weeny red bikini - practically throws herself at Daredevil as they team up to take down a man with whom Misty must have had a brief relationship. The man was so-called black and a criminal...naturally.
Now, there was Claire Temple and Luke Cage, but that relationship probably happened before most of you were out of diapers.
All this from a company who allows an albino so-called black super-villian who derives her power from her ability to generate extreme hatred to somehow fall in love with the white racist villian Grim Reaper...who eventually kills her.
The same company who had the lovely Calypso, another so-called black female, fall in love with a white villian - Kraven the Hunter or was it Kraven's son? Whoever it was, that white villian killed Calypso.
This same Marvel Comics which has never seemed to keen to establish a normal romantic relationship between a black female character and a black male character, marries a black male homosexual to a white male homosexual superhero, breaks up a romance between a black male mutant and his Asian mutant girlfriend only to "evolve" his character into a bisexual with a thing for a character resembling the Jolly Green Giant's offspring....this same Marvel Comics who killed off the black male mutant Synch just as his character was moving closer to a possible romance with the female mutant Monet St Croix...this same Marvel Comics who had a white male mutant who resembled a vulture impregnate a female mutant of color and who produced a love story featuring the animal mutant Beast slobbering into the mouth of black female mutant Cecelia Reyes...this same Marvel Comics who for decades has had the character Tyrone Johnson aka Cloak, involved in an unrequited love relationship with his blonde hair, blue eyed partner Tandy Bowen, aka Dagger.
This same Marvel Comics seems to have an unwritten but ironclad directive that no so-called black male/female intimate relationship should be established, let alone endure.
yeeeehawwww.
Greg Pak?
[url]http://www.gregpak.com/war_machine/[/url] ([url]http://www.gregpak.com/war_machine/[/url])
The guy who took a overlooked Black tech armor guy and actually made him somebody unique with his own profile and removed him from being a knockoff Iron Man?
[url]http://www.newsarama.com/1502-greasing-the-gears-greg-pak-talks-war-machine.html[/url] ([url]http://www.newsarama.com/1502-greasing-the-gears-greg-pak-talks-war-machine.html[/url])
Maybe not "yeehaaaw" for HIM. "Yeehaaawww" for most of Marvel insofar as overall presentation and whatnot?
Yeah I can see that.
Pak? Mmmm...we have his written books wherein he writes a Black superhero quite well indeed. And that's what he's fixin to do with STORM.
Pak has a proven POSITIVE history in this area. So...I'll give him the benefit of the doubt until he writes some garbage about Storm or somebody else of color.
He wrote that Green Guy purrty good...[url]http://them0vieblog.com/2012/04/27/greg-paks-run-on-the-incredible-hulk-with-jeff-parker-fall-of-the-hulks-review/[/url] ([url]http://them0vieblog.com/2012/04/27/greg-paks-run-on-the-incredible-hulk-with-jeff-parker-fall-of-the-hulks-review/[/url])
And so did one of my favorite guys, Peter David, who is waaaaayyyy too overlooked. Peter David is an AMAZING talent.
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire evil human army (where you can see their faces), and not have said army be black men?
([url]http://www.comixbrew.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/bpsi3.jpg[/url])
Most of this issue...
([url]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/ignore_jpg_scale_small/3/32897/1253939-o___the_dm.jpg[/url])
And a bunch more.
Just to bring the point home? The recent RoLo pairing and breakup ain't the first time they swapped spit.
([url]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-N3YNwuqp8Fs/TXG8bBl33BI/AAAAAAAAEGk/ABPnv9HJyNs/s1600/wolverine%2Bstorm.jpg[/url])
I wasn't a major fan of it back then, either. I always thought she should be with TChalla, but moreso...as much as I liked Logan back then...I didn't think he's a good enough person for her. Back then, I couldn't shake the feeling that he'd have one berserker rage too many and he'd do something like this to her:
([url]http://nomoremutants.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/Photo-8_17_13-11.35.59-PM-2.png[/url])
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
I don't know about Storm taking out a normal human army of non-Blacks, but I know she's taken out the X-Men and "killed" Cyclops.
[url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url] ([url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url])
I have to add one more thing: X-Treme X-Men issue 1 (or 2), Storm took out an entire squad of the Guardia, a premier elite, secretive military force in Spain with an electromagnetic pulse. No Blacks in that group.
THANK YOU, Rutog98!!
The weasel known as Logan has never been and never will be good enough for Storm. He literally stinks as a character, as evidenced as canon in a very recent X-Men book where Beast said he might be able to come up with a way to make the weasel have a less offensive odor.
Marvel saw fit to rip Ororo out of the arms of a black man who smelled great and throw her into the arms of a white man who smells like a dead wet dog. And now that THAT fling is kaput, they'll show her with her hand on Forge's shoulder, because, you know...
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
I don't know about Storm taking out a normal human army of non-Blacks, but I know she's taken out the X-Men and "killed" Cyclops.
[url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url] ([url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url])
I have to add one more thing: X-Treme X-Men issue 1 (or 2), Storm took out an entire squad of the Guardia, a premier elite, secretive military force in Spain with an electromagnetic pulse. No Blacks in that group.
THANK YOU, Rutog98!!
I'm not sure what you're thanking dude for since he was only able to find ONE incidence of Storm bringing the pain to a non-black set of soldiers weighed against the multiple incidences of similar martial actions against a plethora of Black combatants leading up to this....
([url]http://i57.tinypic.com/sb5uu8.jpg[/url])
You know heads are scraping the bottom of the barrel in desperation to shore up a threadbare argument. :smh:
The weasel known as Logan has never been and never will be good enough for Storm. He literally stinks as a character, as evidenced as canon in a very recent X-Men book where Beast said he might be able to come up with a way to make the weasel have a less offensive odor.
Marvel saw fit to rip Ororo out of the arms of a black man who smelled great and throw her into the arms of a white man who smells like a dead wet dog. And now that THAT fling is kaput, they'll show her with her hand on Forge's shoulder, because, you know...
Yeah, at least she's not with a Black man.
Yeah, at least she's not with a Black man.
The weasel known as Logan has never been and never will be good enough for Storm. He literally stinks as a character, as evidenced as canon in a very recent X-Men book where Beast said he might be able to come up with a way to make the weasel have a less offensive odor.
Marvel saw fit to rip Ororo out of the arms of a black man who smelled great and throw her into the arms of a white man who smells like a dead wet dog. And now that THAT fling is kaput, they'll show her with her hand on Forge's shoulder, because, you know...
Yeah, at least she's not with a Black man.
The weasel known as Logan has never been and never will be good enough for Storm. He literally stinks as a character, as evidenced as canon in a very recent X-Men book where Beast said he might be able to come up with a way to make the weasel have a less offensive odor.
Marvel saw fit to rip Ororo out of the arms of a black man who smelled great and throw her into the arms of a white man who smells like a dead wet dog. And now that THAT fling is kaput, they'll show her with her hand on Forge's shoulder, because, you know...
*sigh* I really didn't want to talk about this, but I will. The whole Ororo/Logan pairing did not come out of left field. Storm fans have been clamoring for years for these two to get together. I have always been against this pairing for reasons I have already discussed at length on this board. For Wolverine, Jean Grey will always be his first pick, though he is NOT her first pick. If he were her first pick, she would have married him instead of Cyclops. Pairing Storm (or any woman) with Logan makes her a consolation prize. She's too good of a character for that. One of the reasons I was open to the idea of Storm and BP being rushed into marriage is prior to that, she and Logan were going on dates and stuff. They were not yet an item as she was also going on dates with Nightcrawler, but the risk of her being with Logan loomed on the horizon for me. I don't want that. When Panther and Storm broke up, Marvel simply resumed the budding relationship that was brewing between Storm and Logan (Nightcrawler was dead at the time...he's gotten over that now, lol) and put a twist on it to jab a Panther. This was done not because Panther is Black, but because there was a certain enmity between the two men concerning Ororo's affections. So, pairing Storm with Logan had multiple uses for Marvel. 1) It would appease much of the Storm fanbase who hated the marriage and have wanted Storm and Logan to get together since WAY before a Storm/Panther marriage was even a concept. 2) There was already a foundation for the two of them to date prior to the marriage plus they share a long and profound friendship which is always good to build a relationship off of. 3) It adds a touch of drama/interest for those who follow Storm/Logan as it brings up the enmity between the two men. 4) Its a good way of letting readers know that the marriage is truly over because of reasons 2 and 3 on my list.
Pairing Storm with Logan has nothing to do with Marvel wanting her to be with "anybody but Black." If that were the case, they would not have allowed to marriage to happen in the first place. Even when sales were dipping on the title, they tried to preserve the marriage and title by bringing on Maberry. The focus on Shuri was the final nail in the coffin as that killed any hope the book/marriage had of rebounding.
All that said, it's out of character for Storm to just go into a relationship so soon after the break up. She's very slow to give her heart. Despite her and Logan going on dates prior to the marriage, it wasn't very serious at all. I still maintain that Logan is just the rebound guy.
And what are your excuses for Misty Knight? Oya/Idie?
lol - the new black woman- solo title- wow
([url]http://38.media.tumblr.com/155dad7d632d877bc4fedbab51dc10a4/tumblr_n7nrp6ImE51ts10q9o1_1280.jpg[/url])
And your statements about how fans wanted to see Storm and the weasel hook up just shows that a LOT of Storm fans would rather have Storm under white men than a black man (Thor, Weasel-man, Nightcrawler, Namor, Cyclops, Dracula, etc. etc.) And your response just shows that Marvel caters to that type of crap.
My memory may be a little fuzzy, but...
Come to think of it...how many times has Storm gone up against and wiped out an entire "mean ol' human army", and not have said army be comprised of black men?
Never.
The X-writers stay showing their collective bigoted ass everytime.
You know what? I can't remember her wiping out a HUMAN army that didn't have Black people in it, either. My scans showed nonhumans. Hmmm.
I don't know about Storm taking out a normal human army of non-Blacks, but I know she's taken out the X-Men and "killed" Cyclops.
[url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url] ([url]http://arousinggrammar.com/2013/04/23/storm-vs-everybody/[/url])
I have to add one more thing: X-Treme X-Men issue 1 (or 2), Storm took out an entire squad of the Guardia, a premier elite, secretive military force in Spain with an electromagnetic pulse. No Blacks in that group.
THANK YOU, Rutog98!!
I'm not sure what you're thanking dude for since he was only able to find ONE incidence of Storm bringing the pain to a non-black set of soldiers weighed against the multiple incidences of similar martial actions against a plethora of Black combatants leading up to this....
([url]http://i57.tinypic.com/sb5uu8.jpg[/url])
You know heads are scraping the bottom of the barrel in desperation to shore up a threadbare argument. :smh:
Supreme Illuminati,
I'm really confused by some of your posts in this thread.
It's almost as if you're looking for any excuse to avoid looking at the elephant in the middle of the room.
The mere fact that the X-Office remained resolute in their decision to leave Reginald Hudlin to carry the weight of chronicling Ororo and T'Challa as a married couple should be a clear indication to anyone with a descerning eye to see exactly what agenda they were (and still are) pushing.
Posting multiple cans of Ororo doing battle with random mooks doesn't change anything.
Actually that cover to Astonishing X-Men did come with a story as a alternate universe Storm was sacrificing multiple alternate universe Cyclops', the first issue even lead into that as alt universe Storm set her sights on 616 Cyclops with a kiss
Written by Pak and drawn by McKone
Supreme Illuminati,
I'm really confused by some of your posts in this thread.
It's almost as if you're looking for any excuse to avoid looking at the elephant in the middle of the room.
The mere fact that the X-Office remained resolute in their decision to leave Reginald Hudlin to carry the weight of chronicling Ororo and T'Challa as a married couple should be a clear indication to anyone with a descerning eye to see exactly what agenda they were (and still are) pushing.
Posting multiple cans of Ororo doing battle with random mooks doesn't change anything.
allow me to clear up that confusion, my brother.
I am aware that the X-Office's agenda has been overall definitely and decisively anti-Black and most especially anti-Black mutant.
What I am trying to discern is if they have been 100% that way, so that I don't paint EVERYONE with the same broad brush.
The evidence that can provide a counterargument to the "100% hatas without exceptions" approach is/are books and works that show contrary evidence.
I labor under zero illusions regarding the overall, dominant, and consistent pattern of behavior that I have been aware of regarding the X-Office.Actually that cover to Astonishing X-Men did come with a story as a alternate universe Storm was sacrificing multiple alternate universe Cyclops', the first issue even lead into that as alt universe Storm set her sights on 616 Cyclops with a kiss
Written by Pak and drawn by McKone
See? I didn't know that. I haven't bought X-books with any consistency in literally decades. Good catch, Genki Sudo the Neo Samurai.
I still think that Pak's amazing WAR MACHINE run destroys arguments that he has a pronounced or even visible anti-Black male disposition.
I will check out the STORM books and decide for myself if I see evidence justifying a change in my opinion.
What really doesn't make sense, is that the X-office is a constantly changing group of people. The people who are there now are not the same people who were there ten or fifteen years ago, but the problem is been around for years.
The only people who have actually been around that long are the fans.
Supreme Illuminati,
I'm really confused by some of your posts in this thread.
It's almost as if you're looking for any excuse to avoid looking at the elephant in the middle of the room.
The mere fact that the X-Office remained resolute in their decision to leave Reginald Hudlin to carry the weight of chronicling Ororo and T'Challa as a married couple should be a clear indication to anyone with a descerning eye to see exactly what agenda they were (and still are) pushing.
Posting multiple cans of Ororo doing battle with random mooks doesn't change anything.
allow me to clear up that confusion, my brother.
I am aware that the X-Office's agenda has been overall definitely and decisively anti-Black and most especially anti-Black mutant.
What I am trying to discern is if they have been 100% that way, so that I don't paint EVERYONE with the same broad brush.
The evidence that can provide a counterargument to the "100% hatas without exceptions" approach is/are books and works that show contrary evidence.
I labor under zero illusions regarding the overall, dominant, and consistent pattern of behavior that I have been aware of regarding the X-Office.Actually that cover to Astonishing X-Men did come with a story as a alternate universe Storm was sacrificing multiple alternate universe Cyclops', the first issue even lead into that as alt universe Storm set her sights on 616 Cyclops with a kiss
Written by Pak and drawn by McKone
See? I didn't know that. I haven't bought X-books with any consistency in literally decades. Good catch, Genki Sudo the Neo Samurai.
I still think that Pak's amazing WAR MACHINE run destroys arguments that he has a pronounced or even visible anti-Black male disposition.
I will check out the STORM books and decide for myself if I see evidence justifying a change in my opinion.
There does seem to be a difference in how writers write black characters OUTSIDE of the X-Office's influence, and how those same writers write black characters WITHIN the X-Office's influences.
For instance, when Jason Aaron wrote Black Panther in "See Wakanda and Die", it was brilliant because he was writing outside of the X-Office and under the supervision of the rest of Marvel. However, when he wrote Black Panther a few times in X-books under the influence of the X-Office, he catered to Jerry Springer-type shenanigans and catered to haters of Black Panther/haters of the union between Storm and Black Panther. Jason Aaron made Storm and Black Panther look ridiculous (aside from "See and Wakanda and Die)" because the X-Office was involved.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I think that is what he meant by writing her down. Storm could have turned back the whole invasion alone; forcing her to fight without powers is holding her back.
Of course people forget his whole premise; he took away the Skrull and Wakanda tech to make them fight with sticks because he didn't believe Wakanda could beat a fully engaged Skrull army. And that means he didn't believe Storm could beat Skrull army, even with Wakanda behind her. So he took both armies back to prehistoric tech and made the Skrull forget hire to shape shift in combat.
He wrote them smart, tough and deadly but he also wrote them as too weak to beat the Skrull at the hight of their power.
Compare that to Hickman 's invasion. Thanos forces are more technologically advance and suicidal; Hickman 's Wakanda would have beaten the Skrulls without having to be reduced to sticks.
What really doesn't make sense, is that the X-office is a constantly changing group of people. The people who are there now are not the same people who were there ten or fifteen years ago, but the problem is been around for years.
The only people who have actually been around that long are the fans.
'nuff said.
([url]http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a165/RoddSteele/hudlin/HEF/stas_zps85fab738.jpg[/url])
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I think that is what he meant by writing her down. Storm could have turned back the whole invasion alone; forcing her to fight without powers is holding her back.
Of course people forget his whole premise; he took away the Skrull and Wakanda tech to make them fight with sticks because he didn't believe Wakanda could beat a fully engaged Skrull army. And that means he didn't believe Storm could beat Skrull army, even with Wakanda behind her. So he took both armies back to prehistoric tech and made the Skrull forget hire to shape shift in combat.
He wrote them smart, tough and deadly but he also wrote them as too weak to beat the Skrull at the hight of their power.
Compare that to Hickman 's invasion. Thanos forces are more technologically advance and suicidal; Hickman 's Wakanda would have beaten the Skrulls without having to be reduced to sticks.
I did not know that J.A. didn't think that TChalla could beat a top tier Skrull army with all of their tech and superpowers aligned and maxed out.
I think that Wakanda could do such a thing, as they have more resources and abilities than most MU writers have bothered to explore or use.
For instance...remember when we here at HEF first mentioned Wakandan mutants [ and Mark Millar took a flyer from us and specifically had Reed Richards ask TChalla about mutants...and be stonily ignored...during the first Civil War and Illuminati arc? ]. Wakandan mutants, Wakandan sorcery and magic, Wakandan Mystic Vibranium, Wakandan tech, the Wakandans themselves [ in truth Wakanda's weakest citizens would equate to low genius level intellect+ an "average Olympian" combo in other parts of the world ]...including the Gorilla Cult, the whole Royal Family inclusive of capes like The Crew [ I renamed them the NGUVU ITHOBO roughly translating to "Strong Warrior Squadron" ] and The Black Musketeers [ who as TChalla's cousins and half brother, I renamed them the KSH...the Kefalme Shujaa Heshima "The Royal Warriors Of Honor" ], the whole arsenal of hundreds of powerful Wakandan sorcerors [ not just Zawaviri--dang it, I forget dude's name--and Mendinao ], Hunter ,the Hatut Zeraze the Midnight Angels the Dora Milaje, the entire Order of TPG and even enemies like Killmonger and Achebe as NOBODY wants to see Wakanda fallen to space aliens...all of them would band together.
Plus? TChalla still has resources like THE NOWHERE ROOM that nobody else has.
Wakandans routinely face the various homegrown shapeshifters that litter the traditional magic landscape of Africa and Wakanda. TChalla has encountered The Skrulls several times and studied them...without the converse being true.
The Ultimate Prep Beast in the MU would defeat The Skrulls. And that's without Storm there.
Storm? She's one RogueStorm from ruling star spanning empires...or destroying them.
So yeah.
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I think that is what he meant by writing her down. Storm could have turned back the whole invasion alone; forcing her to fight without powers is holding her back.
Of course people forget his whole premise; he took away the Skrull and Wakanda tech to make them fight with sticks because he didn't believe Wakanda could beat a fully engaged Skrull army. And that means he didn't believe Storm could beat Skrull army, even with Wakanda behind her. So he took both armies back to prehistoric tech and made the Skrull forget hire to shape shift in combat.
He wrote them smart, tough and deadly but he also wrote them as too weak to beat the Skrull at the hight of their power.
Compare that to Hickman 's invasion. Thanos forces are more technologically advance and suicidal; Hickman 's Wakanda would have beaten the Skrulls without having to be reduced to sticks.
I did not know that J.A. didn't think that TChalla could beat a top tier Skrull army with all of their tech and superpowers aligned and maxed out.
I think that Wakanda could do such a thing, as they have more resources and abilities than most MU writers have bothered to explore or use.
For instance...remember when we here at HEF first mentioned Wakandan mutants [ and Mark Millar took a flyer from us and specifically had Reed Richards ask TChalla about mutants...and be stonily ignored...during the first Civil War and Illuminati arc? ]. Wakandan mutants, Wakandan sorcery and magic, Wakandan Mystic Vibranium, Wakandan tech, the Wakandans themselves [ in truth Wakanda's weakest citizens would equate to low genius level intellect+ an "average Olympian" combo in other parts of the world ]...including the Gorilla Cult, the whole Royal Family inclusive of capes like The Crew [ I renamed them the NGUVU ITHOBO roughly translating to "Strong Warrior Squadron" ] and The Black Musketeers [ who as TChalla's cousins and half brother, I renamed them the KSH...the Kefalme Shujaa Heshima "The Royal Warriors Of Honor" ], the whole arsenal of hundreds of powerful Wakandan sorcerors [ not just Zawaviri--dang it, I forget dude's name--and Mendinao ], Hunter ,the Hatut Zeraze the Midnight Angels the Dora Milaje, the entire Order of TPG and even enemies like Killmonger and Achebe as NOBODY wants to see Wakanda fallen to space aliens...all of them would band together.
Plus? TChalla still has resources like THE NOWHERE ROOM that nobody else has.
Wakandans routinely face the various homegrown shapeshifters that litter the traditional magic landscape of Africa and Wakanda. TChalla has encountered The Skrulls several times and studied them...without the converse being true.
The Ultimate Prep Beast in the MU would defeat The Skrulls. And that's without Storm there.
Storm? She's one RogueStorm from ruling star spanning empires...or destroying them.
So yeah.
Really?
([url]http://i57.tinypic.com/21ne6uq.jpg[/url])
I can't get behind you guys on Jason Aaron. He may do a good job with T'challa, but he ALWAYS writes down Storm whether its with the X-office or any other office. I can't stand this guy. Keep him as FAR away from Storm as possible.
Ya know, I never considered that he writes down Storm. I remember he wrote Storm leading the sword armed attack that slaughtered the Skrulls. What other instances did he write down Storm? I'm sure they're there if you said they are, I just missed them.
I think that is what he meant by writing her down. Storm could have turned back the whole invasion alone; forcing her to fight without powers is holding her back.
Of course people forget his whole premise; he took away the Skrull and Wakanda tech to make them fight with sticks because he didn't believe Wakanda could beat a fully engaged Skrull army. And that means he didn't believe Storm could beat Skrull army, even with Wakanda behind her. So he took both armies back to prehistoric tech and made the Skrull forget hire to shape shift in combat.
He wrote them smart, tough and deadly but he also wrote them as too weak to beat the Skrull at the hight of their power.
Compare that to Hickman 's invasion. Thanos forces are more technologically advance and suicidal; Hickman 's Wakanda would have beaten the Skrulls without having to be reduced to sticks.
I did not know that J.A. didn't think that TChalla could beat a top tier Skrull army with all of their tech and superpowers aligned and maxed out.
I think that Wakanda could do such a thing, as they have more resources and abilities than most MU writers have bothered to explore or use.
For instance...remember when we here at HEF first mentioned Wakandan mutants [ and Mark Millar took a flyer from us and specifically had Reed Richards ask TChalla about mutants...and be stonily ignored...during the first Civil War and Illuminati arc? ]. Wakandan mutants, Wakandan sorcery and magic, Wakandan Mystic Vibranium, Wakandan tech, the Wakandans themselves [ in truth Wakanda's weakest citizens would equate to low genius level intellect+ an "average Olympian" combo in other parts of the world ]...including the Gorilla Cult, the whole Royal Family inclusive of capes like The Crew [ I renamed them the NGUVU ITHOBO roughly translating to "Strong Warrior Squadron" ] and The Black Musketeers [ who as TChalla's cousins and half brother, I renamed them the KSH...the Kefalme Shujaa Heshima "The Royal Warriors Of Honor" ], the whole arsenal of hundreds of powerful Wakandan sorcerors [ not just Zawaviri--dang it, I forget dude's name--and Mendinao ], Hunter ,the Hatut Zeraze the Midnight Angels the Dora Milaje, the entire Order of TPG and even enemies like Killmonger and Achebe as NOBODY wants to see Wakanda fallen to space aliens...all of them would band together.
Plus? TChalla still has resources like THE NOWHERE ROOM that nobody else has.
Wakandans routinely face the various homegrown shapeshifters that litter the traditional magic landscape of Africa and Wakanda. TChalla has encountered The Skrulls several times and studied them...without the converse being true.
The Ultimate Prep Beast in the MU would defeat The Skrulls. And that's without Storm there.
Storm? She's one RogueStorm from ruling star spanning empires...or destroying them.
So yeah.
Really?
([url]http://i57.tinypic.com/21ne6uq.jpg[/url])
First? Never saw those panels. Thanks for sharing them, yo.
Second? That up there is a classic example of writing Ororo down.
Ororo has "near infinite power" at her command, should she wish it.
([url]http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/3/30174/638965-ux147_1.jpg[/url])
So if Iron Man can make a Phoenix Buster suit? Ororo can take Pheonix down. If she's written properly.
i had this big long argument about why Phoenix is way beyond Storm but I am not getting into this debate again.
Stopping myself from debating. .. just barely. ..
Without a premise for adventure baked into the character's backstory the writer will be forced to resort to write Storm stories as solo Xmen ("Storm has to fight Mr. Sinister! Without the Xmen!! BY HERSELF!!!") or the Storm goes back to Africa("Storm returns to Africa to bring a vicious Warlord to justice!" stuff that so many resent.
O.K I guess there's the third option of making her Captain Planet with boobs where she flies around the world beating up polluters ("Roxxon/British Petrolium! face the wrath of Storm!").
At least option 1 involves stories that the Xfandom might care about. The others don't even offer that.
I can't be mad at Pak. What the hell can he or anybody else do with Storm given the character's limitations?
And now we have people swearing up and down that she is too powerful to be doing any of that stuff.
Which doesn't make her any more interesting, by the way.
1) What Pak's goal is with the "Storm" ongoing is to make Storm the Marvel equivalent of DC's Superman.Decided not to read any further once I have noticed that.
Quote1) What Pak's goal is with the "Storm" ongoing is to make Storm the Marvel equivalent of DC's Superman.Decided not to read any further once I have noticed that.
([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/46.gif[/url])*sigh*
The icon of MARVEL is Spider-Man.
Sorry bro Marvel wont allow a character whom don't even have her own movie to be the "star" of their brand. The brand has existed for more than 75 years and the bulk of it was spiderman. Pak can write as well all he wants. He did excellent work with Hulk that eventually led to a crossover event. After that the Hulk been a joke once he left. It takes decades before one can even claim a title such as that.Quote1) What Pak's goal is with the "Storm" ongoing is to make Storm the Marvel equivalent of DC's Superman.Decided not to read any further once I have noticed that.
That's the impression I got from some of the interviews. Just like Superman is the icon of DC, I think Pak wants to make Storm the icon of Marvel.
([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/46.gif[/url])*sigh*
The icon of MARVEL is Spider-Man.
...for now. :) I'm rooting for Pak on this.
This is what Storm will be doing in her book:
Thief. Goddess. Headmistress. Queen. The X-Man called STORM has always defied a single title. And her desire to better the world has never been limited to only her own kind. On a mission to foster goodwill and safeguard the mutant race's continued existence in her own way, Storm will travel the globe, confronting man and mutant, god and monster and everything inbetween. She will overthrow tyrants, quell tsunamis and strive to see her dream for the world realized. She is STORM, a hero like no other....and the skies will tremble at the sight of their namesake.
There's nothing of "shock value" in there. Pak is simply going to write her in character and simply expand her role in the larger MU. In the X-World, Storm IS iconic. Pak sees her as kind of the "Superman" of the X-Men world. I don't think he's far off the mark with that. He wants to simply expose her to the larger MU, I think, and have her character shine making her Marvel's "Superman". Her character is already rich enough and her powers are epic. All he has to do is build on that foundation and not restrict her only to the X-World.
That set up is hilarious, "she's out to show she's not just about her own kind.........but the stories will be based all on mutant plight"
Bazinga for real
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family. Surround her by a new cast of characters. The only X character that should show up early is her daughter, and that is only because she is family. Have other non X heroes show up and give her new villains.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family. Surround her by a new cast of characters. The only X character that should show up early is her daughter, and that is only because she is family. Have other non X heroes show up and give her new villains.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
Quote1) What Pak's goal is with the "Storm" ongoing is to make Storm the Marvel equivalent of DC's Superman.Decided not to read any further once I have noticed that.
That's the impression I got from some of the interviews. Just like Superman is the icon of DC, I think Pak wants to make Storm the icon of Marvel.
([url]http://www.rubicondev.com/forum/images/smilies/46.gif[/url])*sigh*
The icon of MARVEL is Spider-Man.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
uh oh....introducing anything Storm-related that smacks of Hudlin's enhancements to her character could spell quick and certain doom for this ongoing.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
uh oh....introducing anything Storm-related that smacks of Hudlin's enhancements to her character could spell quick and certain doom for this ongoing.
Yeah.
X-DWEEBS AFTER READING A GREAT STORM BOOK THAT INCLUDES RH'S BACKSTORY FOR STORM'S FAMILY: "She has a Black family? Dang. That might mean that STORM is ACTUALLY BLACK.
Nooooooooooooo!!!!
hatehatehatehatehatehatehatehate!!!"
uh oh....introducing anything Storm-related that smacks of Hudlin's enhancements to her character could spell quick and certain doom for this ongoing.
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
uh oh....introducing anything Storm-related that smacks of Hudlin's enhancements to her character could spell quick and certain doom for this ongoing.
Yeah.
X-DWEEBS AFTER READING A GREAT STORM BOOK THAT INCLUDES RH'S BACKSTORY FOR STORM'S FAMILY: "She has a Black family? Dang. That might mean that STORM is ACTUALLY BLACK.
Nooooooooooooo!!!!
hatehatehatehatehatehatehatehate!!!"
Yep, something along those lines, possibly followed by: "They went and made Nick Fury black; then, they made the movie version of Alicia Masters black. They made a black Spider-Man. What's next...a black Johnny Stor....ummm..."
...but WAIT. Why not just introduce TChalla in the F4 as Stan Lee did, then swing him over to The Avengers...
...but WAIT. Why not just introduce TChalla in the F4 as Stan Lee did, then swing him over to The Avengers via The X-Men? GRRREEEAAAT trio of launch pads for his own solo movie franchise, plus it adds much needed diversity to the first two franchises without straying too far from the comics premise. But naaahhh...that's too good of an idea.
Sadly those three properties are owned by three separate studios so crossovers won't happen until Marvel reclaims all the rights.
The longer this debate goes on, the more certain I am that it was probably a mistake to give Storm a solo series in the first place.
Batman's parents were killed by criminals, so Batman goes after crime and criminals.
Captain America was created to fight the Nazis, so that is why he goes after enemies of freedom.
Green Lantern got his alien space cop ring from an alien space cop so's he could take his place as an alien space cop.
But Storm was living on a moutaintop in Kenya when some bald dude (how did the Professor get his wheelchair up there anyway?) asked her to join his strike force and she actually joined him instead of laughing his face like a reasonable person would have done.
Without a premise for adventure baked into the character's backstory the writer will be forced to resort to write Storm stories as solo Xmen ("Storm has to fight Mr. Sinister! Without the Xmen!! BY HERSELF!!!") or the Storm goes back to Africa("Storm returns to Africa to bring a vicious Warlord to justice!" stuff that so many resent.
O.K I guess there's the third option of making her Captain Planet with boobs where she flies around the world beating up polluters ("Roxxon/British Petrolium! face the wrath of Storm!").My prediction is that this "Pak" will set Storm on a course which she would have traversed with her ex-husband T'Challa as Queen of Wakanda had Hudlin been allowed to work without being accosted by the LCBRD lunatic fringe. That bunch might have wanted Storm to be a significant mutant, but not the most important mutant in the world by virtue of being Queen of a mighty nation of negroes. Storm can be an important mutant...just not the most important mutant. She'd be intruding on weasel man's turf if that were the case. So my guess is that Storm - needing help to topple corrupt governments, combat natural disasters; etc... - will need help from mutants she already knows and will probably meet (and flirt with), a flatscan male of Asian or Caucasian extraction.
At least option 1 involves stories that the Xfandom might care about. The others don't even offer that.
I can't be mad at Pak. What the hell can he or anybody else do with Storm given the character's limitations?
And now we have people swearing up and down that she is too powerful to be doing any of that stuff.
Which doesn't make her any more interesting, by the way.
At least if Storm was depowered her solo book could be a Modesty Blaise ripoff that would work as a companion piece with Marvel's other Modesty Blaise ripoff book, Black Widow.
And since that Black Widow book is actually REALLY GOOD (reformed amoral spy now uses her amoral spy tactics to do good deeds-see how actually having a premise works?) being in the same class could only help.
In the book's defense, Storm does have a name writer and a great artist that I've never heard of.
Maybe that will be enough.
In the original telling of the Ororo/T'challa meeting, T'challa wanted Storm to stay with him as he was still enjoying her company. She left because the "Song of the Wind" had once more spoken to her telling her it was time to move on. He offered to kiss her before she left, and she responded with, "If that's your way." He was amazed that she would treat a prince's kiss so casually. IIRC, she said something to the effect of, "One day. If not, I shall be the poorer for it. Farewell, young prince," and she flies off from the tree branch they were sitting on.
That said, Pak is going to create some new characters for Storm to fill in her supporting cast. Of course, we will also see some of her friends show up from time to time. In the first issue of the ongoing, Pak will introduce a new character, Creep, that he hopes we as readers will get a kick out of. He also expressed interest in using this character again in future story arcs for the book. He assures us all that this is not going to be just another X-Men team book and that it is Storm's solo title.
All that said, Storm wouldn't need the help of other mutants to stop natural disasters or topple corrupt governments. Just take a look at Storm #1 where she stops that tsunami by herself. With her powers, being what they are and the extreme levels they are at, the natural disaster part won't be an issue for her. To topple corrupt governments, she'd probably get in with the opposing resistance faction in that country who will likely have moles in the government and that could be her supporting cast for that story arc. It can go any number of ways. One of the things that has me really excited is Storm being pitted against "gods" in her title. She's gonna cut up like something else!
I LOVE what Storm says about the Avengers in an upcoming X-Men book from these preview pages:
([url]http://i.newsarama.com/images/i/000/132/049/original/XMEN2013016_int2_00004.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i.newsarama.com/images/i/000/132/051/original/XMEN2013016_int2_00005.jpg[/url])
;D ;D ;D ;D Damn...
That is hilarious.
Poor Ororo. Poor, poor, poor Ororo.
Why do those who do so, write her to be so incredibly stupid at times?
Ohhhhhhhh she's talking big game. Big, big game.
"We're the X-Men, Sabra. We are some of the most powerful beings to ever exist. We are elite."
Elite, my ass-troturf.
Ororo is so elite that she needed help fighting Dracula. She was bested by Thor - an Avenger - by being kissed into unconsciousness ;D ;D ;D Her "power" wasn't squat v.s. Thor's smooching skills. Valkyrie isn't a goddess. She's a Defender...or ex-Defender. She's an ex-Defender with a really, really, really huge hammer with which Ororo is very well acquainted.
Getouttahere with all that "we are elite" noise and get back to crying about how hard it is to be a mutant ;D
Now Greg Pak has put himself in a scenario that he cannot achieve nor accomplish. You cannot just flat out say that a character for over 30 years of writing is suddenly the "superman" of marvel. How can the person be if she isnt even among the leaders of the x-men?
If they really wanted to make Storm transcend the X-Universe, this is what I would do. Move her out of X- housing into a place on her own, maybe near her family.
:D ....maybe near her family.... :D
What family? ;D
The one that is being created as you type this! ;)
I was thinking of the family Reggie introduced us to. Hmmm....thinking about it, since mutants seem to run in families, it seems she should have a mutant cousin or two.
uh oh....introducing anything Storm-related that smacks of Hudlin's enhancements to her character could spell quick and certain doom for this ongoing.
Yeah.
X-DWEEBS AFTER READING A GREAT STORM BOOK THAT INCLUDES RH'S BACKSTORY FOR STORM'S FAMILY: "She has a Black family? Dang. That might mean that STORM is ACTUALLY BLACK.
Nooooooooooooo!!!!
hatehatehatehatehatehatehatehate!!!"
Yep, something along those lines, possibly followed by: "They went and made Nick Fury black; then, they made the movie version of Alicia Masters black. They made a black Spider-Man. What's next...a black Johnny Stor....ummm..."
Well, that Black Johnny Storm is faintly possible because Sue Storm is Latina and the original Johnny Storm is now Captain America sooooo...
...but WAIT. Why not just introduce TChalla in the F4 as Stan Lee did, then swing him over to The Avengers via The X-Men? GRRREEEAAAT trio of launch pads for his own solo movie franchise, plus it adds much needed diversity to the first two franchises without straying too far from the comics premise. But naaahhh...that's too good of an idea.
([url]http://i45.tinypic.com/20rn4at.jpg[/url])
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Of course, the average X-Koolaid drinker will tell you that the above depicted beatdown that Storm recieved from Valkyrie in't canon even though it's pretty damn obvious that it is.
([url]http://i45.tinypic.com/20rn4at.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i49.tinypic.com/2zxp5ph.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i49.tinypic.com/210hrba.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i46.tinypic.com/25f12ra.jpg[/url])
([url]http://i48.tinypic.com/w22hxz.jpg[/url])
Of course, the average X-Koolaid drinker will tell you that the above depicted beatdown that Storm recieved from Valkyrie in't canon even though it's pretty damn obvious that it is.
Her face smashed into the ground, butt up in the air, there's the majestic mutant Storm in the classic cartoon depiction of someone who has been knocked the funk out. Valkyrie bashed Storm's brains out of her head. The beating he took from Iron Fist left T'Challa with a brain aneurysm. Ororo took a terrific wallop to her headquarters from a mallet fully matching the girth and likely exceeding the weight of the torsos of Valkyrie and Ororo. It's as if Storm had been hit in the head with a keg of beer mounted on a club.
The blood blasted from her nose and mouth was more than might be seen in some who have sustained a gunshot wound. Her face should have swollen to the size of a beach ball, but there she was...knocked the funk out, butt up in the air but face as beautiful as ever. Apparently, the writer and artist who depicted Ororo so disgracefully deigned to show her some small degree of dignity.
When Thor kissed Ororo into unconsciousness in the CONTEST OF CHAMPIONS miniseries, small hearts shot from her head as she swooned. In this instance, once Ororo awakened on the beach it would have been fitting to have her eyes spinning in their sockets counter to each other, small canary birds tweeting and circling her head and Ororo reciting her own version of the child's Halloween ditty "Trick or Treat". "We're elite. Smell my feet. Give me someting sweet to eat."
But this "Pak" is going to make Storm into Marvel Comics' equivalent to Superman.
Whatever Pak does? It's gonna be waaayyy better than what Storm's gotten from the X-Office lo these many decades. Better than Storm got from anyone NOT named CJP, RH, or McDuffie, Yost, or Aaron during SEE WAKANDA AND DIE.
Storm=First Black Female Solo Comic Book Lead for the Big Two since...what? Monica Rambeau's miniseries or whatever?enjoys a long, successful run.
I wish I could trade wait on some books. Would make storing them a lot simpler.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?Then create them.
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been hanled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a ot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?Then create them.
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been hanled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a ot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Here is something for some good measure.
This happened last night. It is the second annual men unity march in baltimore. I was in the back doing security patrol
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/t1.0-9/10417439_586662541452544_8606705575276303001_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/t1.0-9/10387209_586662634785868_8625091935565697883_n.jpg)
(https://scontent-a-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/t1.0-9/10403620_586662738119191_5082858796770372726_n.jpg)
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/t1.0-9/10377981_586663101452488_2469743351575441865_n.jpg)
I have access to tons of these.
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/t1.0-9/10176034_760425797315515_704464009_n.jpg)
It is out there. We just have to create it. There is nothing else to it. I do not accept that point I will never accept it. That victim crap has to end.
I have been able to give myself more storage space as of the last month. A new boss in another department at my job learned that I create comics and we were talking about comics for kids and how rare it Is these days to find fun comics for kids. His son loves Spider-Man. I gave his son at least 50 single issues from my old Spidy collection that I deemed safe and fun for 10-13 year olds. Comics can be to dark these days to get the younger audiences attached. So I got some more to dig through. Gotta convert em into a comics fan early!
Got to make room for that newer stuff that I support!
I send Marvel Entertainment positive images of black people every chance I get.What does this achieve exactly? It does nothing. I refuse to even attempt to get on a bus where I am not wanted. I would rather walk. Based on what they have done historically I'm good.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been handled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a lot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman who made her own bizarre life choices as opposed to several white writers and several white editors MAKING her go down the paths they have shown her embarking on.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead if us gleefully posting images of Storm (a fictional African woman) getting her ass kicked, perhaps we should refrain from doing that, because we sure wouldn't be gleefully posting images of Black Panther (a fictional African man) getting his ass kicked, and laughing about it.
I think I've said this before, but the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life.
I think the amount of venom spewed from both fan bases (against the other fan base's favorite character) over the years over CHARACTERS WHO DON'T ACTUALLY EXIST is atrocious and doesn't help or solve anything...it just makes matters worse.
I have been able to give myself more storage space as of the last month. A new boss in another department at my job learned that I create comics and we were talking about comics for kids and how rare it Is these days to find fun comics for kids. His son loves Spider-Man. I gave his son at least 50 single issues from my old Spidy collection that I deemed safe and fun for 10-13 year olds. Comics can be to dark these days to get the younger audiences attached. So I got some more to dig through. Gotta convert em into a comics fan early!
Got to make room for that newer stuff that I support!
Comics where dark back in the day as well
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been handled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a lot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman who made her own bizarre life choices as opposed to several white writers and several white editors MAKING her go down the paths they have shown her embarking on.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead if us gleefully posting images of Storm (a fictional African woman) getting her ass kicked, perhaps we should refrain from doing that, because we sure wouldn't be gleefully posting images of Black Panther (a fictional African man) getting his ass kicked, and laughing about it.
I think I've said this before, but the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life.
I think the amount of venom spewed from both fan bases (against the other fan base's favorite character) over the years over CHARACTERS WHO DON'T ACTUALLY EXIST is atrocious and doesn't help or solve anything...it just makes matters worse.
I'm not interested in breaking bread with any X-fan or writer instrumental in disrespecting the BP mythos and as such, will always blast back with zero remorse when provoked with BS.
I have zero interest in building bridges with a fanbase and writers who come across more like members of the Tea Party.
Peace.
I'm not interested in breaking bread with any X-fan or writer instrumental in disrespecting the BP mythos and as such, will always blast back with zero remorse when provoked with BS.
I have zero interest in building bridges with a fanbase and writers who come across more like members of the Tea Party.
Peace.
This! ALL OF THIS!
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office,
but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create,
QuoteI send Marvel Entertainment positive images of black people every chance I get.What does this achieve exactly? It does nothing. I refuse to even attempt to get on a bus where I am not wanted. I would rather walk. Based on what they have done historically I'm good.
QuoteI send Marvel Entertainment positive images of black people every chance I get.What does this achieve exactly? It does nothing. I refuse to even attempt to get on a bus where I am not wanted. I would rather walk. Based on what they have done historically I'm good.
You are ASSUMING it does nothing. Have you ever tried it? If you did try it and you didn't get immediate results, you have to realize that the changes are not going to be immediate because we are battling DECADES of racist behaviors, racist ideas and racist attitudes, so the change WE WANT is not going to happen overnight.
If you DIDN'T try it, then how are you qualified to sit there and assume it won't achieve anything?
Does posting negative images of black people on message boards achieve anything, other than more negativity? Continuously posting negative images of fictional black women getting hit with hammers is not going to create positivity, because how would it?
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
But I realize all of this requires FAITH, POSITIVITY and OPTIMISM, which a lot of people in the comic book reading-public and a lot of people on message boards DO NOT HAVE, because their first immediate reaction is to be pessimistic and always expect the worst, but keep complaining when the worst happens because they refuse to do what is necessary to TRY and change things for the better.
It's always easy to be pessimistic, and negative, and to assume the worst, and to assume such-and-such method to try and change things for the better won't work, and to assume reaching out to companies to express our displeasure won't work, and to laugh and ridicule fictional black women for the ways in which they are written by white men and handled by white editors, but it requires a lot more patience, dedication, perseverance and a tough, unwielding, relentless mindset to do the dirty work and do what actually needs to be done in order for POSITIVE, PERMANENT changes to the comic book industry to happen.
It seems that it's always easier for a lot of people to spew hatred and venom at fictional black characters (male or female, for a variety of reasons) then to band together and support as many fictional black characters as they can.
The overall big picture is, if you want things to change, then you have to BE THE CHANGE and do what's necessary to change things instead of bickering, snickering, spewing hatred for fictional black women when we all know the same would NOT be done for a majority of fictional black men. Constantly complaining on message boards to people WHO ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEMS ARE changes nothing...it just reminds comic book readers what the problems are and just keeps feeding negativity. It's more logical to CONSTANTLY COMPLAIN TO THE COMPANIES THAT ARE ACTUALLY CONSTANTLY CAUSING THE PROBLEMS.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been handled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a lot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman who made her own bizarre life choices as opposed to several white writers and several white editors MAKING her go down the paths they have shown her embarking on.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead if us gleefully posting images of Storm (a fictional African woman) getting her ass kicked, perhaps we should refrain from doing that, because we sure wouldn't be gleefully posting images of Black Panther (a fictional African man) getting his ass kicked, and laughing about it.
I think I've said this before, but the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life.
I think the amount of venom spewed from both fan bases (against the other fan base's favorite character) over the years over CHARACTERS WHO DON'T ACTUALLY EXIST is atrocious and doesn't help or solve anything...it just makes matters worse.
Meanwhile those who like to say they're fans of both like to try and talk down to everybody else while supporting current writers and editors who like the folks before them ain't worth a damn either and neither is this character who's only significance now that we are to "see as golden and what makes a character awesome" is a mohawk and the ability to electrocute folks with a tan
Storm aka the comic book version of Condi Rice
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
In this topic alone I've seen two flattering/positive images of Storm; one included in a post by Marvelous, the other in a post by Apexabyss. Then there are the unlettered page preview for the ongoing featuring Ororo dispatching a cadre of armed men with frightfully-impressive ease. This last may get at the conundrum which gives rise to your observation: the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life. This statement is part fallacy and part fact.
Speaking for myself and from what I've observed: "...the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther..." I respectfully disagree. From a character's standpoint - general appearance, powerset and potential - I would feel confident in saying Storm is favorably regarded by the HEF. "..., only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did,..." Yes and ...not yes :) I think that when some of us have posted something suggesting that Ororo was a "nut bucket", or seeming to ridicule her by name for sitting in the little chair beside the large, imposing desk of authority where Wolverine was sitting, we weren't showing a dislike for Storm or blaming her directly for beginning sexual relations with Logan almost immediately after her annulled MARRIAGE or for showing something of a subservience by sitting in the small chair rather than the big desk. Referring to Ororo as if she were entirely to blame for this foolishness was something like a "shorthand method" of saying what we really thought and what comprises the "yes" portion of your statement. We weren't blaming Storm. She's a fictional comicbook character who exists because writers, editors, and illustrators bring her to life. We are therefore, blaming the writers, editors, and illustrators for the things we dislike in their depiction of Storm's character.
So, to the conundrum I mentioned earlier. There are those who looking at how easily Storm dispatched that armed force confronting her in the preview pages would regard those images as powerful and positive images of Storm's character. Then there are those of US who see this confrontation as a continuation of the x-writer's preference where Storm's interaction with black people - and black males in particular - is concerned. One person's treasured positive image of Ororo in action is another person's trashy negative image of white writer's depicting Ororo beating the hell out of black men yet another time.QuoteThe continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office,
Yes it does, and quite nicely too.Quotebut the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create,
I wouldn't put it past a smarty-pants writer who might happen to look in on the HEF from time to time and who upon viewing any negative image and accompanying derisive commentary to decide to troll us a bit by injecting more of the very type of activity we find distasteful into his/her stories. How many heterosexual black male mutants survive in the x-verse? How many of those enjoy exposure or a relationship with a female? How many bisexual or heterosexual black males have we seen in the x-verse while black female mutants like Joanna Cargill and Monet St Croix crave the attention of white male mutants? Do you remember what happened between Quentin Quire and the black male mutant "Slick"? Do you remember what "Slick's" girlfriend's reaction was after that incident?
Now, is it really fair to ask us to play nice with people who want to play us?
QuoteI send Marvel Entertainment positive images of black people every chance I get.What does this achieve exactly? It does nothing. I refuse to even attempt to get on a bus where I am not wanted. I would rather walk. Based on what they have done historically I'm good.
You are ASSUMING it does nothing. Have you ever tried it? If you did try it and you didn't get immediate results, you have to realize that the changes are not going to be immediate because we are battling DECADES of racist behaviors, racist ideas and racist attitudes, so the change WE WANT is not going to happen overnight.
If you DIDN'T try it, then how are you qualified to sit there and assume it won't achieve anything?
Does posting negative images of black people on message boards achieve anything, other than more negativity? Continuously posting negative images of fictional black women getting hit with hammers is not going to create positivity, because how would it?
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
But I realize all of this requires FAITH, POSITIVITY and OPTIMISM, which a lot of people in the comic book reading-public and a lot of people on message boards DO NOT HAVE, because their first immediate reaction is to be pessimistic and always expect the worst, but keep complaining when the worst happens because they refuse to do what is necessary to TRY and change things for the better.
It's always easy to be pessimistic, and negative, and to assume the worst, and to assume such-and-such method to try and change things for the better won't work, and to assume reaching out to companies to express our displeasure won't work, and to laugh and ridicule fictional black women for the ways in which they are written by white men and handled by white editors, but it requires a lot more patience, dedication, perseverance and a tough, unwielding, relentless mindset to do the dirty work and do what actually needs to be done in order for POSITIVE, PERMANENT changes to the comic book industry to happen.
It seems that it's always easier for a lot of people to spew hatred and venom at fictional black characters (male or female, for a variety of reasons) then to band together and support as many fictional black characters as they can.
The overall big picture is, if you want things to change, then you have to BE THE CHANGE and do what's necessary to change things instead of bickering, snickering, spewing hatred for fictional black women when we all know the same would NOT be done for a majority of fictional black men. Constantly complaining on message boards to people WHO ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEMS ARE changes nothing...it just reminds comic book readers what the problems are and just keeps feeding negativity. It's more logical to CONSTANTLY COMPLAIN TO THE COMPANIES THAT ARE ACTUALLY CONSTANTLY CAUSING THE PROBLEMS.
I'm a very positive person in my personal life.
However, I've come to terms with the fact that the mainstream comic book business is institutionally racist and as such, I expect nothing more from them other than the rubbish they've pushed for decades that denigrates anything that isn't lily white are Oreo'd.
QuoteI send Marvel Entertainment positive images of black people every chance I get.What does this achieve exactly? It does nothing. I refuse to even attempt to get on a bus where I am not wanted. I would rather walk. Based on what they have done historically I'm good.
You are ASSUMING it does nothing. Have you ever tried it? If you did try it and you didn't get immediate results, you have to realize that the changes are not going to be immediate because we are battling DECADES of racist behaviors, racist ideas and racist attitudes, so the change WE WANT is not going to happen overnight.
If you DIDN'T try it, then how are you qualified to sit there and assume it won't achieve anything?
Does posting negative images of black people on message boards achieve anything, other than more negativity? Continuously posting negative images of fictional black women getting hit with hammers is not going to create positivity, because how would it?
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
But I realize all of this requires FAITH, POSITIVITY and OPTIMISM, which a lot of people in the comic book reading-public and a lot of people on message boards DO NOT HAVE, because their first immediate reaction is to be pessimistic and always expect the worst, but keep complaining when the worst happens because they refuse to do what is necessary to TRY and change things for the better.
It's always easy to be pessimistic, and negative, and to assume the worst, and to assume such-and-such method to try and change things for the better won't work, and to assume reaching out to companies to express our displeasure won't work, and to laugh and ridicule fictional black women for the ways in which they are written by white men and handled by white editors, but it requires a lot more patience, dedication, perseverance and a tough, unwielding, relentless mindset to do the dirty work and do what actually needs to be done in order for POSITIVE, PERMANENT changes to the comic book industry to happen.
It seems that it's always easier for a lot of people to spew hatred and venom at fictional black characters (male or female, for a variety of reasons) then to band together and support as many fictional black characters as they can.
The overall big picture is, if you want things to change, then you have to BE THE CHANGE and do what's necessary to change things instead of bickering, snickering, spewing hatred for fictional black women when we all know the same would NOT be done for a majority of fictional black men. Constantly complaining on message boards to people WHO ALREADY KNOW WHAT THE PROBLEMS ARE changes nothing...it just reminds comic book readers what the problems are and just keeps feeding negativity. It's more logical to CONSTANTLY COMPLAIN TO THE COMPANIES THAT ARE ACTUALLY CONSTANTLY CAUSING THE PROBLEMS.
I'm a very positive person in my personal life.
However, I've come to terms with the fact that the mainstream comic book business is institutionally racist and as such, I expect nothing more from them other than the rubbish they've pushed for decades that denigrates anything that isn't lily white are Oreo'd.
I've also come to the terms that the mainstream comic book business is institutionally racist, but if we don't do anything to try and change that, then nothing is going to change and if comic books continue to exist, the generations that come AFTER us are going to be facing the exact same problems WE are facing right now.
And it's not just about US, it's about our kids and grandkids, etc. who might want to read comic books and will have to face the SAME EXACT fight we are facing now, because we didn't try and do anything to change things for the better.
By doing NOTHING except complaining on message boards, than constantly looking around for ways in which Marvel wronged non-white characters and non-white readers, we aren't doing anything constructive at all.
This is us:
Marvel pisses us off, we complain but do nothing, thus paving the way for Marvel to keep pissing us off. Then we pissed off at Marvel again because they pissed us off again because we paved the way for them to piss us off again.
We have been in this cycle for years, and it never gets us ANYWHERE. We're stuck because we do absolutely nothing of significance.
If we think that the people at Marvel (and DC) are going to wake up one day and suddenly say to themselves "Gee, we really need to stop being racist and treating non-white characters like crap!", that's most likely not going to happen. They will continue to push their pro-white, anti-non-white attitudes, beliefs and practices for as long as they are allowed to get away with it (as long as WE allow them to get away with it).
Since we all DO want change, we are going to have to FIGHT for it. If we don't put up a constant fight, then we will never win.
But a lot of us aren't even TRYING.
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
Much respect...but I think Marvel would respond more favorably to their black fans if instead of sending them a steady flow of positive images of blacks, we black fans rewarded any positive change in the portrayal of black characters and characters of color with our greenbacks.
I believe we had the best chance to do this by supporting Hudlin's BLACK PANTHER with Storm as Queen of Wakanda.
We see how that turned out.
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.
Much respect...but I think Marvel would respond more favorably to their black fans if instead of sending them a steady flow of positive images of blacks, we black fans rewarded any positive change in the portrayal of black characters and characters of color with our greenbacks.
I believe we had the best chance to do this by supporting Hudlin's BLACK PANTHER with Storm as Queen of Wakanda.
We see how that turned out.
That's what happens when you have a bunch of Benedict Arnold's masquerade as BP fans.
Yes, I am a fan of both, Genki Sudo,
and if you weren't so busy being so damn passive-aggressive in nearly all of your posts on here and CBR
you would probably learn a lot of things about how readers SHOULD handle Marvel whenever they have complaints against the company, or any comic book company that is not handling non-white characters they way they should be handled.
I don't and never have bought into this whole "Black Panther fans vs. Storm fans" bullsh*t that has permeated various websites for years.
That kind of mentality serves no useful purpose and just shows how we need to start acting like adults instead of "choosing sides."
And I'm not talking down to anyone
I'm speaking from my heart with what I feel is the truth.
If you think I'm talking down to you, than that says a lot more about you than it does me.
Don't blame me if you feel like you are being victimized by what I'm saying.
If anything, I'm trying to help not only me but you and everyone else, to try and get us all to do what we need to do.
But as usual you have chosen to express negativity, pessimism and outright stubborness while actually doing nothing to change anything.
And YOU are one of the posters who likes to spew venom at Storm
but would hop on your "Hooligan" bandwagon if anyone spewed venom at Black Panther.
In my eyes, that makes you a hypocrite.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been handled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a lot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman who made her own bizarre life choices as opposed to several white writers and several white editors MAKING her go down the paths they have shown her embarking on.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead if us gleefully posting images of Storm (a fictional African woman) getting her ass kicked, perhaps we should refrain from doing that, because we sure wouldn't be gleefully posting images of Black Panther (a fictional African man) getting his ass kicked, and laughing about it.
I think I've said this before, but the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life.
I think the amount of venom spewed from both fan bases (against the other fan base's favorite character) over the years over CHARACTERS WHO DON'T ACTUALLY EXIST is atrocious and doesn't help or solve anything...it just makes matters worse.
Meanwhile those who like to say they're fans of both like to try and talk down to everybody else while supporting current writers and editors who like the folks before them ain't worth a damn either and neither is this character who's only significance now that we are to "see as golden and what makes a character awesome" is a mohawk and the ability to electrocute folks with a tan
Storm aka the comic book version of Condi Rice
Yes, I am a fan of both, Genki Sudo, and if you weren't so busy being so damn passive-aggressive in nearly all of your posts on here and CBR you would probably learn a lot of things about how readers SHOULD handle Marvel whenever they have complaints against the company, or any comic book company that is not handling non-white characters they way they should be handled.
I don't and never have bought into this whole "Black Panther fans vs. Storm fans" bullsh*t that has permeated various websites for years. That kind of mentality serves no useful purpose and just shows how we need to start acting like adults instead of "choosing sides."
And I'm not talking down to anyone, I'm speaking from my heart with what I feel is the truth. If you think I'm talking down to you, than that says a lot more about you than it does me. Don't blame me if you feel like you are being victimized by what I'm saying. If anything, I'm trying to help not only me but you and everyone else, to try and get us all to do what we need to do.
But as usual you have chosen to express negativity, pessimism and outright stubborness while actually doing nothing to change anything.
And YOU are one of the posters who likes to spew venom at Storm, but would hop on your "Hooligan" bandwagon if anyone spewed venom at Black Panther. In my eyes, that makes you a hypocrite.
Instead of continuously posting images of Storm getting bashed in the face with Valkyrie's hammer and continuously posting negative images of Storm that we can just about all AGREE ON that these were not good looks for her character, can we PLEASE START POSTING POSITIVE IMAGES OF STORM?
The continuous posting of negative images just reinforces everything we see as wrong with the X-Office, but the more these negative images are continuously posted, the more negativity they will create, and the more these negative images invite the vocal bashing of Storm in this thread and several other threads on this site. I can understand the critiques and criticisms of how her character has been handled by various white writers and editors in the past, but a lot of this is still teetering in the territory of bashing Storm as though she is a real flesh-and-blood woman who made her own bizarre life choices as opposed to several white writers and several white editors MAKING her go down the paths they have shown her embarking on.
This is one of the MAIN problems with how Africans and African Americans are depicted...there are way too many negative images of us being floated around and posted, and there aren't enough POSITIVE images or depictions of us continuously being posted.
Instead if us gleefully posting images of Storm (a fictional African woman) getting her ass kicked, perhaps we should refrain from doing that, because we sure wouldn't be gleefully posting images of Black Panther (a fictional African man) getting his ass kicked, and laughing about it.
I think I've said this before, but the Black Panther fan base is slowly but surely becoming just like the many Storm fans who dislike Black Panther, only a lot of the Black Panther fan base seems to dislike Storm because of stuff that past WRITERS and EDITORS did, and not because of something that the CHARACTERS actually did themselves, as though they are real people in real life.
I think the amount of venom spewed from both fan bases (against the other fan base's favorite character) over the years over CHARACTERS WHO DON'T ACTUALLY EXIST is atrocious and doesn't help or solve anything...it just makes matters worse.
Meanwhile those who like to say they're fans of both like to try and talk down to everybody else while supporting current writers and editors who like the folks before them ain't worth a damn either and neither is this character who's only significance now that we are to "see as golden and what makes a character awesome" is a mohawk and the ability to electrocute folks with a tan
Storm aka the comic book version of Condi Rice
Yes, I am a fan of both, Genki Sudo, and if you weren't so busy being so damn passive-aggressive in nearly all of your posts on here and CBR you would probably learn a lot of things about how readers SHOULD handle Marvel whenever they have complaints against the company, or any comic book company that is not handling non-white characters they way they should be handled.
I don't and never have bought into this whole "Black Panther fans vs. Storm fans" bullsh*t that has permeated various websites for years. That kind of mentality serves no useful purpose and just shows how we need to start acting like adults instead of "choosing sides."
And I'm not talking down to anyone, I'm speaking from my heart with what I feel is the truth. If you think I'm talking down to you, than that says a lot more about you than it does me. Don't blame me if you feel like you are being victimized by what I'm saying. If anything, I'm trying to help not only me but you and everyone else, to try and get us all to do what we need to do.
But as usual you have chosen to express negativity, pessimism and outright stubborness while actually doing nothing to change anything.
And YOU are one of the posters who likes to spew venom at Storm, but would hop on your "Hooligan" bandwagon if anyone spewed venom at Black Panther. In my eyes, that makes you a hypocrite.
I'm not sure how I missed this post but here are my thoughts on the subject.
Any "venom that's being spewed at Storm" should be seen as justified dissaproval aimed squarely at the current arbiters of her character within the X-books as well as the so-called fans who have been more than happy to sit back while her character has been systematically slutted out and generally made to look like a straight up fool within said X-books post AvX.
Practically all of the BP enthusiasts that I know on and offline, celebrated Ororo' awesomness and elevated importance within the 616 MU under Reginald Hudlin's pen and saw her as a solid counterpoint to T'Challa as a olidly humanizing character who was never afraid to steer her husband in the right direction.
We revered her character and loved what both Hudlin and McDuffie did with the Royal Couple across the Black Panther and Fantastic Four books that both of these magnificent writers were responible for writing at the time.
Mr Hudlin had Ororo being a total BOSS putting Tony Stark and Reed Richards in their respective places during the Marvel Civil War long before some X-Wankster had her mouthing this "X-Men are elite" BS recently, so let's not get too carried away here.
I personally hate X-related product and the office that spews forth the X-related filth that stinks up and derails every other part of the 616 MU that it touches.
I see the X-Office as being a hotbed of creators who are virulently anti the positive portrayal of Black heterosexual characters (specifically Black males) and definitely anti-Black heteroexual relationship and as such, I have zero time for anyone championing the support of product that disrepects things that I personally feel very trongly about.
Genki Sudo (like yourself) is consistent and forthright with his opinions on the way Storm has been handled and like myself, remains resolute in not giving Marvel any monies spent on product that blatantly disrespects us with each and every publication that emanates from within the X-office.
He is no hypocrite.
You are ASSUMING it does nothing. Have you ever tried it? If you did try it and you didn't get immediate results, you have to realize that the changes are not going to be immediate because we are battling DECADES of racist behaviors, racist ideas and racist attitudes, so the change WE WANT is not going to happen overnight.
If you DIDN'T try it, then how are you qualified to sit there and assume it won't achieve anything?
Does posting negative images of black people on message boards achieve anything, other than more negativity? Continuously posting negative images of fictional black women getting hit with hammers is not going to create positivity, because how would it?
Sending positive imagery of black people to Marvel will get THEM used to seeing positive images if black people, and if THEY continue seeing positive images of black people on a CONTINUOUS basis, then HOPEFULLY change will come for the better for all non-white readers, because hopefully Marvel will get the hint and start portraying ALL non-white fictional characters in the same way that they feature the majority of their white fictional characters...IN THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE.While you’re doing that, you’re ignoring some writers and companies that are doing that already. We as a base should make them work to get our support, not the other way around.
But I realize all of this requires FAITH, POSITIVITY and OPTIMISM, which a lot of people in the comic book reading-public and a lot of people on message boards DO NOT HAVE, because their first immediate reaction is to be pessimistic and always expect the worst, but keep complaining when the worst happens because they refuse to do what is necessary to TRY and change things for the better.
It's always easy to be pessimistic, and negative, and to assume the worst, and to assume such-and-such method to try and change things for the better won't work, and to assume reaching out to companies to express our displeasure won't work, and to laugh and ridicule fictional black women for the ways in which they are written by white men and handled by white editors, but it requires a lot more patience, dedication, perseverance and a tough, unwielding, relentless mindset to do the dirty work and do what actually needs to be done in order for POSITIVE, PERMANENT changes to the comic book industry to happen in terms of how non-white characters are portrayed.For over 75 years they haven’t shown any true sense of characterization of PoC. Not even 3D characters. It is either they are Sidney Poitier or John Shaft; there is no middl