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Show Bizness => Latest Flicks => Topic started by: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 06:31:44 am

Title: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 06:31:44 am: in the 30's right now on RT

This seemed like a fool proof movie to me. Wonder what the hell happened?
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 03, 2016, 04:44:27 pm: Some of the scuttlebutt out there right now is that WB got real skittish about the performance of Batman v. Superman and wound up screwing up Suicide Squad in their efforts to insure a bonafide hit.

http://io9.gizmodo.com/report-warner-bros-turned-suicide-squad-into-a-mess-i-1784760580 (http://io9.gizmodo.com/report-warner-bros-turned-suicide-squad-into-a-mess-i-1784760580)
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 05:14:14 pm: Also saw in a link that the first trailers were actually nothing like the movie, so the reshoots were trying to make it match teh "fun" of the trailers.

WB has no idea what its doing... its a shame. This could have been a very unique comic book movie
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: KIP LEWIS on August 03, 2016, 05:30:43 pm: Quote from: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 06:31:44 am
in the 30's right now on RT

This seemed like a fool proof movie to me. Wonder what the hell happened?

It's a DC movie?😀
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 05, 2016, 05:05:00 pm: Saw this film twice. Not as bad as the critics say. It does have problems for sure but still the idea that its the worst comic book film or one of the worst films is crazy.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: CKW on August 06, 2016, 07:31:54 am: The movie started off disjointed but became enjoyable as it progressed.

Amanda Waller stood out for me because that character is one evil (watch your mouth).
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: BlackRodimus on August 06, 2016, 03:19:31 pm: I haven't seen it yet but a friend whose opinion I trust says it has the same pacing problems as BvS but that's about it, its otherwise enjoyable and fun.

I'll make it a point to catch it before it leaves theaters.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 08, 2016, 05:16:58 am: A list of rumored deleted scenes from Suicide Squad.

http://comicbook.com/dc/2016/08/06/suicide-squad-rumored-list-of-deleted-scenes-revealed/ (http://comicbook.com/dc/2016/08/06/suicide-squad-rumored-list-of-deleted-scenes-revealed/)
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: APEXABYSS on August 09, 2016, 09:49:16 am: Quote from: KIP LEWIS on August 03, 2016, 05:30:43 pm
Quote from: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 06:31:44 am
in the 30's right now on RT

This seemed like a fool proof movie to me. Wonder what the hell happened?

It's a DC movie?😀

Yep, checked out SS Saturday night. Uh... it was alright. I honestly thought it was gonna be like “The Watchmen.” It was nothing like The Watchmen. DC made Watchmen a meal but made SS fast-food. Pardon my villainous tastes. You can count on a sequel (just to get it right) or a “Joker” movie. I mentioned a Joker film years ago. Platinum grill? Anywhu,... Go see it! You decide!

Rorschach: “None of you seem to understand. I'm not locked in here with you. You're locked in here with ME!”

I can’t remember many quotables from SS. Still, enough highlights to enjoy the film. Diablo? The brother & sister duo reminded me of a BP & Shuri tag team. I grow weary of minion armies randomly used for action & a body count.

After the show, we went back to my cousin’s new apartment & played Mortal Combat. Mortal Combat was better. The trash talking between us was even better. “That ni@@a got on some dyke flip flops!” Whu…huh?
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Reginald Hudlin on August 10, 2016, 12:14:42 am: I had a good time. My kids had an even better time. No, it's not in WINTER SOLDIER/BATMAN BEGINS territory, but certainly better than the reviews indicate. It is top five for my kids though.

Will Smith is great in the movie. A real return to form for him, and I'm happy about that.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Hypestyle on August 10, 2016, 11:28:14 am: I haven't seen it yet. I'm still torn. I wanted Will to be a hero in the DC Universe, John Stewart! Alas, it won't happen. Also, due to corporate culture, I'm sure he won't be a Marvel character anytime soon (Blue Marvel! Okay, get Denzel!).

I guess a Deadshot film isn't out of the question, a prequel film or a sequel from here. Just set him against some people who are "worse" than him, even though I'm sure he's killed some "good" folks in the past.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Reginald Hudlin on August 10, 2016, 09:01:36 pm: Quote from: Hypestyle on August 10, 2016, 11:28:14 am
I haven't seen it yet. I'm still torn. I wanted Will to be a hero in the DC Universe, John Stewart! Alas, it won't happen. Also, due to corporate culture, I'm sure he won't be a Marvel character anytime soon (Blue Marvel! Okay, get Denzel!).

I guess a Deadshot film isn't out of the question, a prequel film or a sequel from here. Just set him against some people who are "worse" than him, even though I'm sure he's killed some "good" folks in the past.
I always thought Will should be John Stewart. I hope they offered him the part over and over and over again.

But he could still be a Marvel character at some point.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 14, 2016, 05:07:18 pm: I agree about Will for John Stewart. I wish Will or DC/WB had arrived at having Smith star as Stewart as GL several years ago. I mean we might be three movies in by now and Stewart's profile would be so upped in the comics and perhaps more importantly across the mainstream.

Someone had suggested a Deadshot movie. I don't see that happening though I would be down for it; Smith was one of the best things about the film, I was surprised because I thought he was going to be more of supporting player propping up Margot Robbie's Harley Quinn. The box office isn't great for Suicide Squad so I can't see them doing a solo film for him. It would be cool though if DC did one-shot short films like Marvel has done so that maybe we could see more of Deadshot and how he became an assassin. Also I wouldn't mind seeing that for other members as well. I'm surprised DC didn't do tie-in comics for the film doing something like that.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Vic Vega on August 14, 2016, 08:36:52 pm: Suicide Squad was NOWHERE near as bad as I had been led to believe.

The main problem is the villain.

The other problem is that they have commited to DC debuting Batman foes
and such before Batman ever gets a movie.

So every time they interduce a new character they have to have DCU guidebook
entry scene where they explain who these characters are.

And everything stops dead.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Reginald Hudlin on August 14, 2016, 11:16:40 pm: There's also a humor problem in the DCCU. Marvel can have a fun time in the films while maintaining serious stakes. Deadpool went even further.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: TripleX on August 16, 2016, 11:53:59 pm: I loved it, I've seen it 3 times in 3d. It's all style over substance, but I was here for that. The only real problem was with the way it was edited. One more pass by another set of eyes could have tightened it up and made it a truly great movie. As it is it's my favorite DC film to date.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 19, 2016, 12:22:25 pm: Finally got around to seeing this...

Its isn't a "bad" movie per say (on the comic book/blockbuster scale). It had two really, really, really glaring issues

1. The Joker. Jesus, what the hell was that?

2. The second villain. Enchantress. W. T. F.

And I say second villain becauset his movie had possibly the worst and possibly the best comic book villains in it at the same time because... my god Amanda Waller was MEAN. Holy sh*t. I try my best not to label a woman as a bitch but no other description fits her at all. When she
Spoiler (click to reveal)
offed those other agents
i was just like WTF holy sh*t. She had a set of brass balls on her that was unmatched. Christ.

But... back to Enchantress a bit... that was terrible.

Thor: The Dark World is actually one of my favorite movies despite the flaws. And I recognize those flaws but for me, certain things out weigh that. One fo those flaws was Malekith, who an incredibly generic and thin villain.

Compared to Enchantress, Malekith was f*cking Loki. They both had the same generic plan, but Malekith's at least made some damn sense and at least his henchmen (Kurse) was cool AF. Incubis or whatever looked like Sci Fi channel CGI and was a sh*t show.

I don't even understand what Enchantress was doing. Casting some big ass spell to... wipe out the military? Wut? I mean sh*t... her brother was damn near invinsible and she could teleport at light speed...she could have taken out the military one by one herself.

And that ending... "alright, im an all powerful witch, lets fight hand to hand! oh no,
Spoiler (click to reveal)
you cut out my heart and now I suddenly can't move despite being able to still have magical powers without my heart as shown earlier in the movie!

And if you want to continue the Thor 2 analogy.... Joker was Darcy. Seriously.

Ok, one more thing to complain about...
Spoiler (click to reveal)
Batman attacking deadshot in front of his kid? Da f*ck?????

BUUUUTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

the movie was still fun and solid. Deadshot was great. Harley was ok. IDK why Katana was there. I liked Flagg. Boomerang seemed useless but was funny ish. Diablo im on the fence about but ok. It had its moments.

And of all the talk about "dark gritty DC!" this was essentially a subpar Marvel movie (henchmen to dispose of, quips!, world destruction).

This was leagues better than BvS. This movie at least had fun with itself despite the problems.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Curtis Metcalf on August 20, 2016, 04:45:28 pm: My name is Curtis Metcalf and I approve this review. 100% consign.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 21, 2016, 07:17:43 am: I saw this film three times. I get a lot of the criticism but also some of the positives. I mostly liked it, though I did have issues with it.

Enchantress was the weakest link. I wish they had gone with a stronger, older actress like Charlize Theron, but if you had gotten Theron it would've likely overshadowed Margot Robbie. I thought the Enchantress actress was too young to play a scientist. She wasn't terrible, but still hinging so much of the film on her and her relationship with Rick Flagg, I think that was a mistake. And I wish there had been a better motivation and explanation for how she was going to destroy the world. I thought Enchantress was too powerful for the Squad to go against. None of them, on paper, had the ability to stop her, until we did see what Diablo really could do; however there was no sign that Waller even knew that Diablo could do that, or that he was more than what he seemed.

I also thought the dancing stuff Enchantress was doing was silly, perhaps unintentionally silly. And her fighting the Squad before pulling back and using magic to disarm all them made no sense. I mean why waste time like that? It was just to add more action to the film without being organic to the character. I also found it a little hard to swallow that the Squad was so worthy that Enchantress decided to spare them and wanted them to serve her. Why not just turn them into zombies to accomplish that?

I did like her look though. I thought the production and FX there was mostly good. I did like how Incubus was rendered for the most part and wish that Apocalypse had been that size for the X-Men film. And while I generally thought Incubus was cool, it seemed odd that they used a relatively unknown actor to play that role. Common (who I thought would be Tattooed Man) was wasted and seems to me that he should have played Incubus, instead of wasted as a throwaway character Monster T. Granted, I did like the name Monster T. I would like to have seen more with him and his relationship with the Joker. Was he a rival, a subordinate, partner, or what?

Will Smith was surprisingly one of the best things about the film. At first it was hard for me to buy him as Deadshot. I thought his civilian outfit looked odd, like out of time, a holdover from the 70s. And I was thinking early on that the film could've easily switched roles between Deadshot and Rick Flagg. That being said, Smith was good, I wound up liking him, and he had the biggest bad ass moment in the film when he took out all those zombies.

Conversely, Margot Robbie didn't wow me. I was expecting that she and Captain Boomerang would be the breakout characters, but I felt Robbie's performance was uneven and that she didn't quite own the role. Though at times she got the accent and the attitude right, but it was hard for me to believe she was Harley. I also didn't like how Waller initially described her as being crazier and more fearless than the Joker. I felt that unnecessary and wrong to attempt to prop up Harley that way. No one should be crazier than Joker in the DC universe period. After reading about some of the behind-the-scenes problems I think the studio interfered too much and cut out too much from the film regarding Harley and Joker and their abusive relationship, perhaps to make a more casual audience friendly film, and Harley suffered as a result. Two of my favorite scenes with Harley was when she was looking through her old costumes, with a very appropriate Eminem song playing in the background, and when she told Diablo to own what he did. I thought those showed her potential as a character, the manic glee but also the darkness. And I really loved seeing Robbie in the traditional Harley costume in that flashback. And overall I think Robbie did look like the New 52 version of the character a great deal. So physically she nailed it, and sometimes acting wise she got it. Though from what was presented in this film I don't think it was strong enough to support the pre-movie buzz of a Harley Quinn solo film.

Boomerang was also a disappointment. I was hoping for a rude, crude, racist, sexist, cowardly character. There were glimmers but the film soft pedaled it. When Flagg released them in the bar and Boomerang bounced I really liked that because that felt right for his character. But it was inexplicable why he came back like a scene later, and no one questioned him on it.

I can accept that both Diablo and Killer Croc were stereotypically depicted, however I think they did a good job showing that Diablo had some complexity and Jay Hernandez did a good job making us care about Diablo, though I thought they should've had him add the ink after the tragedy instead of before. I liked the makeup for Killer Croc but he didn't get much to do, and it seems like the bomb under the flooded tunnel was added in there just to give him something to do. He needed more screen time for me to buy him as the 'urban, hood, hip-hop' kind of character. I didn't find him that offensive, but more so under cooked. Katana also didn't get enough time. She had a cool look, but the film didn't really do much with her mystical sword despite fighting a mystical enemy. I wouldn't mind if Slipknot had gotten a couple lines of dialogue but I wasn't mad about it because I was thinking that him and Diablo would be the most expendable when I first saw the lineup.

I'm iffy on Amanda Waller. First Viola Davis was a great choice. However she played her so cold, so unblinking it was hard to get into her at first. Plus she felt a bit more villainous to me than I was expecting. Sure Waller is ruthless, but she is a patriot and is doing things for what she perceives the greater good. Here it felt a bit different. But that being said, after watching the film for the third time I read New Suicide Squad Volume 3 and that depiction of Waller was pretty similar so my 'issues' were born from my mis-perception perhaps of the movie Waller not quite being true to the comics. The movie's Waller reminded me a bit of Arrow's take on the character. I also wonder why Waller, or this Waller, relies on generally powerful white men, including Bruce Wayne, in order to operate. Perhaps she uses the government to cover her plans, but still it stuck out to me that she derived her power from white men so her badassness was conditioned on white support; I guess its no different than how she has always been, but it did just stick out to me.

I was also iffy on Rick Flagg. I didn't think Kinnaman (sp) was the best choice for Flagg when I heard he got the role. There's something oily about him that didn't square with the All-American kind of character I thought Flagg was. And when I heard Scott Eastwood was going to be in the film I thought he would've worked better as Flagg. But now after seeing the film I was okay with Flagg. He and his relationship didn't get enough focus but he did try to sell it. I also liked Flagg and Deadshot's relationship.

The backup team. I get why they are there. More expendable characters, but if you got this team it reduces the Squad's importance. The Squad should only have been there for a truly desperate situation. I mean the whole point was to have a covert Taskforce X that does dirty, secret stuff that the government can disavow, so why send them into Midway City? If CNN was on hand for Doomsday in Batman v. Superman, wouldn't they be on hand for Midway City? And is it possible that CNN or another media outlet would catch some glimpse of the Squad? And where was Batman, Flash, or other heroes to take on Enchantress? She was way too powerful for the Squad to take on, especially in there first movie. One of the things that I think made Deadpool work was that the stakes were relatively small. And it was very simple to understand. A guy is trying to save the woman he loves from the man who turned him into a monster. Simple.

To me, Suicide Squad should've had a lower level villain to face, in terms of power, and not a world ending threat. Because now where do you go after that?

All that being said, like I said before, I did like this film, even if it doesn't seem like I did. I thought the costuming was good across the board. I also think Squad has one of the best-if not the best-comic book movie soundtrack. Hopefully Marvel will also take note. I also liked the crooked Belle Reve security guard. The first time I watched the film I thought it was a mistake not to have Deadshot get the revenge he promised on the dude, but on subsequent viewings I liked the guy more and am okay he wasn't killed. He was often the boorish kind of character Captain Boomerang should have been.

I also liked the Joker. I can accept the criticism that he was barely in the film. But from what I saw I liked for the most part. He felt more 'real' to me than any other live-action Joker. I liked his style, and his performance because that's what it was. The Joker is a performer and that worked for me. Like Jack Nicholson's version once described himself as a homicidal artist, I got that sense from Leto's Joker. We didn't see enough of it, and the reedits mangled his relationship with Harley-the studio seeming reluctant to actually let these villains-including the Joker-actually be bad. Leto's Joker fit Affleck's Batman. So I'm looking forward to seeing those two go at it, but I would really like it if it was a R-rated film. Perhaps even another take on The Killing Joke, but better than the recent animated film.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 21, 2016, 07:52:28 am: Overall the movie was solid and entertaining.

I think you could pick it apart, puece by piece, to death though if i really really wanted to. It didnt take itself too seriously so i can forgive it more than say BvS.

Soundtrack wise... eh, why should marvel take notes when it just copied marvels style lol. This was GoG lite. I wish it would have been GoG R rated tho... these people are not inheritedly good like GoG. In fact, their psychopaths but they kept trying this heart of semi gold crap lol.

And ill never loke this joker. In fact, i think its the opposite for me.... if all he is is s high level gang banger then batpunisher woukda murked him by now lol
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 21, 2016, 09:27:46 am: Regarding the soundtrack in comparison to Guardians, yes and no. The music played in the film, for the most part, yes it took the GotG approach, but the actual soundtrack (and they did play some of those songs in the film) is what I'm getting at. If anything Suicide Squad should've played the soundtrack they had instead of doing the easy thing of picking very popular songs that almost everyone knew. It worked well for Guardians and illustrated who Quill was and his relationship with his mother, the use of the old songs-while some where appropriate-wasn't as necessary in Squad, not when they had a soundtrack, of mostly original music that they could use. If anything the rap/rock songs were more contemporary and fresher and with the Squad being more appealing to younger viewers it was a miscalculation to go with the moldy songs.

I do think the film should've been R-rated though. It was like it was straining against the PG-13 rating and a likely studio mandate that the Squad all had to be essentially lovable or likeable characters except for Slipknot who was killed right off the bat.

As for Joker, that's the question that remains. Why hasn't Batman killed him? So there's got to be more to this Joker, similar to other Jokers that bedevils Batman. I liked Leto's Joker because he felt more real, the music, the clothing, the scenery around him. Not knocking the other Jokers at all, but Leto's felt more contemporary, in style of dress, with the tattoos, etc.

Another issue I did have with Suicide Squad was I was confused at times by how much time has passed in the film. I wonder how far back Batman caught Harley, and how that all played into the death of Robin. Can we assume that Batman only started killing after the death of Robin, or was he always a killer in this universe? And with Harley being implicated in Robin's death, why did this Batman revive her? Did he also see her as a victim of the Joker as well? I'm assuming Joker will be in the solo Batman film so I hope they come up with a good explanation why Batman hasn't killed this guy by then.

I liked BvS. I think Suicide Squad flowed a little better, however I thought BvS didn't deserve the critical hate it received. That being said, its depiction of Batman might provide some issues going forward. I was looking at the Justice League trailer again last night and I could see they are trying to transition Bruce into a lighter take on Batman, compared to BvS. I can understand it storyline wise in light of him changing to honor Superman's sacrifice, but still it felt off to me after seeing him vengeful, brutish, and mowing down people in BvS. Man of Steel and BvS set a definite, darker tone for this world and Suicide Squad, which should fit perfectly within that kind of world, WB/DC pulled back. I could see them doing that as well for Justice League.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 22, 2016, 05:19:32 am: For me, it felt like BvS was trying to hard, so it made all there mistakes (in my eyes) that much more irritating and glaring. I think it deserved its critical bashing because, based purely on the "how well was this movie made..." it was a damn mess. And so so so bloated. Plus, the movie had a distinct lack of fun to distract from anything. I don't hate it... I don't think its a good movie but I don't hate it. Weirdly... I still think MoS is the most cohesive movie of the 3 honestly.

but back to SS

I agree on the time thing. The whole timing of this whole universe is just bizarre. I know DC didn't want to "copy" Marvel by slow building ot the Justice League but man... thsi universe would feel so much more fleshed out right now AND we wouldn't get flash backs constantly that brought the movie to a standstill. DCEU is just rushing so hard and so fast towards JL for whatever reason. Things would have been so so so much smoother if they just went MoS, Batman, Wonder Woman, BvS, Suicide Squad, JL. You wouldn't even have to do the whole league. The internet wouldn't have to guess why Bruce kills or why Joker is alive or why this or why that because we would have seen it.

And yes, this needed an R rating to pull off what they wanted. This aren't heart of gold villains. Deadshot is an assassin, Harley murders for fun. Diablo used his powers to gangbang and then murdered his family on accident. They said (I think) that Croc asked to be put there but he was shown eating and killing people in the montage. Instead of the incredibly forced "we are family" BS, they should have just focused on their own selfish reasons for finishing the mission.

And having Boomerang run away was hilarious...... having him show up 2 seconds later for no apparent reason was bizarre. Add in the fact he was generally useless anyway and I wouldn't have minded him just running away and not coming back period.

And you are right about Flagg... I didn't get "all American soldier" vibe out of him, I got a "mercenary" vibe instead.

Another thing i found hilarious is that this team was put together in case another "Superman" showed up that wasn't good.... this team would have been turned the paste by anything approaching Superman's level lol. This team was essentially "normal humans plus Diablo." Is there no one else in the DC comics lore that could have added to the strength of this team?

Also, is there no other villain that would have been on this teams true level? Deathstroke perhaps? My DC knowledge isn't super high

But, just to reitterate, it was an enjoyable movie, worth the 10 bucks. I did just happen to watch GoG last night and my god, GoG was so much better though lol.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 22, 2016, 04:16:30 pm: I've been getting into DC comics more over the last several years and I would say yeah there are more power level appropriate villains for the Squad to face. You already mentioned Deathstroke which would've been a great choice. I'm no DC head like that, but pulling it right from my head here goes:

-Baron Bedlam
-Masters of Disaster
-Manchester Black and the Elite
-Court of Owls
-HIVE
-Vandal Savage
-Ra's Al Ghul, Talia, Nyssa, Lady Shiva, Sensei, all League of Assassins
-The League, which was a splinter group
-Kobra (a fanatical cult)
-Basilisk-an organization the Squad fought in the New 52 comics
-Queen Bee
-Count Vertigo
-Order of St. Dumas
-Maxwell Lord

There was another team the Squad fought called the Jihad. I had to look up the name to make sure it was right. That might be a topical, though problematic enemy but still provide a better match up than what we got against Enchantress.

I do think the film might have worked better too if they had sent the Squad on a mission to a DC country like Santa Prisca, Markovia, or Casnia. Also, thinking of what you said, the whole rationale of the Squad stopping Superman doesn't make sense in terms of the movie's lineup. Especially this version of Superman who has little qualms about killing if he has too. Only Enchantress, Incubus, and Diablo were any threats to Superman due to their magical based powers. Perhaps they should have had Waller pitch something like there's a superhuman arms race and we need to have our own. Further, I would have had a 'day' team (the Justice League of America, which in the New 52 was purposely designed to take down the Justice League) and a 'night' team, which is Taskforce X to do the real dirty work. Granted it makes no sense to create a JSA before the League, but DC could perhaps use a patriotic team like the Freedom Fighters to be the public, officially government backed team and then the Squad is the unofficial team.

Edited. I added Secret Society and Secret Six as potential adversaries. Also threw in a link to Justice League of America.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Frederick_DeLamb_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Frederick_DeLamb_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Masters_of_Disaster_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Masters_of_Disaster_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Jihad (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Jihad)
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Kobra_Cult (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Kobra_Cult)
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/The_Elite_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/The_Elite_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Basilisk_(Prime_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Basilisk_(Prime_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/H.I.V.E._(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/H.I.V.E._(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Queen_Bee_II_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Queen_Bee_II_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Freedom_Fighters_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Freedom_Fighters_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Werner_Zytle_(Prime_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Werner_Zytle_(Prime_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Order_of_St._Dumas (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Order_of_St._Dumas)
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Maxwell_Lord_IV_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Maxwell_Lord_IV_(New_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Justice_League_of_America_(Prime_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Justice_League_of_America_(Prime_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Secret_Society_of_Super-Villains_(Prime_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Secret_Society_of_Super-Villains_(Prime_Earth))
http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Secret_Six_(Villains_United) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Secret_Six_(Villains_United))
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 22, 2016, 04:32:49 pm: I hate to admit it but I agree that Man of Steel was more cohesive than Batman v. Superman or Suicide Squad. Outside of Christopher Nolan's influence I wonder if MOS was the only DCEU film thus far that really gave the director a free hand in creating their vision. I didn't care for a lot of that vision, but still it didn't seem that MOS was as interfered with as BvS and SS. I think Snyder did get to put a good deal of his vision in BvS, but for that film I was thinking of interference in terms of all the expectations the film had on it, that MOS didn't have. And also SS got a lot of expectations dumped on it due to the 'failure' of BvS, that didn't help SS at all as a film. To me it wasn't supposed to be a link in the chain, but a side story to widen the universe but not a building block necessarily in that universe-outside of introducing Joker and Harley Quinn, possibly Amanda Waller for future appearances in other DCEU films.

I do get why WB is accelerating their approach. I think they are trying to get the money while the getting is good before audiences sour on comic book films. Granted they have no one to blame for themselves. For decades they owned comic book movies but were too slow to realize the gold mine they were sitting on and when they did the MCU was already underway and I wonder if WB suits felt that the audience wouldn't be as patient for them to slow roll their characters through a series of intro/origin films ahead of the big Justice League movie. And I can get that because the Trinity has nearly universal name recognition in a way that many MCU characters didn't, before their movies became massive hits. So in a way DC didn't need to do another origin film for Batman or Superman at least because everyone on the planet just about knows the basic origin. And as for branding I think DC has some advantages there, with the symbols of Flash, Aquaman, Wonder Woman, and so on being something easily marketed and perhaps recognizable by that alone for a good deal of average people, and especially for comic book fans. That's not saying that an average person might not know much beyond the lightning symbol stands for Flash, but still that's one less hoop WB would have to go through in terms of an introduction.

DC's live-action shows, animations, and cartoon movies also helped push their characters, however WB has not taken full advantage of that when it came to movies. I can get DC wanting to do a big team up film in a way first because of the popularity of the Trinity. And then you branch out and introduce lesser well known characters. Wonder Woman has extremely high name recognition though I doubt many know much of her origins and even less of her villains and supporting cast. So I get it. However BvS just didn't deliver what people wanted. WB/DCEU so far hasn't show the dexterity that the Marvel films have shown in terms of being funny, crowd pleasing, rousing, and sometimes emotional. The Marvel films hit a lot of buttons. That being said, I think the Marvel approach has grown a bit stale and I sense a hesitancy to really push the envelope because Disney wants to sit on those billion dollar properties and not upset the apple cart. I will give WB/DC credit for taking more risks, even if those risks didn't pay off.

As for Guardians, I'm not a fan of that film. Its well made and well acted, but I don't really care about any of the characters. The comedy was too obvious and expected, and even the emotional stuff though I do think they pulled that off well enough. It was a bit too telegraphed. I think Marvel gets that people want heart in these movies, in a way DC has not gotten that yet. But in comparing Guardians to Squad, I liked Squad more. Some of my liking for SS might be that I read the Squad comics and I like a lot of Squad members, so I am biased here, but still I would rather watch Squad again than Guardians.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 23, 2016, 05:31:14 am: 1st... thanks for the wiki links. I always try to get into DC comics but then fall out of it when they start doing events and cross overs. I simply don't care about enough of the heroes to care about mega events (which is the opposite of Marvel). So I end up just reading Batman and maybe Aquaman.

My issue with WB is that they say they are taking risks and that their movies are "director based" and there is no house style... but the last two movies the WB higher ups went in and edited the hell out of the movie. Oh also... Snyder is a hack when it comes to "deep sh*t"... if he would just focus on making a fun, action oriented comic book movie, and I think he would knock it out of the park bc visually he is a beast. That is why I am still excited about JL because I think he will pull back and just tell a "basic" story without stupid metaphors and analogies that don't work and just focus on good guys punching bad guys with cool action. JL is basically going to be Avengers-ish (alien comes to earth with minions to punch)... so it has to nail the hero to hero interactions and the action (like Avengers) and I thiiiiiink Snyder can do that.

The Trinity does have tons of name recognition... and I think they could have used that to create solos that make just as much as Marvel's movies. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman all have a high enough name recognition to make Iron Man 3 money IMO. Especially Batman as he is already a proven commodity. I don't think they needed to rush to Justice League because they solos have so much more potential money wise than Thor, IM, and Captain America did. But even going MoS, The Batman, Wonder Woman, BvS, SS, JL would have been made BvS more coherent without pushing the time line back too far.

Or maybe I am just bitter we missed all of Batman's career lol. Hell, just give me a Batman Universe and I will be happy. I don't want hints or flashbacks to Jason getting crowbared... I want to see it on screen. Instead, we will probably get some Under the Red Hood adaptation that has movie halting flashbacks every 20 minutes because thats what WB loves to do.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Battle on August 23, 2016, 10:51:20 am: Quote from: KIP LEWIS on August 03, 2016, 05:30:43 pm
Quote from: MindofShadow on August 03, 2016, 06:31:44 am
in the 30's right now on RT

This seemed like a fool proof movie to me. Wonder what the hell happened?

It's a DC movie?😀

THERE YA GO!
(http://boards.theforce.net/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/old/4.gif)(http://www.hudlinentertainment.com/smf/Themes/default/images/post/thumbup.gif)
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Vic Vega on August 23, 2016, 12:53:00 pm: Re: The Joker.

Every movie version of the Joker (even Ceasar Romero, lol) had henchpersons.

What changes is how competant those henchpeople are. in the 60's they could barely walk and chew
gum at the same time. In the aughts they were a collection of oddities, like tall dude, sword dude and...Bob The Goon(remember him? He even had an action figure! Why I don't know).

Ledger's goons were accomplished Bank heisters before he killed them all. They he killed some rival hoods and everybody else just fell in line because...I don't know why actually.

This Joker is a freaky weirdo, but he's an VERY WELL ORGANIZED freaky weirdo.

This version of the Joker is sane enough to have what looks like at least one high end lawyer working for him (the dude that told him that Harley was in Belle Reve and informants(somebody had to tell Joker that the Belle Reve guard was a degenerate gambler) as well as a small army of gunmen (including dudes who can operate an attack helicoper).

This Joker is almost like a nuttier and more flamboyant version of the Kingpin except without the veneer of respectability.

But what surprised me the most is that this version of Joker actually cares about Harley Quinn in a effed up
Bonnie and Clyde kind of way.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 23, 2016, 01:08:39 pm: i actually thought the hench people were cool ish

I literally just don't like how he was acted and his mannerisms and his stupid ass look.

Nor the cuck sh*t lol
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Hypestyle on August 23, 2016, 01:29:07 pm: spoilers
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--- did Common really have to do this role? It seems he was kind of wasted. Yeah, literally.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 23, 2016, 03:05:48 pm: Quote from: MindofShadow on August 23, 2016, 05:31:14 am
1st... thanks for the wiki links. I always try to get into DC comics but then fall out of it when they start doing events and cross overs. I simply don't care about enough of the heroes to care about mega events (which is the opposite of Marvel). So I end up just reading Batman and maybe Aquaman.

My issue with WB is that they say they are taking risks and that their movies are "director based" and there is no house style... but the last two movies the WB higher ups went in and edited the hell out of the movie. Oh also... Snyder is a hack when it comes to "deep sh*t"... if he would just focus on making a fun, action oriented comic book movie, and I think he would knock it out of the park bc visually he is a beast. That is why I am still excited about JL because I think he will pull back and just tell a "basic" story without stupid metaphors and analogies that don't work and just focus on good guys punching bad guys with cool action. JL is basically going to be Avengers-ish (alien comes to earth with minions to punch)... so it has to nail the hero to hero interactions and the action (like Avengers) and I thiiiiiink Snyder can do that.

The Trinity does have tons of name recognition... and I think they could have used that to create solos that make just as much as Marvel's movies. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman all have a high enough name recognition to make Iron Man 3 money IMO. Especially Batman as he is already a proven commodity. I don't think they needed to rush to Justice League because they solos have so much more potential money wise than Thor, IM, and Captain America did. But even going MoS, The Batman, Wonder Woman, BvS, SS, JL would have been made BvS more coherent without pushing the time line back too far.

Or maybe I am just bitter we missed all of Batman's career lol. Hell, just give me a Batman Universe and I will be happy. I don't want hints or flashbacks to Jason getting crowbared... I want to see it on screen. Instead, we will probably get some Under the Red Hood adaptation that has movie halting flashbacks every 20 minutes because thats what WB loves to do.

I don't think DC's crossovers are as drawn out as they were when I got more into reading DC (circa 2008), but at the same time I didn't think Convergence was really good, so there you go. And I never got into Future's End much. I did like Forever Evil. I read the main book and the Flash sidestory about the Rogues, but couldn't get into Batman, even though Bane (one of my favorites was pretty much the central character of that).

Ben Affleck is working on a solo Batman film. As far as I know he will be writing, directing, and starring in it, so we might very well get to see a prequel film to Batman v. Superman, and maybe we'll get to see Joker v. Batman for the first time or earlier in their careers.

I think Snyder pulled off the religious and 'deeper' metaphors in his Superman films than Bryan Singer did for Superman Returns. At least Snyder's films have a pulse, and as you mentioned, visually Snyder is great. I do agree that a simple story works better for him, something he can hang some really great visuals and action on. A simple story like Deadpool's would work best for his style IMO. If you say, gave him like a movie about one street-level hero like Green Arrow or the host of other DC vigilantes, that would be even better. So he can explore the darker, bleaker aspects with them that don't work so well with Superman.

Seeing your timeline, but with how they set up the conflict between Superman and Batman in BvS, I think BvS was the logical step to go after Man of Steel.

I am fine with the schedule as they have it for the most part, though I want them to breathe a bit and put more work into producing quality stories. To me, Suicide Squad was just a side story, not meant to be crucial to overall metanarrative. It is like Ant-Man to the MCU or Deadpool to the X-verse IMO.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Hypestyle on August 23, 2016, 05:39:26 pm: Viola Davis as Waller needs to return in each of these films. She needs to be in the Nick Fury role.
I just wish that her portrayal wasn't as viciously amoral as was depicted in the film.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: MindofShadow on August 24, 2016, 05:01:49 am: Quote from: Hypestyle on August 23, 2016, 05:39:26 pm
Viola Davis as Waller needs to return in each of these films. She needs to be in the Nick Fury role.
I just wish that her portrayal wasn't as viciously amoral as was depicted in the film.

She was consistent with other portrayls of "high level government person who does whats necessary to protect the country" portrayals.

It really didn't go "oh damn this woman's mean"
Spoiler (click to reveal)
until she offed those people in the room
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Vic Vega on August 24, 2016, 07:10:25 am: Quote from: MindofShadow on August 23, 2016, 05:31:14 am
1st... thanks for the wiki links. I always try to get into DC comics but then fall out of it when they start doing events and cross overs. I simply don't care about enough of the heroes to care about mega events (which is the opposite of Marvel). So I end up just reading Batman and maybe Aquaman.

My issue with WB is that they say they are taking risks and that their movies are "director based" and there is no house style... but the last two movies the WB higher ups went in and edited the hell out of the movie. Oh also... Snyder is a hack when it comes to "deep sh*t"... if he would just focus on making a fun, action oriented comic book movie, and I think he would knock it out of the park bc visually he is a beast. That is why I am still excited about JL because I think he will pull back and just tell a "basic" story without stupid metaphors and analogies that don't work and just focus on good guys punching bad guys with cool action. JL is basically going to be Avengers-ish (alien comes to earth with minions to punch)... so it has to nail the hero to hero interactions and the action (like Avengers) and I thiiiiiink Snyder can do that.

The Trinity does have tons of name recognition... and I think they could have used that to create solos that make just as much as Marvel's movies. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman all have a high enough name recognition to make Iron Man 3 money IMO. Especially Batman as he is already a proven commodity. I don't think they needed to rush to Justice League because they solos have so much more potential money wise than Thor, IM, and Captain America did. But even going MoS, The Batman, Wonder Woman, BvS, SS, JL would have been made BvS more coherent without pushing the time line back too far.

Or maybe I am just bitter we missed all of Batman's career lol. Hell, just give me a Batman Universe and I will be happy. I don't want hints or flashbacks to Jason getting crowbared... I want to see it on screen. Instead, we will probably get some Under the Red Hood adaptation that has movie halting flashbacks every 20 minutes because thats what WB loves to do.

I kind of wonder what Warners has against Robin. Seriously.

Seven Batman movies and only two of them actually had Robin in it.
I'm not counting Batman Rises.

I barely even wanna count Batman and Robin.

You'd think that if even the Arkham City dudes found a way to make Robin work (and the movies take thier cues from the
games "trying too hard to be cool" style) you'd figure the movies would want to try to as well.

But yeah, Suicide Squad came way too early in this DC movie series.

As it is, it kinda feels like we got Suicide Squad movie footage interrupting the clips from the Batman: Arkham Asyum movie that everybody would have rather seen anyway.

Euro-trash Gangsta/Pimp Joker or no.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on August 24, 2016, 03:25:22 pm: Quote from: Hypestyle on August 23, 2016, 01:29:07 pm
spoilers
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--- did Common really have to do this role? It seems he was kind of wasted. Yeah, literally.

I agree. If anything he should have played Incubus. Though I was hoping when I first saw him with all those tattoos he would be Tattooed Man.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Mark_Richards_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Mark_Richards_(New_Earth))

Glad though they didn't have him as Bronze Tiger, but if he had been cast as Black Spider I could see that working.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Eric_Needham_(New_Earth) (http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Eric_Needham_(New_Earth))
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: BmoreAkuma on August 27, 2016, 10:06:48 am: I've watched it with my blerd bae and we both liked it more than we thought. I had a good time and I won my bet with my lady so it was a good weekend for me.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: TripleX on August 28, 2016, 09:04:18 pm: Quote from: Vic Vega on August 24, 2016, 07:10:25 am
Quote from: MindofShadow on August 23, 2016, 05:31:14 am
1st... thanks for the wiki links. I always try to get into DC comics but then fall out of it when they start doing events and cross overs. I simply don't care about enough of the heroes to care about mega events (which is the opposite of Marvel). So I end up just reading Batman and maybe Aquaman.

My issue with WB is that they say they are taking risks and that their movies are "director based" and there is no house style... but the last two movies the WB higher ups went in and edited the hell out of the movie. Oh also... Snyder is a hack when it comes to "deep sh*t"... if he would just focus on making a fun, action oriented comic book movie, and I think he would knock it out of the park bc visually he is a beast. That is why I am still excited about JL because I think he will pull back and just tell a "basic" story without stupid metaphors and analogies that don't work and just focus on good guys punching bad guys with cool action. JL is basically going to be Avengers-ish (alien comes to earth with minions to punch)... so it has to nail the hero to hero interactions and the action (like Avengers) and I thiiiiiink Snyder can do that.

The Trinity does have tons of name recognition... and I think they could have used that to create solos that make just as much as Marvel's movies. Batman, Superman, and Wonder Woman all have a high enough name recognition to make Iron Man 3 money IMO. Especially Batman as he is already a proven commodity. I don't think they needed to rush to Justice League because they solos have so much more potential money wise than Thor, IM, and Captain America did. But even going MoS, The Batman, Wonder Woman, BvS, SS, JL would have been made BvS more coherent without pushing the time line back too far.

Or maybe I am just bitter we missed all of Batman's career lol. Hell, just give me a Batman Universe and I will be happy. I don't want hints or flashbacks to Jason getting crowbared... I want to see it on screen. Instead, we will probably get some Under the Red Hood adaptation that has movie halting flashbacks every 20 minutes because thats what WB loves to do.

I kind of wonder what Warners has against Robin. Seriously.

Seven Batman movies and only two of them actually had Robin in it.
I'm not counting Batman Rises.

I barely even wanna count Batman and Robin.

You'd think that if even the Arkham City dudes found a way to make Robin work (and the movies take thier cues from the
games "trying too hard to be cool" style) you'd figure the movies would want to try to as well.

But yeah, Suicide Squad came way too early in this DC movie series.

As it is, it kinda feels like we got Suicide Squad movie footage interrupting the clips from the Batman: Arkham Asyum movie that everybody would have rather seen anyway.

Euro-trash Gangsta/Pimp Joker or no.

I liked Leto's Joker, he was White Lil Wayne and cool as the other side of the pillow. Saw him with the cane and said "that's a m#thaf#@%ing pimp!".

The soundtrack made the movie for me though, the only thing I hated was "Guess Who's Back" cause I despise eminem. The songs in GotG weren't moldy either, good music doesn't have a shelf life.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: mayday on October 06, 2016, 05:12:35 am: I just saw it last night and the whole thing with
**spoiler alert**

Killer croc...."shawty" and BET (WTHF). Since I'm not deep into DC, when did Croc become a black man ? They went waaay out of their way to let you know that this pathetic creature could only be a black person. (LAME just like cyborg the eunuch) That ish made my skin crawl. Once again, I am overjoyed that my hard earned coin didn't pay for this. Free movie tickets from da plug.
Title: Re: Suicide Squad is Getting Ripped Apart
Post by: Emperorjones on October 07, 2016, 01:20:10 am: Mayday,

I think Croc has been black for a long time; though I'm not sure the character was originally conceived to be that way. But he's been black in the comics for quite some time now. It's just with his condition you can't tell that, but they might do a flashback sometimes before the condition worsened and he's black.

I do agree with you that his depiction was over the top and stereotypical, with the most outwardly bestial character being a black person, a black male in particular, but I didn't trip on it because Will Smith and Viola Davis were in the film to counter it. If they hadn't been in the film and it was just Croc I would've been more upset about it. Nothing against the actor and the makeup, but the depiction was too broad.

I also think Diablo's depiction, while not as broad, could be problematic as well. It's just his arc by the end of it, and the actor, helped elevate that character. Someone better versed on Asian stereotypes could probably pick up on Katana as well now that I think about it. The Native American actor playing Slipknot was only in the film for about five minutes, as if not worth even giving more than only handful of dialogue.

So outside of Davis and Smith, non-white characters were poorly developed and perhaps the director went to short hand, stereotypical ideas that he felt the audience might be familiar with in lieu of real character development.

In comparison I thought Flag, Enchantress, and definitely Harley and Joker got a bit more screen time and/or development. Captain Boomerang is the main white character that got short shrift.

That Cyborg as a eunuch thing bothers me as well. Even in brother David F. Walker's short Cyborg run Vince seemed more interested in an old highschool football rival than in returning the attention one of the fine scientists at STAR Labs was giving him. I didn't care for that. To be fair, I haven't read all of Walker's run so maybe he corrected that oversight before he left the book.