Hudlin Entertainment Forum

Comics => Black Panther => Topic started by: Ture on March 09, 2020, 10:41:57 pm

Title: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Ture on March 09, 2020, 10:41:57 pm
As I continue to research all things Black Panther I came across some interesting articles. I thought not only would they make interesting reading but needed archival preservation here at the HEF.



EDITS and EXERTS taken from

The Black Panther: A Comic Book History
By Vernon Mitchell, Jr., Curator of Popular American Arts on 23 May 2018 in Dowd Modern Graphic History Library, Special Collections, What's New

The late 1960s was a tumultuous time for America both domestically and abroad. President Lyndon Johnson signed the Voting Rights Act into law on August 6, 1965, which banned discriminating voting policies, just five days later, riots broke out in Watts, a section of Los Angeles, centered around police brutality toward African Americans. Times were indeed tense, and the issues of race were at the forefront. The fires that burned in Southern California were not solely about one incident per se, but a response to continued systematic oppression.

The larger implications of socio-economic inequality were now part of a larger critique of what America was and was not. This was the backdrop that Marvel Comics’ Stan Lee and Jack Kirby used to create their new character, Black Panther. The character’s alter ego, King T’Challa, was ruler of the fictional African kingdom of Wakanda. He was the first black superhero to debut in American comic books.

Originally conceived of as the “Coal Tiger,” Black Panther cannot be separated from the times in which he burst onto the comic book scene in Fantastic Four #52 in July of 1966.  Prior to the release of the comic, Lee and Kirby, according to writer Sean Howe, were very much aware and influenced by an article in The New York Times that discussed the formation of the Lowndes Country Freedom Organization (LCFO), which had as their emblem a black panther. Howe attributed that article as the impetus for changing the name of the character that Lee and Kirby had been working on for months.

The media referred to the LCFO as “The Black Panther Party,” after its formation in 1965 under the direction of Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee (SNCC) field secretary, Stokely Carmichael (Kwame Ture).  Carmichael believed that African Americans’ political power resided in the will and political self determination of local people.


full article
https://library.wustl.edu/the-black-panther-a-comic-book-history/


First Serial: Marvel Comics, The Untold Story
Drugs, feminism, and blaxploitation superheroes — the moment when Marvel changed forever

by SEAN HOWE ON OCTOBER 4, 2012

In the issue of The Fantastic Four #119, Marvel briefly tried to put distance between the Black Panther and his politically charged namesakes by renaming him Black Leopard. “I neither condemn nor condone those who have taken up the name,” T’Challa told the Thing, in a carefully measured bit of expository dialogue.

full article
https://grantland.com/features/an-excerpt-sean-howe-marvel-comics-untold-story/



EDITS and EXERTS taken from

How ‘Coal Tiger’ Became ‘Black Panther’
The newest addition to the Marvel Cinematic Universe has always been tied to Black Arts Movement.
BY JONITA DAVIS / FEBRUARY 12, 2018

The energy and imagery of the mid-1960s saturated the creative minds looking for inspiration, including Marvel artist and art editor Jack Kirby.

Sean Howe’s book Marvel Comics: The Untold Story details that time leading up to Black Panther’s creation. Stan Lee was managing the team of artists and writers, who were actively competing with DC comics for comics sales. According to Howe, Stan Lee heard of the upcoming release of a line of comics that was a gamechanger for DC. Marvel had nothing new to compete. Howe quoted Kirby, “I came in one day,” said Kirby, “and Stan said, ‘Martin says we have to add more books.’ They were afraid Al Harvey, who had pretty good distribution, was going to crowd them off the stands.” Kirby and the rest of the team went to work looking for new lines and characters.

They tapped a little history by researching ancient cultures of Mexico and Africa. They also dug deeper into the sci-fi lore that was becoming popular at the time. The atmosphere of the time greatly influenced the Marvel creatives as well. The result of their hard work was a few new characters are still famous today—The Inhumans—and a black superhero, who lead an uncolonized African nation, and used the cutting edge of futuristic weaponry was born. His name was…Coal Tiger.

Kirby presented the character to Lee, and Lee decided not to push the black hero or the Inhumans at that time. They waited to introduce their new black character with an already popular line of white characters, the Fantastic Four, in issue #52, which hit stands July 1966. The renamed the Coal Tiger, Black Panther, and gave him a makeover for the gig. It would be another 8 years before Lee launched a solo Black Panther comic series Jungle Action.

Meanwhile, the Black Arts Movement, which was started in 1965 by poet Imamu Amiri Baraka, was creating a national interest in black culture. BAM also stimulated a pride in the black community that was manifest in hair (afros and braids), clothing (dashikis and Afrocentric prints), beauty. James Brown’s “Say It Loud—I’m Black and I’m Proud” was like an anthem. This pride carried the community forward.

By 1973, the movement was in full swing and black culture was dominating pop culture, and even film. Blaxploitation movies that centered black characters with black problems were available. Despite their campiness and stereotyping fails, the films were the first time the nation saw black people onscreen and in the forefront of the narrative.

The celebration of black culture that the Black Panther character’s solo comic debuted it did not last, but it didn’t fade away either. The door was open just a bit for black creatives, who would push it open in the decades to come, leading to the Black Panther film.

the movie about Black Panther went through some false starts just as the comic did. In addition, both character debuts were attempted using the popular Marvel characters at the time. The solo release came later, after the “soft launch” of the black superhero standing alongside his beloved white counterparts. Also, like his debut timeline, the film version launches amidst a mainstream appreciation of black culture, with an underlying struggle with racism. That struggle is fueling activism and feeding the Black community’s resurgence of Black pride.

The soft launch before the solo debut is one curiosity to note. Although the elapsed time differed, they did occur. The black superhero had to be introduced by beloved white characters before he could come out alone. There may have been causing for such a thing in the 1960s when there had been little to no marketing of blackness to the public. Then, a black character was a significant risk, especially one that shares the name of a group that media and government were characterizing as militant and anti-White. Lee may not have wanted to gamble. This reason only holds until you considered the list of the many superheroes that Lee debuted solo without a soft launch. Even the Marvel film franchise released Spiderman, Hulk, and a few other superheroes in solo films without a soft launch. Both times, they took a gamble on the white superhero, but not Black Panther.

These and other curiosities lead to the conclusion that the Lee and Marvel, and also the Marvel studios today were priming the public for the black hero. They saw that the possibilities when Black culture started seeping into the mainstream. A soft launch would “test the waters” and see if the public could handle such a character. This seems plausible until you consider that prior to the solo debut of the character both times, the black community was calling for representation in pop culture. In the past few decades, the outcry for more representation in the film has been a topic of discussion and studies. They started well before the current film iteration was conceived.

In fact, when Black Panther’s solo comic appeared in 1973, it was so popular that Luke Cage followed. Similarly, the soft launch of Black Panther was followed by a Luke Cage series on the small screen that was a hit for Netflix streaming service. Once the public was given the Black Superhero, they eagerly sought out more, making the next one a hit out of the gate.

It’s obvious that the problem is not the public. It’s the industries. Both Marvel Comics back then and the MCU now are run by white men who do not want to gamble on blackness until they are sure that they can profit. They wait until the movement is starting, the pride is forming, and the creativity is arising in other areas before “dipping a toe in” for a soft launch. Once that happens, once the profitability of the character is recognized, then they ride in like abolitionists with bolt cutters to open the gates to creative works and opportunities. Everyone is too swept up in the chaos to see that the ones holding the bolt cutters were also the ones holding the gates closed before.
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on March 10, 2020, 07:45:08 am
" Once that happens, once the profitability of the character is recognized, then they ride in like abolitionists with bolt cutters to open the gates to creative works and opportunities. Everyone is too swept up in the chaos to see that the ones holding the bolt cutters were also the ones holding the gates closed before."

EXXXXACTLY!!!

Before the return of The Black Panther? We had Spawn, we had BLADE who launched Marvel Superhero movies...even without an MCU. We had Black action heroes leading Hollywood: Will Smith, Wesley Snipes, Denzel Washington. We had Barack Obama, for Chrissakes. We had R to the H's Black Panther comic book setting records. We had Milestone and Static Shock. We had John Stewart as Green Lantern.

Until Afrikan creatives control our own studios...props, Tyler Perry...we won't be able to build our own heroes. Can you imagine what amounts to an indie Milestone Movies Universe? OmLAWD, we'd do to heroics and comics what we've done to music, sports, fashion, culture and storytelling.
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: Gessela on March 10, 2020, 11:28:34 am
I'm happy to see writers acknowledging LCFO and Kwame Ture, while so many were incorrectly crediting Marvel with influencing The Black Panther Party. The only time I respond to it is on here because I know you brothers are serious about your fandom.

A shortened version of the symbol's American origin: 1Clark College emblem-2Kwame Ture-3Huey P. Newton/Bobby Seale.
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on March 10, 2020, 02:00:07 pm
I'm happy to see writers acknowledging LCFO and Kwame Ture, while so many were incorrectly crediting Marvel with influencing The Black Panther Party. The only time I respond to it is on here because I know you brothers are serious about your fandom.

A shortened version of the symbol's American origin: 1Clark College emblem-2Kwame Ture-3Huey P. Newton/Bobby Seale.


Beautiful sistah Gessela, thank you for Illuminating me, The Supreme Illuminati. I didn't know of the Clark College emblem connection. Would you be kind enough to expound upon this?
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: Gessela on March 10, 2020, 03:23:54 pm
I'm a brother.
Here's some additional info-

December 1965: Lowndes County Freedom Organization
(https://newafrikan77.files.wordpress.com/2019/02/5321bfde-65ca-4a94-91e8-d893d334042e.jpeg)
     Black voters in Lowndes County, Alabama, using a provision in state law, form an independent political party: the Lowndes County Freedom Organization (also known as the Black Panther Party). The party fields a slate of 7 candidates for county offices in the November 1966 general election.
     Until 1965, not one black person was registered to vote in Lowndes, though blacks made up 80% of the county's population. By October 1965 -- following a series of voter registration drives and the enactment of the Voting Rights Act in August -- nearly half the black population had registered to vote.
     -- Image from LCFO pamphlet: @
    -- Note: The LCFO based its symbol on the Panther mascot of Clark College in Atlanta, Georgia. In turn, the Black Panther Party for Self-Defense (formed in October 1966), took its name and symbol from the LCFO.


http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/473.html (http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/473.html)
https://zinnedproject.org/materials/lowndes-county-and-the-voting-rights-act/ (https://zinnedproject.org/materials/lowndes-county-and-the-voting-rights-act/)

From Kwame Ture-
The 1965 Voting Rights Act passed in the wake of Selma dramatically began to boost the number of black registered voters. And a unique Alabama law encouraged creation of county-level political parties. The law stipulated you had to have a symbol because of the high rate of illiteracy, recalls Kwame. Well, the Democratic Party symbol was a white rooster, the white cock party we used to call it. A panther became the new party’s symbol...almost accidentally.

Courtland [Cox] came to Atlanta and asked me to design a business card with an emblem for the party, recalls Ruth Howard Chambers. I came up with a dove. Nobody thought that worked and someone said I should look at the Clark College emblem. It was a panther and that’s where the panther came from. Somebody up there traced it on a piece of paper for me. In Lowndes County that pouncing black panther gave instant visibility to the newly-formed Lowndes County Freedom Organization as the Black Panther Party. The new party’s slogan: Power for black people.

Almost immediately, the black panther leapt out of the state. When a volunteer from Oakland, California working in Lowndes county returned home, Huey P. Newton and Bobby Seale asked for permission to use the emblem for the Black Panther Party they had decided to form.

https://libraries.ucsd.edu/farmworkermovement/ufwarchives/sncc/13-June%201966.pdf (https://libraries.ucsd.edu/farmworkermovement/ufwarchives/sncc/13-June%201966.pdf)

http://www.southerncourier.org/hi-res/Vol2_No20_1966_05_14.pdf (http://www.southerncourier.org/hi-res/Vol2_No20_1966_05_14.pdf)
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on March 10, 2020, 07:48:00 pm
I'm a brother.
Here's some additional info-

December 1965: Lowndes County Freedom Organization
([url]https://newafrikan77.files.wordpress.com/2019/02/5321bfde-65ca-4a94-91e8-d893d334042e.jpeg[/url])
     Black voters in Lowndes County, Alabama, using a provision in state law, form an independent political party: the Lowndes County Freedom Organization (also known as the Black Panther Party). The party fields a slate of 7 candidates for county offices in the November 1966 general election.
     Until 1965, not one black person was registered to vote in Lowndes, though blacks made up 80% of the county's population. By October 1965 -- following a series of voter registration drives and the enactment of the Voting Rights Act in August -- nearly half the black population had registered to vote.
     -- Image from LCFO pamphlet: @
    -- Note: The LCFO based its symbol on the Panther mascot of Clark College in Atlanta, Georgia. In turn, the Black Panther Party for Self-Defense (formed in October 1966), took its name and symbol from the LCFO.


[url]http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/473.html[/url] ([url]http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/45a/473.html[/url])
[url]https://zinnedproject.org/materials/lowndes-county-and-the-voting-rights-act/[/url] ([url]https://zinnedproject.org/materials/lowndes-county-and-the-voting-rights-act/[/url])

From Kwame Ture-
The 1965 Voting Rights Act passed in the wake of Selma dramatically began to boost the number of black registered voters. And a unique Alabama law encouraged creation of county-level political parties. The law stipulated you had to have a symbol because of the high rate of illiteracy, recalls Kwame. Well, the Democratic Party symbol was a white rooster, the white cock party we used to call it. A panther became the new party’s symbol...almost accidentally.

Courtland [Cox] came to Atlanta and asked me to design a business card with an emblem for the party, recalls Ruth Howard Chambers. I came up with a dove. Nobody thought that worked and someone said I should look at the Clark College emblem. It was a panther and that’s where the panther came from. Somebody up there traced it on a piece of paper for me. In Lowndes County that pouncing black panther gave instant visibility to the newly-formed Lowndes County Freedom Organization as the Black Panther Party. The new party’s slogan: Power for black people.

Almost immediately, the black panther leapt out of the state. When a volunteer from Oakland, California working in Lowndes county returned home, Huey P. Newton and Bobby Seale asked for permission to use the emblem for the Black Panther Party they had decided to form.

[url]https://libraries.ucsd.edu/farmworkermovement/ufwarchives/sncc/13-June%201966.pdf[/url] ([url]https://libraries.ucsd.edu/farmworkermovement/ufwarchives/sncc/13-June%201966.pdf[/url])

[url]http://www.southerncourier.org/hi-res/Vol2_No20_1966_05_14.pdf[/url] ([url]http://www.southerncourier.org/hi-res/Vol2_No20_1966_05_14.pdf[/url])



Thank you for the correction and invaluable information, BROTHER Gessela!
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: Gessela on March 11, 2020, 01:00:06 pm
No problem, glad to help.
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on March 14, 2020, 11:47:53 am
Minorities in Comics in a Segregated America: All-Negro Comics 1
Posted by KB at 10:24 PM
Wednesday, February 10, 2010

(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/_-U-XvMPSNQA/S3Nv7tZu1pI/AAAAAAAAB_U/cCo8T0rZ5tw/s400/All-NegroComics0101fc.jpg)

Prior to the integration of African American characters into comic book universes in the 1960s, African Americans rarely appeared in American comic books. When they did, it was usually in the form of a stereotyped caricature, examples being Whitewash in the Young Allies (Timely) and Will Eisner's The Spirit's sidekick Ebony White. Otherwise, if you were an archaeologist in the future trying to piece together what was going on in mid-20th century America and all you had as evidence was a pile of comic books, you could be forgiven for concluding that everybody in those days was light-skinned. All-Negro Comics 1 (1947) is itself a segregated comic, kind of a comic book version of FUBU clothes. Its stated intended audience is African American, and it is written, drawn, and published entirely by African Americans. Detailed information on the publisher, Orrin C. Evans, can be found here on Tom Christopher's website. It clearly wasn't a commercial success, and perhaps the 15c cover price had something to do with that. The book is extremely rare (the highest graded copy, a 7.5, sold at auction on March 13, 2009, for $10,600) and I don't own a copy (!), although I wish I did. The scan that's 'out there' is incomplete but at least offers a glimpse of this important comic. A more detailed description of the contents is located on Scott Shaw's Oddball Comics website: http://www.oddballcomics.com/article.php?story=2007-02-26 (http://www.oddballcomics.com/article.php?story=2007-02-26) which is where the scans I have appear to have come from.

(https://1.bp.blogspot.com/_-U-XvMPSNQA/S3QVPGRKF_I/AAAAAAAACBU/1sv0-MkeUbc/s400/2007-02-26_10_original.jpg)

(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/_-U-XvMPSNQA/S3QVRGX8JNI/AAAAAAAACBc/3gw2i1ywjGA/s400/2007-02-26_11_original.jpg)

There are four strips within the book. Ace Harlem is a detective story, and I'll include a few pages here. Lion Man and Bubba is kind of an early version of the Black Panther and set in Africa. In fact there's a detectable similarity or two between this strip and Lee and Kirby's Black Panther concept, at least from the few pages I can see. Dew Dillies is kind of a Water Babies fairy story. But I'll start with the single page that is in the scan available, of Sugarfoot and Snakeoil, the page having the potential at least of being part of a romance story. There's also a gorgeous page of Hep Chicks On Parade, kind of like those one page features in romance comics that Jacque Nodell writes about on her Sequential Crush blog. I just wish the interior scans of this book were higher resolution. The male character anticipating a good meal is Sugarfoot.

Note the idea of Lion Man being a scientist, the treasures of his people's mountain, and the white guy coming to steal it. Besides being an obvious reference to European imperialism, there's a strong parallel with Lee/Kirby's T'Challa (Black Panther), his land Wakanda, and the valuable mineral Vibranium that the explorer Ulysses Klaw comes in search of (he becomes the villain Klaw), as told in the pages of the now legendary Fantastic Four 52-53 and 56. I haven't read the Black Panther predecessor, Waku, Prince of the Jungle, in Atlas's Jungle Tales of the 1950s, so I don't know if there's a parallel there also. I did come across what appears to be the first solo African American hero in comics beyond ANC#1, and that was the western hero Lobo (Dell, December 1965), so I swiped the image from the Wikipedia page it was on and put it here for reference. Lobo is also covered by Aaron in his series on black heroes in comics.

full article
https://kb-outofthisworld.blogspot.com/2010/02/minorities-in-comics-in-segregated.html (https://kb-outofthisworld.blogspot.com/2010/02/minorities-in-comics-in-segregated.html)
Title: Re: Fear of a Black Panther... The Black History of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on March 14, 2020, 11:52:42 am
There has been a insistent strain of prejudice against the Black Panther from his very introduction. The need to obfuscate the inspiration derived from both Orrin C. Evans' Lion Man and the Lowndes Country Freedom Organization (Black Panther Party) speaks volumes.

Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on April 09, 2020, 12:41:04 am
A Call To Consciousness:     THE VIBRANIUM STREAM
(https://images.hdqwalls.com/download/black-panther-illustration-o8-1366x768.jpg)

You've heard AM, FM, XM Now experience the future with VM. The acoustic couture of Kimoyo streaming is now offered to the outside world and some close neighboring star systems. No place on earth does aural enticements like the vibranium modulations found only in Wakanda. Listen, intuit and share. Live life without fear and help make our world a better place in these most trying times.



(https://www.picclickimg.com/d/l400/pict/184110648757_/ISLEY-BROTHERS-Harvest-For-World-CD.jpg)
Harvest For The World by The Isley Brothers
https://youtu.be/ysFBT63OfC0 (https://youtu.be/ysFBT63OfC0)

(https://soulbrother.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/12/29992-400x400.jpg)
Love to the World by L.T.D.
https://youtu.be/UIvQI_u3aH0 (https://youtu.be/UIvQI_u3aH0)

(https://static.fnac-static.com/multimedia/Images/FR/NR/8f/c5/22/2278799/1507-1/tsp20170929115319/Open-your-eyes-inclus-titre-bonus.jpg)
Open Our Eyes by Earth, Wind & Fire
https://youtu.be/gjp5-scAtYA (https://youtu.be/gjp5-scAtYA)

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0223/4339/products/image_2115629_08d65553-7451-4c8d-b00f-56e23d8b3155_grande.jpg?v=1528041605)
Lovely Day by Gil Scott Heron & Brian Jackson
https://youtu.be/jWy_C6QbCYI (https://youtu.be/jWy_C6QbCYI)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on April 14, 2020, 01:34:37 am
Black Panther's Deleted Scene Makes the Movie Even Better, According to Fans
Greg Brian

Deleted scenes are a big part of the MCU and usually looked forward to when the Blu-Ray editions of their movies come out. Some of those deleted scenes also cause confusion since they frequently seem to help enhance the plot. One from Black Panther has taken notice in the last year as possibly being a missed opportunity.

The scene in question is W’Kabi (Daniel Kaluuya) and Okoye (Danai Gurira) arguing over whether T’Challa (Chadwick Boseman) is the best possible Wakanda leader. This scene has a lot of power to it and almost Shakespearean in quality.

(https://www.cheatsheet.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/04/Black-Panther-in-Infinity-Wars-1.png)

Of all Black Panther deleted scenes available on the Blu-Ray, this one continues to spark debate on social media. When looking at it a little closer, it really does look like a scene that should have been retained.

Daniel Kaluuya and Danai Gurira are powerful in this deleted sequence
https://youtu.be/-MnKxVC7kEA (https://youtu.be/-MnKxVC7kEA)

Both Kaluuya and Gurira are already known for being actors with fiery personalities. Kaluuya became a star in Get Out with always memorable big-screen performances. The same goes for Gurira who has spent a number of years on The Walking Dead until leaving this season.

Matching them up for Black Panther was clearly a casting coup, though presenting W’Kabi and Okoye as a couple was not seen as much as it should have been. Only in a deleted scene does their relationship become more apparent as husband and wife.

Those who bought the Black Panther Blu-Ray saw this deleted scene, but a user on Reddit recently posted it as a reminder of how visceral it is. When giving it a watch, it becomes a reminder of how great of actors Kaluuya and Gurira really are, if never working together prior.

Why Ryan Coogler decided not to have very many scenes with them together is a bit of a mystery. Both of them give everything they have in this scene with believable intensity.

The ‘Black Panther’ deleted scene could have been added to the movie

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DcKU8iAUwAARRCA?format=jpg&name=small)
This 'Black Panther' deleted scene sheds new light on Okoye and W’Kabi's relationship

Considering this deleted scene is only a few minutes long, above Reddit users are starting to ask why this brilliant sequence was taken out. Adding it would have had no effect on the running time.

Besides, the scene adds more understanding of the relationship between W’Kabi and Okoye. It also helps everyone better understand the relationship W’Kabi has with T’Challa. Also at play here is major emotional conflict through the eyes of Okoye.

Her having to uphold her allegiance to T’Challa while still showing love for W’Kabi is where it starts to become Shakespearean. Gurira really shines here in projecting a tug-of-war between two sides.

In leadership roles like Okoye’s, this often happens. When helping to run a country, especially, trying to find balance in who to side in is why politics is often a double-edged sword.

Understanding why W’Kabi turned on T’Challa

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DcIl7LjWsAAhG0H?format=jpg&name=small)
Black Panther Deleted Scene Confirms Okoye & W'Kabi Are Married

More than anything, fans are saying this scene fleshes out why W’Kabi turns on T’Challa so it is not so abrupt later in the film. Here, the scene demonstrates the emotional reasons behind why W’Kabi wants Killmonger to be the leader instead.

Kaluuya really gets intense, exuding incredible emotion that seemed a waste to just place on the cutting room floor. As a result, it kind of raises more questions about why so many great scenes in the MCU are often taken out if at least presented for the public to see on the Blu-Ray editions.

Ryan Coogler has gone on record saying why he took the scene out. According to Mashable, he said: “I was incredibly proud of it as a director, but it didn’t work inside of the confines of our film.”

While a lot of fans think otherwise, it gives rise to other deleted scenes in the MCU and how they could have made certain movies better. For the sake of art, perhaps respecting the director’s vision is better to prevent artistic and fan discord.


https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/black-panthers-deleted-scene-makes-the-movie-even-better-according-to-fans.html/ (https://www.cheatsheet.com/entertainment/black-panthers-deleted-scene-makes-the-movie-even-better-according-to-fans.html/)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on May 10, 2020, 08:15:31 pm
Remember when crossovers were cool? Post this COVID 19 induced absence of comics maybe a crossover would help jumpstart the industry.

(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/oPjJNSDNLP7onqhHDvydN4u7_4ZchxwUBKR-A7sA-zjKCY8ZprQ9feG3I4uLtUSqFZ506R_iUtcT=s1600)

(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/4pb5ICDvoCa9cnVDPA346kt56mQPdXIwuYh9dxOKrzy7fNQ6US2hnWlAkXqXlwwbwfg6s5IlnVNa=s1600)

(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/kRgL-UQ2bw_S-1ygSmaP7M1uPNhs7RqwJfUF0A_eAewJnsQXAHr73sFQKLrw5TpW1_TyOScPMuE7=s1600)

WHAT IF T'Challa the Black Panther in using to Nowhere Room was accidentally transported the DCU. Realizing he has traveled to a parallel earth he uses his wearable Kimyo to detect the nearest data feed and information storage unit... the Bat Computer. Breaking into the Bat Cave and hacking the computers data banks provides the necessary info the Black Panther needs to construct an apparatus that can transport him back to the MU. Of course entering the Batcave uninvited comes with consequences. The most grievous of such is the realization that this is the secret base of...

(https://comicvine1.cbsistatic.com/uploads/scale_medium/10/100647/5462277-owlman.jpg)

In his quest to return home T'Challa must gather Thangorian Nth metal for containment which means he has to confront Blood Eagle; battle Power Ring for a power ring used for shielding; engage Superwoman to get her lasso for conductivity; outrace Johnny Quick to save the lives of innocents and obtain some Anti-Kryptonite from this man...

(https://qph.fs.quoracdn.net/main-qimg-682491c889c0b7d61ac9bf8508c2d412)

The final item required is a Motherbox to be in the possession of... 

(https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0238/7617/articles/Fabok_Darkseid_1600x.jpg?v=1470042378)

Of course if this is all too much, Marvel could keep things in house and instead of a crossover with the Crime Syndicate of America launch the new Black Panther ongoing with a multi issue, well written, beautifully illustrated updated version of the Supremacists.
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on May 14, 2020, 07:54:44 pm
This is sooooo dope! I'm going to give this a go when I get a chance; maybe this weekend...
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on June 02, 2020, 10:20:45 pm
Marvel Studios

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZYB9-jVcAAkIfi?format=jpg&name=small)

In recent years Marvel has taken steps towards better inclusivity in their projects. Marvel had their first film centered on a black superhero, Black Panther, in 2018, which went on to be nominated for six Academy Awards including Best Picture.

The former Queen of Wakanda knows what time it is.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EZjcFGuWAAENGZ5?format=jpg&name=medium)

courtesy of CBR'S Butterflykyss
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on June 15, 2020, 10:46:03 pm
BLACK HEROES MATTER
(https://66.media.tumblr.com/d25c66f8ac65a41cd81688f577f2c955/8a1c386c84c873bb-4a/s1280x1920/745b02407aa9cd51c7f0e84edcf1c722f88d7040.jpg)
COURTESY OF CBR'S Klaue's Mixtape
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Battle on June 16, 2020, 09:55:09 am
(https://i.imgur.com/YkNKwXX.jpg)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on June 27, 2020, 07:11:44 am
(https://i.imgur.com/YkNKwXX.jpg)

I love it!!!
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Battle on June 27, 2020, 10:58:07 am
>>> Supreme


How 'bout this one?  :)

(https://i.imgur.com/ALqkmBd.jpg)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on June 27, 2020, 02:57:21 pm
>>> Supreme


How 'bout this one?  :)

(https://i.imgur.com/ALqkmBd.jpg)


This is so tasty? I shared it on my FB. Thanks, ndugu Battle!!
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Battle on June 27, 2020, 03:08:05 pm
>>> Supreme


(https://i.imgur.com/C6g3EoL.gif)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: supreme illuminati on June 27, 2020, 05:39:13 pm
>>> Supreme


(https://i.imgur.com/C6g3EoL.gif)

YOOO. I called you, brutha. Hmu. 562-513-8339. Any other cool HEFfa can call me, too.
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Battle on June 27, 2020, 05:55:24 pm
YOOO. I called you, brutha. Hmu. 562-513-8339. Any other cool HEFfa can call me, too.





Texting is a easier way to do it, Supreme.  (https://i.imgur.com/Ft9MpaU.gif)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on June 27, 2020, 09:59:42 pm
(https://shirtoid.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Black-Lives-Matter.jpg)


(https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Black-Lives-Matter-Superhero-Fan-Art.jpg)

(https://images.fineartamerica.com/images/artworkimages/mediumlarge/1/black-heroes-matter-nic-the-artist.jpg)

(https://res.cloudinary.com/jerrick/image/upload/f_auto,fl_progressive,q_auto,c_fit,w_939/zectiexmwcmehiqawosp)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on July 01, 2020, 07:12:15 pm
A Call To Consciousness:     THE VIBRANIUM STREAM
(https://images.hdqwalls.com/download/black-panther-illustration-o8-1366x768.jpg)

You've heard AM, FM, XM Now experience the future with VM. The acoustic couture of Kimoyo streaming is now offered to the outside world and some close neighboring star systems. No place on earth does aural enticements like the vibranium modulations found only in Wakanda. Listen, intuit and share. Live life without fear and help make our world a better place in these most trying times.


(https://i.redd.it/4g6tm7ei5ne01.jpg)

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/c9/f9/5e/c9f95ee5e833fd88417a26d59ac5c088.jpg)

Dem boyz from 'Kanda is at it again! Each droppin' on the same day! Dem boyz stay warrin'!

Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on July 14, 2020, 08:45:35 pm
A Call To Consciousness:     THE VIBRANIUM STREAM
(https://images.hdqwalls.com/download/black-panther-illustration-o8-1366x768.jpg)

You've heard AM, FM, XM Now experience the future with VM. The acoustic couture of Kimoyo streaming is now offered to the outside world and some close neighboring star systems. No place on earth does aural enticements like the vibranium modulations found only in Wakanda. Listen, intuit and share. Live life without fear and help make our world a better place in these most trying times.


(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51-sBmERvBL.jpg)
Liberation Song (The Red, Black and Green) By Gil Scott-Heron
https://youtu.be/FwQZwXAIT38 (https://youtu.be/FwQZwXAIT38)

(https://d3gqasl9vmjfd8.cloudfront.net/4012a295-3b1f-4824-bbcc-ebd4aa3aab06.jpg)
Red, Black & Green By Roy Ayers Ubiquity
https://youtu.be/oM4nI3yHpVs (https://youtu.be/oM4nI3yHpVs)

(https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/61fAgpNtByL.jpg)
Raise The Flag By X Clan
https://youtu.be/Cqm3dywX2bA (https://youtu.be/Cqm3dywX2bA)




963
Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on July 22, 2020, 08:55:15 pm
MARVEL'S 616 EXPLORES MS. MARVEL, BLACK PANTHER IN FIRST LOOK AT DISNEY+ DOCUSERIES

Go behind-the-scenes of Marvel Comics in two first look clips from the upcoming Disney+ docuseries, Marvel's 616. The project was first announced last April; its title refers to Earth-616, the main reality in the Marvel Universe. The first video comes from Episode 2: "Higher, Further, Faster," which was directed by Community's Gillian Jacobs, and it explores the origins of Kamala Khan (aka Ms. Marvel).

The second clips hails from Episode 4: "Lost and Found," which was helmed by Paul Scheer and chronicles "the actor and comedian’s eye-opening and hilarious journey to discover the 'forgotten' characters of Marvel Comics."

This sneak peek begins with an interview with Reginald Hudlin, who wrote Black Panther comics during a time (2005-2018) when the Wakandan king was still considered a rather obscure hero. "I said, 'I'm gonna write the comic book equivalent of a Public Enemey record,'" Hudlin says. "A completely un-compromised, politically provocative book and that was the key to success."


https://www.syfy.com/syfywire/marvels-616-disney-plus-first-look (https://www.syfy.com/syfywire/marvels-616-disney-plus-first-look)



Title: Re: Historical Explorations and Plausible Explanations of the Black Panther
Post by: Ture on July 27, 2020, 02:21:03 pm
COMICSGATE - A brief history


COMICSGATE IS GAMERGATE'S NEXT HORRIBLE EVOLUTION
Supporters want to save comics. But their reasons do not make sense.


ERIC FRANCISCO
2.9.2018 3:37 PM
Update, August 27, 2018: After a Year, Comic Pros Express Solidarity Against Comicsgate


Comic book publishers and creators have been under attack from bigots since Captain America punched Hitler in 1941. But now, bigots have organized under a new banner: Comicsgate. But what is Comicsgate? And how did it happen? Like Gamergate before it, the origins of this latest intolerant movement are ugly. On Friday, Comicsgate proponents on social media released a public blacklist of names for their followers to boycott. The names are organized under inflammatory titles like the “Pravda Press” and the “SJW Vipers” (“SJW,” for social justice warrior, a derogatory title for progressives). Those attacked are major figures in comics like Larry Hama, Mark Waid, Alex de Campi, Kelly Sue DeConnick, Matt Fraction, Ta-Nehisi Coates, and others. Nearly all of the people singled out are either women, people of color, or left-leaning.

The Comicsgate people claim the blacklist is meant for “educational purposes only,” according to the preamble. “You are advised not to engage in any harassment/doxing/Twitter trolling with these people. The list is meant for all concerned with the state of comics to see who the main contributors are to the declining quality.”

The statement continues:

“The players in #Comicsgate are not responsible for your actions if you DO NOT take the advice of the above statement. If you want to hurt these individuals, do it with your wallet. Don’t buy their products. Do not give the false reporter any clicks. Use archive.ie for any ‘reporter’ links.” But how did this start? And what do these people actually want? Because the hazy origins of Comicsgate are siphoned from the 2014 Gamergate movement and “alt-right” white nationalists, it is difficult to pinpoint a specific origin. Still, it likely all begins with milkshakes. Here’s a brief rundown of how Comicsgate got its bizarre hate game rolling.

In July 2017, several female Marvel staffers got together for milkshakes and a selfie, shared by editor Heather Antos (The Unbelievable Gwenpool) on her Twitter page. The women had gathered to celebrate the life of Flo Steinberg, an industry icon who had a key role in expanding Marvel and had passed away a few days earlier. For some reason, women enjoying milkshakes broke the dam on what would become Comicsgate.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DF17d6oXcAETTCG?format=jpg&name=small)

Bafflingly, some people believed Antos’s selfie represented what was “wrong” with Marvel. Between calls of “fake geek girls,” putting down Antos and her colleagues for being “the creepiest collection of stereotypical SJWs anyone could possibly imagine,” and harassment levied at Antos through Twitter’s direct messaging (via The Mary Sue) this selfie weirdly set off sexists.

To defend Antos, fans used the hashtag #MakeMineMilkshake, but it seems like #Comicsgate had begun. It just didn’t have a name, until later that year. At New York Comic Con in October 2017, a breakfast held by Marvel exclusively for comic book retailers went awry when a few retailers, peeved at declining sales, laid the blame on “black,” “homo,” and “freaking female” comics put out by Marvel. Since 2015, Marvel had a dramatically changed universe, in which the mantles of white, straight male characters like Thor and Wolverine were handed to women, and the Hulk had become an Asian teenager.

Of course, there were retailers who opposed this view, but the event added momentum to what would happen later in the fall and winter, and it showed that a vocal segment of comic consumers was eager to express their dissatisfaction and bigotry to Marvel’s face.

Two important names to know about Comicsgate, because its supporters rally behind them, are Richard C. Meyer and Ethan Van Sciver (#StandWithEVS). After the milkshake episode, Comicsgate began to crystallize through those two individuals on YouTube.

On YouTube, Meyer runs the Diversity and Comics channel, boasting over 57,000 subscribers. Contrary to the title, Meyer’s videos don’t explore the values of diversity and representation in comics. Rather, the videos — 12-40 minutes in length, usually — feature Meyers thumbing through random issues, poking fun at every page. His jokes are also generally offensive. In a review of Mariko Tamaki’s She-Hulk, he describes one character as “a bored, sullen, Y bitch” talking to an elderly woman, “her future lesbian self.”

(UPDATE: In a tweet, Richard C. Meyer said he was actually saying “whibish.” YouTube’s caption on the video read “Y bitch.” It’s what “whibish” means that remains a mystery.)

In December 2017, Bleeding Cool listed Meyer in an end-of-year countdown of influential people in comics, calling Meyer “the centre of alt-right comics hate speech” with “the ability to get comic creators who really should know better, to engage with him, even if they are screaming for blood.”

Online, Meyer aligned himself with Van Sciver, a freelance illustrator whose works include The Flash: Rebirth and Green Lantern by DC Comics. On Twitter, Van Sciver insists he supports diversity, but his personal politics — he’s publicly identified himself as Republican — lean to a Breitbart-flavored right. Earlier this year, Twitter unearthed Van Sciver’s sketchbook, titled My Struggle, autographed it with a Swastika signature. Van Sciver insists that My Struggle was just a joke.

But regardless of Van Sciver’s views, his actions have raised red flags. In 2017, Van Sciver told a Facebook follower to kill themselves (he later apologized). Then, in late January, Van Sciver engaged in a Twitter dispute with Darryl Ayo, a black independent comics creator. When Ayo, who had been the subject of a Comics and Diversity video refused an invitation by Van Sciver to appear on his show, Comicsgate supporters harassed him in droves.

Unlike most “-gate” scandals, there wasn’t one thing that kicked off Comicsgate, a name attached organically and has trended throughout 2017. Unlike its ancestor Gamergate, the demands by Comicsgate are unclear. Sure, Gamergate began when a guy got mad at his ex, but it at least pretended to aspire to something bigger in its call for “ethics in gamming journalism.” Comicsgate, meanwhile, seems to just want less diversity, both in characters and creators, in an attempt to save comics and keep the medium white, male, and familiar. That’s it.

Comic sales have slowed, that much is true, especially compared to the early nineties when the speculator boom was at its highest. But book sales have slowed across the board, along with prose literature, in the face of changing media. But the profile for comics have never been higher, as mainstream pop culture is actually excited for a movie featuring Thanos and the Infinity Stones. Not only are the demands made by Comicsgate offensive idea, they don’t make sense.

We’ve seen this before. It happened with video games and science-fiction literature. Despite the complicated origin story worthy of a supervillain, Comicsgate isn’t anything new. It’s little more than the latest irate gasp of fading white hegemony in geek culture.


(https://imgix.bustle.com/inverse/2b/41/28/9b/51e6/433a/b731/00922e7aa293/they-should-listen-to-superman.png?w=710&h=399.375&auto=format%2Ccompress&cs=srgb&q=70&fit=max&crop=faces)

full article here
https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/41132-comicsgate-explained-bigots-milkshake-marvel-dc-gamergate (https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/41132-comicsgate-explained-bigots-milkshake-marvel-dc-gamergate)
Title: Re: Historical Explorations of the Black Panther *** COMICSGATE ***
Post by: Ture on July 27, 2020, 02:37:26 pm
COMICSGATE - What's trending

Jae Lee Releases Statement on Tom King ComicsGate Accusation and Retraction
Jae Lee has responded to Tom King's recent ComicsGate accusation against the artist regarding DC hiring Lee to draw a variant cover for Rorschach #1.

BY JIM JOHNSO


(https://static1.cbrimages.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/rorshach-jae-lee-header.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=960&h=500)

In the wake of writer Tom King's accusation and subsequent retraction of his statement about artist Jae Lee's alleged ComicsGate ties, Lee has issued his own statement on his Instagram account Sunday.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CDG4CPUJtA7/?utm_source=ig_embed (https://www.instagram.com/p/CDG4CPUJtA7/?utm_source=ig_embed)

Lee's thoughts on the matter were part of larger post Lee made in honor of his and wife June Chung's pet dog Loki, who passed away two weeks earlier. "We were going to take him to the beach and comfort each other by sharing our favorite stories about our little boy. Instead, a part of the internet I avoid like the plague came barging in."

Lee's reference is to Tom King's Saturday tweet, which condemned DC commissioning Lee for a variant cover of King and Jorge Fornés' upcoming Rorschach #1. King accused Lee of previously drawing covers for ComicsGate, the movement associated with campaigning against diversity in comics and often known as a hate group. King followed up with another tweet that evening, stating he spoke with Lee, saying Lee "didn’t know ComicsGate existed, and doesn’t support hate of any kind. We’re all good. Best possible outcome."

Lee's response adds, "June and I were robbed of a special day. So, no, we're not 'all good.'" The artist historically has not been active on social media, and generally only posts to promote his art, although he also recently shared pictures commemorating his late pet.

"This isn't the start of a conversation," Lee concluded. "This is the end. So please, don't drag me into a world I never wanted to be a part of, nor will I ever want to be a part of."


full article here
https://www.cbr.com/jae-lee-response-tom-king-comicsgate-accusation/ (https://www.cbr.com/jae-lee-response-tom-king-comicsgate-accusation/)

Jae Lee BP art

(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/42/a2/b3/42a2b35602774eee76c642c44b3a1e5b.jpg)

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/36/76/9b/36769b942bd37d9d33a4a733f437e997.jpg)
Title: Re: BLACK PANTHER - COMICSGATE AND ITS IMPACT
Post by: Ture on July 27, 2020, 03:04:51 pm
COMICSGATE - BP related

Black Panther Illustrates ComicsGate’s Motives, Reasonings

Charles Rodriguez

(https://miro.medium.com/max/633/0*LXNzf1Zkzw9ngazD.jpg)

ComicsGate has been painted as an iconoclastic whole, namely one of angry white nerds that hate diversity. However, each member has their own reasonings. Nowhere is this more apparent than in their reactions to The Black Panther. By analyzing their reactions to Black Panther, one can get a greater insight into their motivations.[1]

Richard C. Meyer described Black Panther as “great, it was as good as the overblown descriptions.”[2] Overall, Richard Meyer felt it started slowly although it became more enjoyable in the second half[3] which was more action packed. His main concern going into the movie was that it would be too political and wouldn’t be enjoyable. However, halfway through he really began to enjoy the film for what it was claiming “there wasn’t any weird political diatribe.”[4] He liked the action as well as the main villain. Richard stated that Killmonger was the most interesting character.[5] Even though Richard is white, it’s apparent that he identified with the reasonings, background, and struggles of Killmonger.[6]

Not all were as enthusiastic. Captain Cummings, another CG YouTuber, stated that “it was an ok movie but not a great movie” although “he had a lot of fun.”[7] He liked the world building, magic, and technology. Unlike Richard, Captian Cummings preferred the beginning of the film.[8] Overall, his main complaint is that Black Panther was “too much of a formula film.”[9] He also was not [10] and that Marvel struggles with villains.[11] In the comics, he’s the main antagonist to Black Panther in the comics, but he was just a minor villain in the movie. Captain Cummings felt his death was “disheartening” since he wouldn’t get more screen-time. He also differed from Richard in that he thought Kill Monger was cheesy, although he liked him more at the end of the movie.[12]

Just Some Guy, a CG from Chicago, critiques fans for not buying the book while hyping the movie. He doesn’t discuss the film much in his video so much as his reaction to they hype. Just Some Guy was frustrated with how other African-Americans claim they want more diversity in media like comics, but aren’t willing to pay for it.[13], [14] That it was a success wasn’t a surprise to him. He stated that Black Panther’s success was to be expected[15] because Marvel Studios has the formula down.

Just Some Guy’s secondary criticism was of Marvel Comics. Just Some Guy was frustrated with the incompetence of Marvel Comics in comparison to Marvel Studios. [16] Despite the success of The Black Panther movie, there was next to no promotion of the comic series. How could they sell a comic that people didn’t know exist? How can they buy them if they’re only old at niche comic shopsa? He was also annoyed that Marvel Comics didn’t focus on a single series, but rather they were already making two spin-offs. His belief is that without enough of a core audience all the series would be canceled.[17]

Others, such as That Umbrella guy, did not like it because of politics. That is understandable. Some people dislike the book Starship Troopers because of its politics just like others dislike Star Trek for the same reason. Many comic book fans are also turned off by political messages, so it isn’t surprising that they are suspicious of it creeping into films, even enjoyable ones. That Umbrella Guy shows how there are individuals that will dislike a film or comic because of its political message. Which is a-ok. No one should be forced to like or dislike a product.


(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*_g8aV9clhfKc7FO3IlI7yw.png)

He wasn’t the only one that felt that way.
 
(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*qqqGz_ZT9eUlXivQAtUZFw.png)

Their reactions shine a light on their motives in ComicsGate. For Richard, super hero movies and comics are supposed to be like The Black Panther: Fun, action packed, and enjoyable. Currently, he does not believe super hero comics are that way. For Captain Cummings, super hero media is a way to have fun, socialize and explore. He likes the magic, the otherness, and the sense of discovery. Stick in the mud politics does not allow for escapism so is an obvious turn-off for him and others like him. Others are like Just Some Guy. They’re frustrated with Marvel Comic’s poor business decisions and with people not putting their money where their mouth is. Still others, like That Umbrella Guy are not fans of mixing politics with entertainment. ComicsGaters have their own reasons, backgrounds, and opinions. Some are not fond of fanwagons and ignorant hype.

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*f4--Tlvb5jVsNne8jWdq4Q.png)

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*jAecoMgDQu0qG9_5NBwL8w.png)

Others just want fun films and could care less about the protagonist looking like them.

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*etYMwox2zY9W3mpJS9nKGA.png)

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*6KtqOVq02hkqBxZ11LCXvg.png)

Many had fun and thought the film was great.

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*TcMGjGC1fQYThqMwaJuMwA.png)

(https://miro.medium.com/max/534/1*dC8kwmHH_CV4PhT_7tkUoA.png)

Other ComicsGaters had mixed feelings on aspects of the film.

(https://miro.medium.com/max/586/1*DG7TrMHAFOpANMESsQysww.png)

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*vuXo2DAEBzbPHmUK5XBBcA.png)

(https://miro.medium.com/max/624/1*1Pp0TBaD9kbrMA84OvK5_g.png)

ComicsGate is diverse and this is made apparent by The Black Panther. Consequently, so are their opinions on Black Panther. Some, like Richard, loved it. Others like Captain Cummings thought it was ok. Still others, like That Umbrella Guy did not like it.

If ComicsGate truly was about hating minorities no matter what, then it is odd that many would like and even love The Black Panther.[18] One would expect uniformity on that point if ComicsGate wanted to lynch every minority that crossed their path. Furthermore, if ComicsGate truly hated minorities one would wonder why many of its members are in fact minorities and like minority characters that aren’t stereotypes. Additionally, even those who disliked the film mention politics first and foremost and aren’t angered by the notion that a film can be about a black man or a super woman.

Why?

ComicsGate is about good comics. ComicsGate is not about white guys in basements complaining about dem damn wumenz and minorities. It’s about a healthy industry, one in which people can just have fun, socialize, and escape from the mundane present. It’s about not kowtowing to a comic clique that has the maturity of pre-teens, the fanaticism of Westboro, and the arrogance of Hollywood while lacking its wealth and splendor. That is the sentiment that unites those in ComicsGate, not race, gender, or even politics. What they want is good stories in film or in books. That’s the reason why ComicsGate generally praises The Black Panther and Wonder Woman even though they have political messages.

Lastly, comics were already diverse, unlike mainstream media: Storm, a Black woman, led the X-Men decades ago. To think that nerds -who embraced these diverse characters before anyone else- suddenly walk in goosestep is ludicrous. A better explanation is fan anger over the poor quality of Marvel Comics, the decline of the comic shop, and corruption of comic book gate keepers.


full article here
https://medium.com/@charlesrobertrodriguez/black-panther-illustrates-comicsgates-motives-reasonings-5caf9384e906




1113
Title: Re: BLACK PANTHER - COMICSGATE AND ITS IMPACT
Post by: supreme illuminati on July 27, 2020, 08:39:28 pm
But...Hollywood in general and the MCU behind the cameras sucked at diversity.

https://www.insider.com/anthony-mackie-criticizes-marvel-lack-of-diversity-2020-6 (https://www.insider.com/anthony-mackie-criticizes-marvel-lack-of-diversity-2020-6)

Idk much about ComicsGate. I DO clearly remember the tons of hate that CJP BP, RH BP, Miles Morales, etc etc got and IT WAS RACIST. I recall the LCBRD [ as I believe Salustrade or Sinjection coined the acronym ] repeatedly showed their vile racism on places like CBR before CBR was "allegedly" cleaned up...and I got the feeling from you more experienced board hopping HEF OG's that at least the first alleged "clean ups" weren't cleaning out the racists, but cleaning out the HEFfas and others who had the temerity to stand up and smack the hatas down. Sinjection Wars style [ where's Sinjection, anyway? ]

How's CBR nowadays?
Title: Re: BLACK PANTHER - COMICSGATE AND ITS IMPACT
Post by: Battle on July 28, 2020, 04:03:53 am
From the article:

Quote
Unlike most “-gate” scandals, there wasn’t one thing that kicked off Comicsgate, a name attached organically and has trended throughout 2017. Unlike its ancestor Gamergate, the demands by Comicsgate are unclear. Sure, Gamergate began when a guy got mad at his ex, but it at least pretended to aspire to something bigger in its call for “ethics in gamming journalism.” Comicsgate, meanwhile, seems to just want less diversity, both in characters and creators, in an attempt to save comics and keep the medium white, male, and familiar. That’s it.




This is exactly why dc comics is so despise by many. (https://i.imgur.com/C6g3EoL.gif)  (https://i.imgur.com/pdZE2W1.gif)
Title: Re: BLACK PANTHER - COMICSGATE AND ITS IMPACT
Post by: Ture on August 12, 2020, 11:28:38 am
For some time I ignored or gave a cursory once over to articles I thought were unnecessarily deriding the Black Panther movie but now... well into the era of BP dominance, it might be fun to take a look see with my fellow BP enthusiasts.

15 reasons why Black Panther is a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie

Black Panther was greatly hyped as a ground breaking action movie that redefined the representation of black people in Hollywood. Yet perhaps it’s time for some thorough analysis and criticism. There's a whole list of reasons why Black Panther doesn't really challenge the norms and instead amplifies prejudices and stereotypes. Even more so: its underlying message is, in many ways, quite problematic.

By Jonas Slaats

A couple of weeks after the great hype had toned down, I finally went to see Black Panther. Intrigued as I was about the grand way in which the movie was hailed as some sort of liberation theology for black people, I refused to read any reviews and let the movie speak for itself. Could it really live up to the proposed breach of ‘Hollywood whiteness’? Was it truly such a “dope-ass black movie” as anti-racist television personality Trevor Noah made it seem to be in his Daily Show? Or was it yet another bizarre twist of consumer culture that lured people into thinking this was a norm changing movie even though it actually offered an overdose of those norms?

As it turned out, the latter was the case. With every minute of movie, my sense of disbelief became greater and finally ended in the certainty that this was a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie.

Surfing around on the net afterwards, I quickly realized I wasn’t alone. For example, an article by Kenian political cartoonist Patrick Gathara on the website of the Washington Post, offered some very relevant, thorough arguments. It described how “at heart, it is a movie about a divided, tribalized continent, discovered by a white man who wants nothing more than to take its mineral resources, a continent run by a wealthy, power-hungry, feuding and feudalist elite, where a nation with the most advanced tech and weapons in the world nonetheless has no thinkers to develop systems of transitioning rulership that do not involve lethal combat or coup d’etat.”

Gathara goes on to explain how Black Panther, with a typical Victorian slant, portrays Africans as primitive yet in harmony with
nature, not faced by the complexities of modernity; how the Wakandans technological advancement, apparently still doesn’t make them sophisticated enough to prevent a single American from overtaking the country; and how it thus eventually tells a neocolonial story about somewhat childish people who need a strong guiding hand to lead them.

As Kif Kif predominantly publishes Dutch articles,
our English articles can also be read on our English only Medium magazine.

As such, it’s painful to see how blinding a shiny neoliberal story about ‘triumphing blackness’ can be. Give people some feel-good popcorn and any critical analysis, seems to be thrown into the trashcan faster than anyone can even gobble up the Kool-Aid. So, to strengthen the case of an alternative view, I simply would like to add the following list of 15 reasons why Black Panther is rather problematic.

First, the obvious things…

1. The bluntly racist images: Not only does the movie end with African tribes fighting each other with spears, clubs and machetes but the men of the ‘strong tribe’ in Wakanda dress like monkeys and literally make oo-oo-oo sounds. Sure, the latter might perhaps be part of the original comics as well, but that doesn’t imply one is obliged to transfer the exact same imagery to the movie. If someone were to make a movie of Tintin in Africa and used the same old imagery ‘because the comic portrayed Africans in that way’, we’d all take offence and rightfully so because the images from that comic book are now considered to be racist. In a very similar manner the portrayal of M’Baku in the original Black Panther comics has also been problematic from the start.

2. The duality of ‘good blacks’ vs. ‘bad blacks’: The good guys are authentic, pristine Africans, who still live in harmony with nature. The bad guy is your typical ‘black boy from the hood’. As such, tapping deep into the typical colonial imagery of the ‘unspoiled primitive’ the ‘good’ black is the romanticized and completely idealized black. The ‘bad black’, on the other hand, is simply the contemporary and ‘real life’ black American.

3. The comparisons with the Lion King: The narrative similarities with the Lion King are painfully obvious: the king of the pristine and glorious land, is betrayed by his Uncle/Nephew, after which the new king is banished, yet he returns and with the help of his lioness(es) and warrior monkey(s), he’s saved. It only lacked a remix of the song The Circle of Life to make the message complete: Africa = savanna.

4. The crude portrayal of voodoo and its importance for the story: What makes Black Panther so strong is not his skill or his brains. (In fact, when ‘simply human’ he loses the fight quite often.) Rather, what makes him strong is some sort of voodoo trick involving plants, shamanism and a drug which makes your veins literally black as if you’re possessed by a Demon — which eventually the Black Panther is, since you can just as well ‘exorcise’ him with some counter-voodoo. And of course, the viewer won’t find any references to deeper philosophy, mythology or theology of genuine Ifá. No, the viewer only gets to see the crudest archetypical Hollywood portrayal of voodoo-as-black-magic.

Then, the somewhat more hidden stuff

5. The strange message of the futuristic element: There is no need to attack the genuine cultural phenomenon of afrofuturism at large, but what I found at least a bit bizarre from the start of the Black Panther hype was the craze for the fact that finally there was a movie about blacks who were technologically advanced. When the whole movie is about a mysterious country that pretends to be poor and outwardly projects a typical image of a third world country while underneath its surface lies some incredibly advanced technology, the eventual message simply seems to be this: “See, underneath every seemingly primitive African hides a (possible) modern Westerner!”

6. The contrasting morality of blacks and whites: All black protagonists are morally ambivalent. King T’Chaka, is a good king and father but hides his mistake, general Okoye is very loyal but because of her loyalty goes through a conflict of conscience when Killmonger takes over, the border guard W’Kabi is strong and adamant, but eventually chooses to follow Killmonger when the latter comes to power, king T’Challa has a good and wise heart but has many doubts throughout the movie. Even N’Jobu, who betrayed king T’Chaka, only did so because he was genuinely aggrieved by the plight of African Americans. The same is true for his son: he’s power hungry and aggressive yet also hides a deep love for his father and upholds a sincere wish to free ‘his people’. The only non-ambivalent characters are the two whites. Ulysses is pure evil and Everett is pure goodness. Concerning the latter, even though he’s a CIA agent, his motives are never questioned, his past is irrelevant and his dominant personality trait is one of ‘cute naive innocence’. He not only selflessly saves a life half way through the movie, but in the end also saves the world (since he stops the war planes from reaching their destination).

The only non-ambivalent characters are the two whites.

7. The seemingly subversive but eventually not so impressive flips of gender roles: In Wakanda, women are seemingly strong. But eventually there’s no question whatsoever that the men are the kings and the women (even when they’re fierce warriors or genius scientific whizz-kids) are on a constant lookout for a man who can help them. As such, general Okoye still needs the guidance of a righteous leader and princess Shuri needs someone to fly her plane. The only ones taking matters truly into their own hands (i.e. without following orders or loyalties) are men.

8. The role of vibranium (and how it’s the only thing that makes Wakanda ‘advanced’): When Wakanda is an advanced technological country, it’s not because of their inherent intelligence or their approach to society. It’s a ‘coincidence’ and has everything to do with a special resource: vibranium. (It’s also taken for granted they do not wish to share this resource with the rest of the world and that as such it will not only lead to technological advancement but also to conflict.)

9. The convoluted relation between tradition and power: In Wakanda, the traditions of old are seemingly revered as holy. But when the King loses in a fair fight, all of the sudden, anything goes. He can breach traditions and retake his power simply because he’s ‘the good guy’. So eventually there is no sanctity of tradition at all. It’s simply about power. The colonial undertone should be clear: ‘Africans are stuck in their traditions. They should abandon them, because power is what truly makes the world go round.’ This becomes amply clear in T’Challa’s relation with Killmonger. One of T’Challa’s great grievances is the fact that his father left a Wakandan kid behind in ‘the hood’ and did not try to save him from his lot (which, of course, could apparently do nothing but make him aggressive). Yet killing that same kid simply because he’s not likeable when he’s a bit older is seemingly OK — even though Killmonger won the traditional battle fair and square. Though morally completely inconsistent, it does remain very consistent with the already mentioned dichotomy of the ‘good’ (pristine African) blacks and ‘bad’ (hoody) blacks. And of course, the ‘bad’ blacks by definition want to take over the world because they hate whites — so they have to be stopped, no matter what tradition or morality dictates.

The colonial undertone should be clear: ‘Africans are stuck in their traditions. They should abandon them, because power is what truly makes the world go round.’

10. The dominance of the underlying myth of the hero: The most classical structure of probably 99% of all blockbuster Hollywood movies is the classical ‘myth of the hero’. The hero who first felt small but received support from a wise man; the hero who travels and conquers dangers; the hero who confronts his darkest fears in an epic battle for evil; the hero who not only saves himself but also the world. Although it’s a universal story, in modern Western culture it’s so dominant that it seemingly became the only way to tell an exciting story. Just compare, for example, Disney hits with, for example, some Japanese anime hits from studio Gibli. The latter are full of more Buddhist themes and as such often stray from the typical myth of the hero pattern. In various African cultures as well, other mythical patterns and archetypes can be found in the traditional storytelling. However, Black Panther is, from start to finish, the purest form of the hero myth. Even the previous Avenger movies such as The Winter Soldier and Civil War breached the pattern more (having the superheroes fighting each other). Yet in Black Panther there’s no single cultural change or breach of this subconscious hero pattern. As a result, there’s also no trace whatsoever of philosophical concepts like Ubuntu or the morality underlying the well-known South-African truth-commissions. There is only one simple plot: a dualism of good vs. evil and a hero who saves the day because he fights bravely and eventually crushes evil in an antagonistic fight.

11. The Westernization of Wakanda as a result of the hero myth: Eventually the journey of the hero leads to Wakanda becoming a ‘modern state’ like Western states. After the fights have been settled and all is said and done, Wakanda becomes more open (read: less protectionist and thus more neoliberal). It also portrays a tendency to go and ‘save others’ through outreach programs. All in all then, the whole ‘technological advancement’ of Wakanda was nothing but a shallow layer. Eventually the story is still about a ‘not so modern’ country that needs to be ‘modernized’ by a King more in contact with the West.

And finally, the most disconcerting xenophobic and nationalist issues

12. The supremacy of nationalism: Just like any other successful blockbuster, the cinematic tension isn’t simply built on the action and special effects, but also on a couple of moral dilemmas which define the relationships between the protagonists and ignite the dynamics of the story. The first moral dilemma in Black Panther, which surfaces in various forms, is between love for a person and love for a nation. One example is how T’Challa and Nakia apparently can’t marry because of T’Challa’s loyalty to his kingdom and Nakia’s wish to help those outside the country. They only find a solution in T’Challa giving state subsidies to Nakia’s work. A second and even more explicit example is played out between Okoye and W’Kabi. Which of the two types of love should be held high is made most obvious when they confront each other in battle: “You would kill me my love?” W’Kabi asks. Okoye unflinchingly answers: “For Wakanda? Without question.” Hence, nationalism is the main ideology of Wakandans. The nation state is supreme and should receive the highest love of its citizens. Even though the concept of nation states is a product of modern, Western culture, the question is never asked what a traditional Wakandan view of society might be. Nationalist ideals are taken for granted and they’re only threatened when Wakandans fall in love or when they ‘relapse’ into tribalism.

13. The antagonism of state and race: The second moral dilemma which surfaces throughout the movie is between ‘loyalty to the state’ and ‘being the leader of ‘the cause’ — the cause being ‘the effort to save other blacks’. In short: a dilemma between state and race. Apparently Wakanda doesn’t have any other cultural or traditional approach to these matters. The elite of the country hold very similar ideas as white nationalist elites which have a long history of societal dilemmas between ‘protecting their country’ and ‘protecting mankind from barbarians/primitive races/terrorists/…’

The nation state is supreme and should receive the highest love of its citizens. Even though the concept of nation states is a product of modern, Western culture, the question is never asked what a traditional Wakandan view of society might be. Nationalist ideals are taken for granted and they’re only threatened when Wakandans fall in love or when they ‘relapse’ into tribalism.

14. The projection of typical white xenophobic fears: Following from the two previous moral dilemmas, the typical xenophobia of Western whites has been fully projected onto blacks. The Wakandan elites don’t want to open the borders of their country for refugees because they want to preserve the ‘purity’ of their pristine country and culture. It even instituted Frontex and USBP style border patrols. There actually aren’t many blockbuster movies where such a contemporary form of xenophobia (rampant in Europe and the US) is so explicitly, consistently and straightforwardly portrayed. Yet once it does take center stage and becomes a central part of the critique within an action movie aimed at a broad public, apparently it’s something black people are culpable of. (Also interesting in this respect: in all their fear to preserve their ‘pristine’ Wakandan nature and culture, apparently their technological advancements are of no concern whatsoever. For some magical reason, their technology simply doesn’t seem to have any impact on their nature or culture. I guess vibranium is by definition ‘clean vibranium’ — just like Tump’s mythical concept of ‘clean coal’.)

15. The blackwashed white savior complex: When a solution for the dilemmas of ‘personal relations’ vs. ‘state loyalty’ and ‘race’ vs. ‘state’ is eventually found, that solution exists in ‘outreach’. Why not truly open Wakanda, bring in all the refugees and show that another society is possible? Why not start sharing knowledge and technology with other African countries to make them economically stronger and thus break the true strength of the former colonialists and current neocolonialists? No, the only option is to act exactly like the (neo)colonizer: take pity with a group of downtrodden people in a faraway country, collect some money ‘for the poor’ and then missionize, patronize and civilize. As such, the outreach programs are also by definition oriented on blacks who are in need of help (the ‘bad blacks from the hood’ who need to be turned into ‘good blacks’), even though Wakanda could just as well start outreach programs among whites, for example, to decolonize their minds.

So, to conclude
Sure, representation in Hollywood matters. Sure, we need more black heroes. Sure, we need more strong female characters. But in the end, Black Panther is nothing but a racist, colonial, xenophobic movie. It’s a distinctly Western technology worshipping myth of the hero. It’s blackwashed white nationalism.

So now the hype has gone, perhaps it’s time for some thorough analysis and criticism. No, we shouldn’t applaud this type of movie because it has some cool black women warriors and a shiny afrofuturist Panther King. Quite the contrary, we should strongly resist such neoliberal efforts to commodify, commercialize and privatize the anti-racist struggle.


https://kifkif.be/cnt/artikel/15-reasons-why-black-panther-nationalist-xenophobic-colonial-and-racist-movie-6036




1393
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Ezyo on August 12, 2020, 01:15:44 pm
Ooooof.. that's.. a BIG ooof. I couldn't even get through that list it was so cringey and the story went over their head... Hard
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: BlindWedjat on August 12, 2020, 02:05:49 pm
Why am I not surprised that is from a Dutch website lol.
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Emperorjones on August 12, 2020, 05:11:58 pm
With comics, along with other pop culture entertainment these days, I feel caught between two extremes. I'm not a fan of the  idea that entertainment should not be 'political' and that diversity automatically is bad, 'forced', or is "SJW", though on the other hand, I'm not a fan of some of the political and social agendas I do feel are being put into entertainment today. The Star Wars sequel trilogy is a great illustration of these extremes for me. Star Trek: Picard is another. As has Ta-Nehisi Coates' Black Panther. I feel that both extremes are shackling or erasing black characters, and by proxy, black audiences. We are caught up in a white pop culture civil war/culture civil war.
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Ture on August 12, 2020, 08:00:58 pm
I remember hearing comments like this before the movie even came out. I even attended an after movie discussion at which the confusion to express one's opinion on how exploitative the Marvel company was in producing the Black Panther that it bordered on insanity. Fortunately for every one of those there were literally thousands singing its praises and millions that were uplifted.

This also reminds me of some of the flack Beyonce is getting from certain quarters on her visual album Black is King. At times there appears to be some anti Afrakan sentiment behind those kinds of criticisms.

I feel you on being caught between the extremes Emperorjones.
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Vic Vega on August 17, 2020, 03:20:41 am
Look I lived thru the 80's and pretty much every film back then didn't hide its pro imperialistic message.

Just look at Stallone's body of work. Hell even the Star Wars prequels were supposed to be an anti Bush allegory, but peeps were so unhappy with the movies that they didn't care what Lucas was trying to say about the Bush Administration they were just wondering what he was trying to say about the Jedi ( which is par for the course).

All movies ( and all art period ) are political but it's only an issue when the viewer doesn't like the message.

Anyone remember hom much mileage Marvel and DC got our of their very special "Drugs are Bad" issues back in the day?

Everyone does message stuff.

For anyone claiming Black Panther's message is somehow problematic while ignoring that the Iron Man and Batman films posit that it would be best to allow the driven rich guys run everything is simply hypocritical. And racist on its face, imo.

Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Battle on August 17, 2020, 06:12:35 am
>>> Vic Vega





Well said.
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Emperorjones on August 18, 2020, 05:30:12 am
I remember hearing comments like this before the movie even came out. I even attended an after movie discussion at which the confusion to express one's opinion on how exploitative the Marvel company was in producing the Black Panther that it bordered on insanity. Fortunately for every one of those there were literally thousands singing its praises and millions that were uplifted.

This also reminds me of some of the flack Beyonce is getting from certain quarters on her visual album Black is King. At times there appears to be some anti Afrakan sentiment behind those kinds of criticisms.

I feel you on being caught between the extremes Emperorjones.


I'm glad you mentioned Black Is King. I saw it. I thought it was okay, not her strongest music, but sounded good enough for the film. It had some amazing visuals though I thought it needed more dialogue and better developed characters. I was curious to see what continental Africans thought about it because that's where I've seen some of the flak coming from, or I assume is coming from the continent. The claim that Beyonce is stereotyping Africa, that she isn't really depicting Africa as it is today and is going for more of a magical, mystical, and Wakandization of Africa.

Unfortunately I don't have enough knowledge or understanding of the continent to really grasp the all the things I'm sure Beyonce had in that film and I can't really say that the detractors are wrong. I don't know. I can say that I do think that the idea of overplaying the hood or leaning on black stereotypes in American rap videos is not uncommon so I can imagine there is some validity in what the detractors are saying.

That being said, I also see on social media a kind of disdain from far too many non-black Americans toward black Americans. Some claim that black Americans are solely at fault but aren't seeing how their how words and behavior create divides or add to the divides. I don't think Beyonce was intending to insult continental Africans or disparage Africa with Black Is King. I think she was seeking to reconnect, to try to depict Africa and its peoples, our peoples, as beautiful and wondrous. Perhaps she leaned too much into shantytowns and stuff like that, but I'm not sure. I would like some enlightenment on this.

I was wondering if some of the same folks would have the same smoke if say Taylor Swift had done Black Is King, and Swift did get some pushback for her video that took place in Africa, so there is that, though I can't say it's as much as Beyonce is getting for Black Is King, but I didn't look that deeply into it either. My suspicion still is that continental Africans, like many black people around the world, are much more accepting of how white people portray them than they are when fellow blacks get the opportunity to do so.

The other side of it is that Beyonce might have gotten it for not acknowledging Africa or blacks around the world either if she had say done Black Is King and focused on black Americans in Africa or black Americans period.

Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: supreme illuminati on August 18, 2020, 12:42:38 pm
Look I lived thru the 80's and pretty much every film back then didn't hide its pro imperialistic message.

Just look at Stallone's body of work. Hell even the Star Wars prequels were supposed to be an anti Bush allegory, but peeps were so unhappy with the movies that they didn't care what Lucas was trying to say about the Bush Administration they were just wondering what he was trying to say about the Jedi ( which is par for the course).

All movies ( and all art period ) are political but it's only an issue when the viewer doesn't like the message.

Anyone remember hom much mileage Marvel and DC got our of their very special "Drugs are Bad" issues back in the day?

Everyone does message stuff.

For anyone claiming Black Panther's message is somehow problematic while ignoring that the Iron Man and Batman films posit that it would be best to allow the driven rich guys run everything is simply hypocritical. And racist on its face, imo.



I was born in 1970. The messages were even more blatant in that era than in the '80's. I entirely concur with Vic. Btw, whassup, man? Haven't seen you in a minnit. Where you been?
For some time I ignored or gave a cursory once over to articles I thought were unnecessarily deriding the Black Panther movie but now... well into the era of BP dominance, it might be fun to take a look see with my fellow BP enthusiasts.

15 reasons why Black Panther is a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie

Black Panther was greatly hyped as a ground breaking action movie that redefined the representation of black people in Hollywood. Yet perhaps it’s time for some thorough analysis and criticism. There's a whole list of reasons why Black Panther doesn't really challenge the norms and instead amplifies prejudices and stereotypes. Even more so: its underlying message is, in many ways, quite problematic.

By Jonas Slaats

A couple of weeks after the great hype had toned down, I finally went to see Black Panther. Intrigued as I was about the grand way in which the movie was hailed as some sort of liberation theology for black people, I refused to read any reviews and let the movie speak for itself. Could it really live up to the proposed breach of ‘Hollywood whiteness’? Was it truly such a “dope-ass black movie” as anti-racist television personality Trevor Noah made it seem to be in his Daily Show? Or was it yet another bizarre twist of consumer culture that lured people into thinking this was a norm changing movie even though it actually offered an overdose of those norms?

As it turned out, the latter was the case. With every minute of movie, my sense of disbelief became greater and finally ended in the certainty that this was a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie.

Surfing around on the net afterwards, I quickly realized I wasn’t alone. For example, an article by Kenian political cartoonist Patrick Gathara on the website of the Washington Post, offered some very relevant, thorough arguments. It described how “at heart, it is a movie about a divided, tribalized continent, discovered by a white man who wants nothing more than to take its mineral resources, a continent run by a wealthy, power-hungry, feuding and feudalist elite, where a nation with the most advanced tech and weapons in the world nonetheless has no thinkers to develop systems of transitioning rulership that do not involve lethal combat or coup d’etat.”

Gathara goes on to explain how Black Panther, with a typical Victorian slant, portrays Africans as primitive yet in harmony with
nature, not faced by the complexities of modernity; how the Wakandans technological advancement, apparently still doesn’t make them sophisticated enough to prevent a single American from overtaking the country; and how it thus eventually tells a neocolonial story about somewhat childish people who need a strong guiding hand to lead them.

As Kif Kif predominantly publishes Dutch articles,
our English articles can also be read on our English only Medium magazine.

As such, it’s painful to see how blinding a shiny neoliberal story about ‘triumphing blackness’ can be. Give people some feel-good popcorn and any critical analysis, seems to be thrown into the trashcan faster than anyone can even gobble up the Kool-Aid. So, to strengthen the case of an alternative view, I simply would like to add the following list of 15 reasons why Black Panther is rather problematic.

First, the obvious things…

1. The bluntly racist images: Not only does the movie end with African tribes fighting each other with spears, clubs and machetes but the men of the ‘strong tribe’ in Wakanda dress like monkeys and literally make oo-oo-oo sounds. Sure, the latter might perhaps be part of the original comics as well, but that doesn’t imply one is obliged to transfer the exact same imagery to the movie. If someone were to make a movie of Tintin in Africa and used the same old imagery ‘because the comic portrayed Africans in that way’, we’d all take offence and rightfully so because the images from that comic book are now considered to be racist. In a very similar manner the portrayal of M’Baku in the original Black Panther comics has also been problematic from the start.

2. The duality of ‘good blacks’ vs. ‘bad blacks’: The good guys are authentic, pristine Africans, who still live in harmony with nature. The bad guy is your typical ‘black boy from the hood’. As such, tapping deep into the typical colonial imagery of the ‘unspoiled primitive’ the ‘good’ black is the romanticized and completely idealized black. The ‘bad black’, on the other hand, is simply the contemporary and ‘real life’ black American.

3. The comparisons with the Lion King: The narrative similarities with the Lion King are painfully obvious: the king of the pristine and glorious land, is betrayed by his Uncle/Nephew, after which the new king is banished, yet he returns and with the help of his lioness(es) and warrior monkey(s), he’s saved. It only lacked a remix of the song The Circle of Life to make the message complete: Africa = savanna.

4. The crude portrayal of voodoo and its importance for the story: What makes Black Panther so strong is not his skill or his brains. (In fact, when ‘simply human’ he loses the fight quite often.) Rather, what makes him strong is some sort of voodoo trick involving plants, shamanism and a drug which makes your veins literally black as if you’re possessed by a Demon — which eventually the Black Panther is, since you can just as well ‘exorcise’ him with some counter-voodoo. And of course, the viewer won’t find any references to deeper philosophy, mythology or theology of genuine Ifá. No, the viewer only gets to see the crudest archetypical Hollywood portrayal of voodoo-as-black-magic.

Then, the somewhat more hidden stuff

5. The strange message of the futuristic element: There is no need to attack the genuine cultural phenomenon of afrofuturism at large, but what I found at least a bit bizarre from the start of the Black Panther hype was the craze for the fact that finally there was a movie about blacks who were technologically advanced. When the whole movie is about a mysterious country that pretends to be poor and outwardly projects a typical image of a third world country while underneath its surface lies some incredibly advanced technology, the eventual message simply seems to be this: “See, underneath every seemingly primitive African hides a (possible) modern Westerner!”

6. The contrasting morality of blacks and whites: All black protagonists are morally ambivalent. King T’Chaka, is a good king and father but hides his mistake, general Okoye is very loyal but because of her loyalty goes through a conflict of conscience when Killmonger takes over, the border guard W’Kabi is strong and adamant, but eventually chooses to follow Killmonger when the latter comes to power, king T’Challa has a good and wise heart but has many doubts throughout the movie. Even N’Jobu, who betrayed king T’Chaka, only did so because he was genuinely aggrieved by the plight of African Americans. The same is true for his son: he’s power hungry and aggressive yet also hides a deep love for his father and upholds a sincere wish to free ‘his people’. The only non-ambivalent characters are the two whites. Ulysses is pure evil and Everett is pure goodness. Concerning the latter, even though he’s a CIA agent, his motives are never questioned, his past is irrelevant and his dominant personality trait is one of ‘cute naive innocence’. He not only selflessly saves a life half way through the movie, but in the end also saves the world (since he stops the war planes from reaching their destination).

The only non-ambivalent characters are the two whites.

7. The seemingly subversive but eventually not so impressive flips of gender roles: In Wakanda, women are seemingly strong. But eventually there’s no question whatsoever that the men are the kings and the women (even when they’re fierce warriors or genius scientific whizz-kids) are on a constant lookout for a man who can help them. As such, general Okoye still needs the guidance of a righteous leader and princess Shuri needs someone to fly her plane. The only ones taking matters truly into their own hands (i.e. without following orders or loyalties) are men.

8. The role of vibranium (and how it’s the only thing that makes Wakanda ‘advanced’): When Wakanda is an advanced technological country, it’s not because of their inherent intelligence or their approach to society. It’s a ‘coincidence’ and has everything to do with a special resource: vibranium. (It’s also taken for granted they do not wish to share this resource with the rest of the world and that as such it will not only lead to technological advancement but also to conflict.)

9. The convoluted relation between tradition and power: In Wakanda, the traditions of old are seemingly revered as holy. But when the King loses in a fair fight, all of the sudden, anything goes. He can breach traditions and retake his power simply because he’s ‘the good guy’. So eventually there is no sanctity of tradition at all. It’s simply about power. The colonial undertone should be clear: ‘Africans are stuck in their traditions. They should abandon them, because power is what truly makes the world go round.’ This becomes amply clear in T’Challa’s relation with Killmonger. One of T’Challa’s great grievances is the fact that his father left a Wakandan kid behind in ‘the hood’ and did not try to save him from his lot (which, of course, could apparently do nothing but make him aggressive). Yet killing that same kid simply because he’s not likeable when he’s a bit older is seemingly OK — even though Killmonger won the traditional battle fair and square. Though morally completely inconsistent, it does remain very consistent with the already mentioned dichotomy of the ‘good’ (pristine African) blacks and ‘bad’ (hoody) blacks. And of course, the ‘bad’ blacks by definition want to take over the world because they hate whites — so they have to be stopped, no matter what tradition or morality dictates.

The colonial undertone should be clear: ‘Africans are stuck in their traditions. They should abandon them, because power is what truly makes the world go round.’

10. The dominance of the underlying myth of the hero: The most classical structure of probably 99% of all blockbuster Hollywood movies is the classical ‘myth of the hero’. The hero who first felt small but received support from a wise man; the hero who travels and conquers dangers; the hero who confronts his darkest fears in an epic battle for evil; the hero who not only saves himself but also the world. Although it’s a universal story, in modern Western culture it’s so dominant that it seemingly became the only way to tell an exciting story. Just compare, for example, Disney hits with, for example, some Japanese anime hits from studio Gibli. The latter are full of more Buddhist themes and as such often stray from the typical myth of the hero pattern. In various African cultures as well, other mythical patterns and archetypes can be found in the traditional storytelling. However, Black Panther is, from start to finish, the purest form of the hero myth. Even the previous Avenger movies such as The Winter Soldier and Civil War breached the pattern more (having the superheroes fighting each other). Yet in Black Panther there’s no single cultural change or breach of this subconscious hero pattern. As a result, there’s also no trace whatsoever of philosophical concepts like Ubuntu or the morality underlying the well-known South-African truth-commissions. There is only one simple plot: a dualism of good vs. evil and a hero who saves the day because he fights bravely and eventually crushes evil in an antagonistic fight.

11. The Westernization of Wakanda as a result of the hero myth: Eventually the journey of the hero leads to Wakanda becoming a ‘modern state’ like Western states. After the fights have been settled and all is said and done, Wakanda becomes more open (read: less protectionist and thus more neoliberal). It also portrays a tendency to go and ‘save others’ through outreach programs. All in all then, the whole ‘technological advancement’ of Wakanda was nothing but a shallow layer. Eventually the story is still about a ‘not so modern’ country that needs to be ‘modernized’ by a King more in contact with the West.

And finally, the most disconcerting xenophobic and nationalist issues

12. The supremacy of nationalism: Just like any other successful blockbuster, the cinematic tension isn’t simply built on the action and special effects, but also on a couple of moral dilemmas which define the relationships between the protagonists and ignite the dynamics of the story. The first moral dilemma in Black Panther, which surfaces in various forms, is between love for a person and love for a nation. One example is how T’Challa and Nakia apparently can’t marry because of T’Challa’s loyalty to his kingdom and Nakia’s wish to help those outside the country. They only find a solution in T’Challa giving state subsidies to Nakia’s work. A second and even more explicit example is played out between Okoye and W’Kabi. Which of the two types of love should be held high is made most obvious when they confront each other in battle: “You would kill me my love?” W’Kabi asks. Okoye unflinchingly answers: “For Wakanda? Without question.” Hence, nationalism is the main ideology of Wakandans. The nation state is supreme and should receive the highest love of its citizens. Even though the concept of nation states is a product of modern, Western culture, the question is never asked what a traditional Wakandan view of society might be. Nationalist ideals are taken for granted and they’re only threatened when Wakandans fall in love or when they ‘relapse’ into tribalism.

13. The antagonism of state and race: The second moral dilemma which surfaces throughout the movie is between ‘loyalty to the state’ and ‘being the leader of ‘the cause’ — the cause being ‘the effort to save other blacks’. In short: a dilemma between state and race. Apparently Wakanda doesn’t have any other cultural or traditional approach to these matters. The elite of the country hold very similar ideas as white nationalist elites which have a long history of societal dilemmas between ‘protecting their country’ and ‘protecting mankind from barbarians/primitive races/terrorists/…’

The nation state is supreme and should receive the highest love of its citizens. Even though the concept of nation states is a product of modern, Western culture, the question is never asked what a traditional Wakandan view of society might be. Nationalist ideals are taken for granted and they’re only threatened when Wakandans fall in love or when they ‘relapse’ into tribalism.

14. The projection of typical white xenophobic fears: Following from the two previous moral dilemmas, the typical xenophobia of Western whites has been fully projected onto blacks. The Wakandan elites don’t want to open the borders of their country for refugees because they want to preserve the ‘purity’ of their pristine country and culture. It even instituted Frontex and USBP style border patrols. There actually aren’t many blockbuster movies where such a contemporary form of xenophobia (rampant in Europe and the US) is so explicitly, consistently and straightforwardly portrayed. Yet once it does take center stage and becomes a central part of the critique within an action movie aimed at a broad public, apparently it’s something black people are culpable of. (Also interesting in this respect: in all their fear to preserve their ‘pristine’ Wakandan nature and culture, apparently their technological advancements are of no concern whatsoever. For some magical reason, their technology simply doesn’t seem to have any impact on their nature or culture. I guess vibranium is by definition ‘clean vibranium’ — just like Tump’s mythical concept of ‘clean coal’.)

15. The blackwashed white savior complex: When a solution for the dilemmas of ‘personal relations’ vs. ‘state loyalty’ and ‘race’ vs. ‘state’ is eventually found, that solution exists in ‘outreach’. Why not truly open Wakanda, bring in all the refugees and show that another society is possible? Why not start sharing knowledge and technology with other African countries to make them economically stronger and thus break the true strength of the former colonialists and current neocolonialists? No, the only option is to act exactly like the (neo)colonizer: take pity with a group of downtrodden people in a faraway country, collect some money ‘for the poor’ and then missionize, patronize and civilize. As such, the outreach programs are also by definition oriented on blacks who are in need of help (the ‘bad blacks from the hood’ who need to be turned into ‘good blacks’), even though Wakanda could just as well start outreach programs among whites, for example, to decolonize their minds.

So, to conclude
Sure, representation in Hollywood matters. Sure, we need more black heroes. Sure, we need more strong female characters. But in the end, Black Panther is nothing but a racist, colonial, xenophobic movie. It’s a distinctly Western technology worshipping myth of the hero. It’s blackwashed white nationalism.

So now the hype has gone, perhaps it’s time for some thorough analysis and criticism. No, we shouldn’t applaud this type of movie because it has some cool black women warriors and a shiny afrofuturist Panther King. Quite the contrary, we should strongly resist such neoliberal efforts to commodify, commercialize and privatize the anti-racist struggle.


https://kifkif.be/cnt/artikel/15-reasons-why-black-panther-nationalist-xenophobic-colonial-and-racist-movie-6036




1393



Brother Ture, I too did very much what you did. Scan the article, see the BP diss, stop scanning the article and do something else.

Had I seen this article? I might. Might. Maaayyybeee. Have been encouraged to write a 15 Point counterargument and send it to his paper or whatever, because this fool...descendant of Dutch colonizers...completely missed the point. And so did all the other fools who empathize with or concur with him.
Title: Re: BP Op-Ed Was Black Panther a nationalist, xenophobic, colonial and racist movie?
Post by: Ezyo on August 18, 2020, 02:36:14 pm
The minute they compared BP to the Lion King is when I was done. Like I said in my previous post, it was a big ooof over the writers head and especially with that point (because really the only thing it has in common with Lion King is that it takes place in Africa and a royal family) because it's just as ignorant ad all the other clueless people out there trying to compare it based on nothing except "iTs aFriCa ItS alL tHE sAmE"
Title: Re: BP Op-Black Panther Surges On Amazon & Apple In Wake Of Chadwick Boseman's Death
Post by: Ture on August 30, 2020, 01:33:31 pm
Black Panther’ Surges On Amazon And Apple Charts In Wake Of Chadwick Boseman Death
By Bruce Haring August 30, 2020, 3:04 PM EDT

(https://s.yimg.com/ny/api/res/1.2/YhakUeT9W6n2LCAroODsgQ--/YXBwaWQ9aGlnaGxhbmRlcjt3PTk2MDtoPTcwMi43MTY0OTk1NDQyMTE1/https://s.yimg.com/uu/api/res/1.2/Oc4a0f6wsOEvsDQx5rrsyg--~B/aD0yNDA5O3c9MzI5MTthcHBpZD15dGFjaHlvbg--/https://media.zenfs.com/en/deadline.com/de36894822197c7109f689c73b4cf878)

Renewed interest in 2018’s Black Panther has emerged in the wake of the death of film star Chadwick Boseman on Friday.

The film is now in the top five most popular films on Apple and Amazon charts. The film is also being shown on TBS and ABC tonight, and is streaming on Disney+.

Black Panther is at No. 3 on Amazon’s best-selling movies list on Sunday morning, trailing only the new Bill & Ted Face the Music.

On Apple, Black Panther is No. 4 on the best-seller list, just behind another Chadwick Boseman film, 2013’s 42, the story of baseball pioneer Jackie Robinson. No. 1 Was Bill and Ted Face The Music and No. 2 was The King of Staten Island.

Black Panther, which joined Disney+ in the spring, is now in the service’s top carousel window. It carries the message, “In remembrance of Chadwick Boseman.”

Fellow Disney property ABC will broadcast a primetime Black Panther tonight at 8 PM ET/PT. After the film, an ABC News special titled Chadwick Boseman — A Tribute for a King follows, documeting the actor’s life and career.

TBS airs Black Panther tonight for the second night at 8 PM ET/PT.
Title: Re: BP Op-Black Panther Surges On Amazon & Apple In Wake Of Chadwick Boseman's Death
Post by: Ture on September 02, 2020, 03:42:28 pm
Why Chadwick Boseman’s fight for African accents in ‘Black Panther’ was so important

Opinion by Karen Attiah Global Opinions editor

In an emotional tribute to actor Chadwick Boseman, who passed away on Friday at the age of 43, director Ryan Coogler revealed the moment that he knew he wanted to make “Black Panther.” It was while watching Boseman act in an unfinished cut of “Captain America: Civil War” — speaking his lines in Xhosa with South African actor John Kani.

“Chad and John began conversing in a language I had never heard before,” Coogler said. “It sounded familiar, full of the same clicks and smacks that young black children would make in the States. The same clicks that we would often be chided for being disrespectful or improper. But, it had a musicality to it that felt ancient, powerful, and African.”

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ea/7a/dd/ea7add1a28713f01f41c07abdaa73cc9.gif)

Boseman’s commitment to speaking Xhosa on camera was one of the reasons Coogler signed on to direct the film. It was just one way Boseman helped show that centering Africanness — putting African aesthetics, language and accents front and center — is a fight worth having.

It was only after his death that the world learned that Boseman had been fighting colon cancer for four years, including while playing T’Challa. Alongside his health battles, he was fighting Marvel itself to ensure Africa wasn’t presented through a colonial lens. In 2018, he told the Hollywood Reporter that Marvel initially thought that the accents would be “too much.” “I felt the exact opposite — like, if I speak with a British accent, what’s gonna happen when I go home? It felt to me like a deal-breaker,” he said. “I was like, ‘No, this is such an important factor that if we lose this right now, what else are we gonna throw away for the sake of making people feel comfortable?”

In choosing to fight for African accents, Boseman was fighting against the legacies of colonialism. The fictional kingdom of Wakanda is supposed to be a powerful African nation, one that is self-sufficient — a representation of what could have been if African nations had not been colonized and plundered for their resources by outside powers. Marvel would have undermined one of the central motifs of “Black Panther” if it had gotten its way and forced its actors to adopt British accents, to mimic the tongue of one of Africa’s most powerful colonizers.

(https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/marveldcuniverse/images/5/59/T-chaka.png/revision/latest?cb=20180709123133)

Boseman worked with a dialect coach for his role, to take on a Xhosa accent to match the heritage of Kani, who played his father, T’Chaka, in the films. Kenyan actress Lupita Nyong’o spoke in her native Kenyan accent. The other accents were “all over the place” as Kenyan journalist Larry Madowo said at the time. “They wanted to base the accents on Xhosa from South Africa, but some of it sounded Nigerian, others sounded more Ugandan. It was very confusing, and I understand perfecting an accent is difficult, but oh, my goodness, it was so messy!”

As a first-generation American with roots in Ghana, I recognize what Boseman did to champion a fantasy rendering of Africanness on a big screen may have been messy to our ears. But it was important for global Black culture. Back in 2009, when I lived in Accra, Ghana, as a media researcher, I remember attending radio journalism classes where the instructors lectured aspiring radio presenters in the class to approximate the accent of Queen’s English. (The instructors tried to correct my American accent, too). The message they were sending was clear: To be seen as authoritative, respectable, worthy of being listened to, you needed to speak in the same accent as the very people who helped to subjugate Ghanaians.

“Black Panther” is proof that isn’t true. And today, more and more Black creators of African heritage are finding their way onto the big and small screen, and bringing African accents and languages with them.

It was affirming to see that, in the brilliant and provocative HBO series “I May Destroy You,” the main character, Arabella, played by the show’s writer and creator Michaela Coel, goes home to her Ghanaian household, where her mother speaks Twi and Twi-accented English. Arabella’s brother even teases her for not knowing enough of her own language. On television, the American sitcom “Bob Hearts Abishola” is about a White man who falls in love with a Nigerian nurse. My mother, who grew up in Nigeria, always tries to catch the show when it comes on, chuffed to see Nigerian accents and immigrant culture represented on an American sitcom.

(https://fsa.zobj.net/crop.php?r=4qvbEXqrVcl0lnalMXtPAecUEj_R1_06WbkI8R1wEQXGfx5iemTsjSl42np6VcIClYS_AITiBtHUPHoe9j6rYPL9ctkPMA87SCHLfBKO1cSuP8mluMee03UI5gr6iGYGR7oPlPYlyrb46kEK)

“Black Panther” now holds its place in history as one of the most successful superhero movies of all time, grossing more than $1 billion in global box office sales. But to many of us, Boseman and Coogler’s artistic commitment to centering Africanness was the true victory. It’s why Boseman’s sudden death hurts so much in this moment. When icons and heroes pass on, it is always painful. But it feels especially cruel to lose Boseman so suddenly in a year in which the fight for Black life and against white supremacy has gone global.

Our Black Panther has gone to be with the ancestors. But we can take comfort that Boseman opened a portal, proving that future stories rooted in Africanness and Blackness deserve to be fought for.



https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/01/why-chadwick-bosemans-fight-african-accents-black-panther-was-so-important/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/09/01/why-chadwick-bosemans-fight-african-accents-black-panther-was-so-important/)
Title: Re: BP OP-Boseman’s fight for African accents in ‘Black Panther’ was so important
Post by: Ezyo on September 03, 2020, 09:23:47 am
There is so much out there about what Chadwick was doing and has done, from turning down equity deals because he didn't want to hurt the BP Brand for black children, to how he approached roles, Cooglers tribute to him, MBJs. The man was/is a walking role model, the more I read, the more it hurts or know just what kind of person we lost to frakking cancer. Dude was so aware and literally living in year 3000s
Title: Re: BP OP-Boseman’s fight for African accents in ‘Black Panther’ was so important
Post by: Ture on September 06, 2020, 12:03:25 pm
Africans Mourn Chadwick Boseman: 'A Great Tree Has Fallen'
By Ifeanyi Nsofor

(https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2020/09/01/ap_20245685200452_custom-d5cab0642b151aa1d2da46aec72bc2a33815e6b2-s800-c85.jpg)

The death of actor Chadwick Boseman last week at the age of 43 came as a shock to many Africans. I liken it to the death of a great African King. In my Igbo culture, when a great king passes on, we say, "Oke osisi adaala n'obodo," which means "a great tree has fallen in the land." It is a rare occurrence for great trees to fall. However, the fall is also not the end of the tree because its deep roots ensures it keeps sending out new sprouts.

Boseman's life is like that. Part of him will continue to live on through his films and inspire us, especially his role as King T'Challa in Black Panther.

The 2018 film was a hit across Africa. The fictional country of Wakanda, which was depicted in the movie as the most technologically advanced society in the world, was the nation that Africans wish they had. The film reminded us of what is possible for African countries – and how our continent could be powerful and respected.

I recall how excited Africans were to watch the film. In Ghana, people were dancing, drumming and wearing traditional clothing at the premiere. The former vice president of Nigeria took his family on a special outing to see the film. Others provided viewing opportunities to those who could not afford it. My friend Angela Ochu Baiye, a 2019 Mandela Washington fellow for the Young African Leaders Initiative, was so moved by Black Panther that she raised funds and took 200 children from poor communities to watch the movie at a cinema in Abuja, Nigeria. "To see yourself represented in fiction, especially through a lead character, is meaningful and profoundly empowering beyond words," she wrote on her social media.

Boseman's unexpected death has left Africans feeling as if we have lost one of ours. Indeed, he was one of us. During a 2018 interview on The Late Show with Stephen Colbert, Boseman acknowledged his African lineage. His family is from the Yoruba people, one of Nigeria's largest tribes, and the Limba, who come from Sierra Leone. He said his African background was one of his influences for making Black Panther more human. He succeeded in making the character someone we all wish we knew.

Africans have been sharing tributes to Boseman across social media. It's a reflection of how beloved he is on the continent. Nigerian Stephanie Busari, CNN's supervising producer for Africa, tweeted, "Chadwick Boseman will never know how much we loved him. Battling colon cancer, shooting films in between bouts of chemo and surgery. What amazing strength. He once said: 'The struggles along the way are only meant to shape you for your purpose.' Rest on King. Long live T'challa!"

South African activist Bele Nanotshe tweeted: "I would like to send my deepest condolences to Chadwick Boseman family and friends. On behalf of South Africa, I say we are proud of you and your achievements and the genuine manner in which you portrayed Pan Africanism in Black Panther movie. Rest in peace. We will indeed miss u my bro."

African corporations have also found ways to honor Boseman's death. On Aug. 31, the TV network M-Net Movies, in collaboration with Marvel Studios, aired Black Panther on one of its mainstream channels to share the film with a wide African audience.

In Africa and beyond, Boseman's death also has brought global attention to colon cancer. Many are amazed how the actor handled the disease with superpower attributes. Despite his diagnosis at age 39, he continued acting. I am hoping for a Chadwick Boseman effect that would lead to an increase in screenings for colon cancer, similar to the Jane Goody effect. After the British reality TV star died from cervical cancer in 2009, the U.K. saw a surge in cervical cancer screenings.

In mourning Chadwick's death, Dr. Zainab Shinkafi Bagudu, a Nigerian board member of the Union for International Cancer Control, reminds all that "Cancer is constantly in our faces; regardless of age, sex or ethnicity. It seems to beat even those with the best hospitals and access to care. We must not despair. We have to remain vigilant, watch for early signs and live a healthy lifestyle."

Runcie Chidebe, a Nigerian cancer control advocate sent me this statement: "The U.S. and global cancer control must consider reviewing the screening age for colon cancer. Chadwick's diagnoses at 39 is not unique. In Nigeria, we have seen 30-year-olds diagnosed of colon cancer."

Indeed, the greatest tribute that Africa can give to Boseman is to ensure there are no more untimely deaths from colon cancer on the continent. African governments must increase access to preventative and curative services for colon cancer and other cancers. Sadly, the current access to prevention and treatment of cancers is abysmal in sub-Saharan Africa. As of 2019, Nigeria had just 4 cancer treatment centers for an estimated population of 200 million. For this population, Nigeria would require at least 170 cancer treatment centers, according to the World Health Organization.

As Africans, we have to hold our governments accountable to prevent and treat cancers. Moreover, with COVID-19 raging globally and cancers being risk factors for severe illness in those infected, there is no time to waste.

As Africans, we take solace in what King T'Challa said in Black Panther: "In my culture, death is not the end."

We believe he lives on. We are stronger now that such a great king has transited to become one of our ancestors, watching over us. We will be strong. We will live like the Black Panther.

Ifeanyi Nsofor is the director of policy and advocacy at a health group called Nigeria Health Watch and Senior New Voices Fellow at the Aspen Institute.


https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/09/01/908471876/africans-mourn-chadwick-boseman-a-great-tree-has-fallen (https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/09/01/908471876/africans-mourn-chadwick-boseman-a-great-tree-has-fallen)
Title: Re: BP OP- STORMZY - SUPERHEROES video
Post by: Ture on September 09, 2020, 11:25:47 am
(https://www.nme.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/stormzysuperheroes-696x442.jpg)
(https://www.stashmedia.tv/wp-content/uploads/ssshot12-640x360.jpg)
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/q-EW4-B11hw/hqdefault.jpg)
Play it from here.
https://youtu.be/q-EW4-B11hw (https://youtu.be/q-EW4-B11hw)
courtesy of CBR's Pumbaa
Title: Re: BP OP- STORMZY - SUPERHEROES video
Post by: Ezyo on September 09, 2020, 04:28:18 pm
(https://www.nme.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/stormzysuperheroes-696x442.jpg)
(https://www.stashmedia.tv/wp-content/uploads/ssshot12-640x360.jpg)
(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/q-EW4-B11hw/hqdefault.jpg)
Play it from here.
https://youtu.be/q-EW4-B11hw (https://youtu.be/q-EW4-B11hw)
courtesy of CBR's Pumbaa

This was very powerful, I thoroughly enjoyed it
Title: Re: BP OP- STORMZY - SUPERHEROES video
Post by: Ture on September 13, 2020, 03:05:33 pm
This is who fans want to replace Chadwick Boseman as the Black Panther
By Chris Smith

One of the obvious choices would be to recast a different actor as T’Challa/Black Panther. But it’s unlikely that fans would appreciate such a move. It would also be incredibly difficult for a different actor to accept the role. Boseman is T’Challa, and his Black Panther should be honored by not giving the part to a different actor, even if Boseman’s passing causes issues for Marvel’s plans.

full article
https://bgr.com/2020/09/13/marvel-movies-black-panther-2-chadwick-boseman-replacement-options/

What Should Come Next for Black Panther after Loss of Boseman
Reuters news agency reported this story. Alice Bryant

Writers, professors and activists spoke to Reuters news agency about the cultural importance of the movie and Boseman’s performance. Some said Marvel should honor Boseman by retiring the character of T’Challa and choosing another character to name as Black Panther.

full article
https://learningenglish.voanews.com/a/what-should-come-next-for-black-panther-after-loss-of-boseman/5575842.html

Disney Has Reportedly Decided On How To Proceed With Black Panther 2
By Scott Campbell

According to our intel, the plan at the moment is for T’Challa to be written out of Black Panther 2 before the story starts as he’ll apparently die off-screen. Shuri will then assume the mantle and become Wakanda’s new protector on a permanent basis.

full article
https://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/disney-reportedly-decided-proceed-black-panther-2/

(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/3d/5f/b6/3d5fb68a3e60e00ed25c3f122256085e.jpg)

IS THIS WHAT FANS REALLY WANT?!?
Title: Re: BP OP- STORMZY - SUPERHEROES video
Post by: supreme illuminati on September 13, 2020, 03:30:05 pm
This is who fans want to replace Chadwick Boseman as the Black Panther
By Chris Smith

One of the obvious choices would be to recast a different actor as T’Challa/Black Panther. But it’s unlikely that fans would appreciate such a move. It would also be incredibly difficult for a different actor to accept the role. Boseman is T’Challa, and his Black Panther should be honored by not giving the part to a different actor, even if Boseman’s passing causes issues for Marvel’s plans.

full article
https://bgr.com/2020/09/13/marvel-movies-black-panther-2-chadwick-boseman-replacement-options/

What Should Come Next for Black Panther after Loss of Boseman
Reuters news agency reported this story. Alice Bryant

Writers, professors and activists spoke to Reuters news agency about the cultural importance of the movie and Boseman’s performance. Some said Marvel should honor Boseman by retiring the character of T’Challa and choosing another character to name as Black Panther.

full article
https://learningenglish.voanews.com/a/what-should-come-next-for-black-panther-after-loss-of-boseman/5575842.html

Disney Has Reportedly Decided On How To Proceed With Black Panther 2
By Scott Campbell

According to our intel, the plan at the moment is for T’Challa to be written out of Black Panther 2 before the story starts as he’ll apparently die off-screen. Shuri will then assume the mantle and become Wakanda’s new protector on a permanent basis.

full article
https://wegotthiscovered.com/movies/disney-reportedly-decided-proceed-black-panther-2/

(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/3d/5f/b6/3d5fb68a3e60e00ed25c3f122256085e.jpg)

IS THIS WHAT FANS REALLY WANT?!?



Letitia Wright cannot carry the action that BP 2 would require. I love her as an actress, but she is not BP. She can be The Ancient Future, but not BP of the MCU.

Bottom line is? I will support BP 2 even with Letitia as the new BP. I will wish her the best...sincerely. But we need the Afrakan man to be front and center...as T'Challa...in this series. The most persuasive argument to me is that EVERYONE knows that each of these actors would be replaced in their iconic roles. Robert Downey Jr. IS Iron Man...until the NEXT Iron Man comes around. BP IS T'Chadwick...until the NEXT BP is cast.

This is a deep tragedy. I'm still not adjusted to it. However, I do know that Chadwick would want the BP legacy to continue. We ALL know that EVERY ACTOR who debuted the heroes in the MCU wants their characters to outlive them.

Title: Re: BP OP - Fake News - What the "Fans" Supposedly Want?!?
Post by: Ture on September 13, 2020, 04:52:24 pm
What some real fans are saying...

Quote
Not being disrespectful to Chadwick because he gave us a great T'Challa but the role has to be recast. I don't expect anyone who takes the role to be the same as Chad but they shouldn't be afraid of it either. If anything they should be inspired by what Chadwick has done. We're all feeling some kind of way now and some want to put T'Challa on the shelf. I can't speak for Chad but does anyone honestly think that he would want a character as powerful and inspirational as T'Challa just put aside?That just doesn't seem right.

If anything we need T'Challa to inspire more young black kids to be heroes. Just because we have Shuri doesn't mean we need to lose T'Challa.


courtesy of CBR's Marvell2100

Quote
Yea I disagree. These are characters, immortal concepts and representations of things and ideas that actors bring to life. It's not easy or fun but replacing a character in the an ongoing continuity isn't nearly as much of an issue if the actor and script are up to par, at least for me.

Like I said, this is a golden age of comic adaptations. T'Challa deserves to be at the forefront of this cultural zeitgeist before he gets phased out for Shuri or Kaspar Cole. Anything other than that is a missed opportunity with potential consequences in other mediums.


courtesy of CBR's chief12d

Quote
I'll say this about recasting T'Challa in the MCU...I personally think Disney SHOULD recast T'Challa. Because so far, he already "died" in his solo movie, then was "resurrected" later in the movie and reclaimed his kingdom, THEN died FOR REAL when he got snapped by Thanos in Infinity War, then got resurrected FOR REAL when he came back through the portal in End Game, thus regaining his kingdom. It would look extremely foolish for Disney to now kill the character off YET AGAIN and thereby have him lose his kingdom YET AGAIN. How many times are they going to kill this black man?

Also, if Disney does not recast T'Challa, then they would be setting up a dangerous precedence, because God forbid, what if other actors and actresses portraying major characters in the MCU pass away? Are they not going to recast those characters and kill those characters off as well, especially if those characters' story arcs aren't complete? If they do, it would look odd. If they don't recast T'Challa, but recast those other major characters, it would also look odd.

In addition, T'Challa himself in the MCU was/is a major inspiration to a lot of people because of the Black Panther movie, and I don't feel as though you permanently kill off a character like that, knowing how important he is to a lot of people, especially kids.

I also think it's odd that some people on certain sites can't fathom having T'Challa be portrayed by anyone other than Chadwick Boseman. It's definitely sad that Chadwick has transitioned, but to act as though no other black man can ever portray T'Challa because that actor might not be as good at it as Chadwick was, is baffling to me. Because now we're talking about denying other black actors the opportunity to portray T'Challa, who is such an iconic character.

That's almost like saying, "Well, I loved the way this particular writer wrote Black Panther in his solo series, but since the writer passed away, I really can't see anyone else writing T'Challa as well as HE did, therefore, I don't think anyone else should write T'Challa in his own solo book, because the writing of T'Challa might not be as good. So let's replace T'Challa in his own book with Shuri, or another character!"


courtesy of CBR's MoneySpider

Quote
If they don't recast MCU Panther, my Black Panther fandom may die with Chadwick.

BP's comics suck. He isn't in the limited Marvel video games yet and if he isn't int he movies anymore, they will stop even having him in DLC stuff. They will have the replacement.

I guess there might be a new cartoon eventually but there is nothing on the horizon. And even if there is a cartoon, they may just decide to use the replacement. Because they makes perfect business sense and I wouldn't blame them.

I would have nothing to look forward too in regards to BP fandom.

So basically, I would have my trades, one movie, EMH and Pantherjack, and some cameo movies. Id just be an old head talking abot the good ol days aka what... 2 whole ass years lol?

MCU Black Panther Franchise without T'challa isn't my thing. I saw T'chaka get blown up. So T'challa get stabbed and thrown off a water fall, say T'challa get disintegrated, and then I gotta sit through another movie about someone else taking the mantle because T'challa died again? Yeah no thanks.

If MCU Shuri was like comic shuri it would be easier to stomach but sh*t... MCU shuri ain't about that life so they would have to retool a character they already retooled just to make it fit. And then we get ANOTHER "live up to my dead relative" story. Joy. Can't wait. Maybe they can have Wakandan's fight over it in the movie too! because that would be exciting again!


courtesy of CBR's MindofShadow
Title: Re: BP OP - Fake News - What the "Fans" Supposedly Want?!?
Post by: Ture on September 23, 2020, 08:01:18 pm
What some real fans are saying...

Sterling K. Brown on Chadwick Boseman and 'Black Panther' Future

Tuesday on "The Talk" actor Sterling K. Brown opens up about former "Black Panther" co-star and friend, Chadwick Boseman and the franchise's future. "There is no replacing the epitome of grace and dignity. Chad was the perfect T'Challa. May he rest in peace, may he rest in power. Man, bright light, boy.

That being said, and I believe that Chad would feel the same way, the story of "Black Panther" is bigger than one person. The story of the diaspora of blackness throughout the world, and the way in which this movie sort of galvanized and brought us together, was so amazing."

Brown adds, "The most technologically advanced country in the world, with all the resources that they have, with all the intelligence that they have, we gotta keep going. It means so much for us to be seen in that light, and then for other people to see themselves in us.

Because for such a long time we've been told, we can't relate to black stories, that people won't be able to see themselves. But you know what, we just sold a billion, so I think we can go ahead and do it again."


https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/talk-sterling-k-brown-chadwick-213057203.html (https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/talk-sterling-k-brown-chadwick-213057203.html)
Title: Re: BP OP - Sterling K. Brown on Chadwick Boseman and 'Black Panther' Future
Post by: Ture on September 25, 2020, 09:49:45 pm
What some real fans are saying...

Quote
My Two Cents: Killing off T'Challa is a short-sighted idea and would be a mistake on a number of levels, many of which are represented in MoneySpider's quote above. Absolutely loved Chadwick and am still grieving his loss. However, T'Challa could and should be bigger. He should continue to thrill and inspire our youth while providing a shining example of Black strength and excellence! This is needed and should not be dismissed. There are many more T'Challa stories to tell and more Black artists to convey them, Aldis Hodge and Jonathan Majors come to mind. Not as replacements for Chadwick, but successors. I love Letitia and Shuri and would love to see the character further explored, pursuing her own stories. In over 50 years, I've consumed a ton of stories featuring a plethora of heroes. Precious few have looked like me. Our kids have it better in this regard thanks to T'Challa and Luke Cage and Black Lightning. I had Flash Gordon, Batman and James Bond. Much as we love the players, it's the characters that allow us to imagine and dream. Now of all times is not the time to take T'Challa away. I truly believe Chadwick would agree.

My Two Cents.

Peace,

Mont

Quote
I just feel like cutting T'Challas time short would be a huge mistake all over the guise of being "respectful"  and "no one could replace Chadwick" I mean with Spiderman, Batman, James Bond and superman movies, no one is replacing the actor that played the character before them, but rather they are a successor. And the same should be done for Chad. I mean look at what he has said in interviews, no where does it sound like he wanted the character to live and die with him. He wanted to keep inspiring people as the character on obviously, but he wanted the character to continue to grow. Plus I really just have a hard time not seeing Shuri as a Tony Stark type, quippy and fun, but not serious enough for the role of ruler and BP, and if you have a sudden change in personality it can be weird..

And again I am all for Black girl empowerment, it's a great thing, however, it needs to be demanded and pushed in it's own vein with characters who are their own stand alone heroes and not supporting cast members of other heroes trying to take the role fro. The protagonist. That rarely ever works and it's a huge disservice to the franchise to do so. Plus when seeing all these articles popping up about how marvel can tribute T'Challa they are frankly... All about agendas and nothing about honoring Chad. Latest one was killing T'Challa off in a post credit scene and having the person who does it be the next big bad to "have him die heroically whole also setting up how dangerous the next big villain is and setting their arc in motion" and it just reeks of agenda and using T'Challa as some sort of prop for someone else. So for me? I will keep pushing back and supporting a recast so T'Challa can get his fill story told to completion and he gets the respect he deserves and Chad gets the respect for all his hard work that he deserves as well


Ezyo

Quote
I think so too. Losing Chad was a heart breaker no doubt but I think that they have to carry on with T'Challa as BP and do a recast. It would be alot worse to lose both Chad and T'Challa.

marvell2100

Quote
I think the bottom line is? They're going to have to recast T'Challa...and do it for the next movie. My entire heart has been riven by the loss of T'Chadwick. I can only approach it with a bit of surrealism, like I know it's real...but not really. Same thing when considering someone like JDW to be his replacement as T'Challa. It...doesn't feel real. Even though I am absolutely certain that T'Chadwick would want us to replace him and indeed knew that even if had beaten colon cancer, T'Chadwick could only play T'Challa for a short period of time in his life. And T'Challa would both be played by younger actors and T'Challa the character would outlive us all.

supreme illuminati


PREVENT THE ASSASSINATION OF T'CHALLA THE BLACK PANTHER!

(https://mb.web.sapo.io/fac33d771ea7c075e229b310bb0f3ff116a27c96.jpg)

RESIST THE A.G.E.N.D.A.

Chadwick Boseman's legacy deserves nothing less!
Title: Re: BP OP - What some real fans think about T'Challa the Black Panther's Future
Post by: Marvell2100 on September 27, 2020, 01:28:48 pm
Thanks Ture for this thread and for sharing the views of the Black Panther fans.
Title: Re: BP OP - Sterling K. Brown on Chadwick Boseman and 'Black Panther' Future
Post by: supreme illuminati on September 27, 2020, 10:20:11 pm
What some real fans are saying...

Quote
My Two Cents: Killing off T'Challa is a short-sighted idea and would be a mistake on a number of levels, many of which are represented in MoneySpider's quote above. Absolutely loved Chadwick and am still grieving his loss. However, T'Challa could and should be bigger. He should continue to thrill and inspire our youth while providing a shining example of Black strength and excellence! This is needed and should not be dismissed. There are many more T'Challa stories to tell and more Black artists to convey them, Aldis Hodge and Jonathan Majors come to mind. Not as replacements for Chadwick, but successors. I love Letitia and Shuri and would love to see the character further explored, pursuing her own stories. In over 50 years, I've consumed a ton of stories featuring a plethora of heroes. Precious few have looked like me. Our kids have it better in this regard thanks to T'Challa and Luke Cage and Black Lightning. I had Flash Gordon, Batman and James Bond. Much as we love the players, it's the characters that allow us to imagine and dream. Now of all times is not the time to take T'Challa away. I truly believe Chadwick would agree.

My Two Cents.

Peace,

Mont

Quote
I just feel like cutting T'Challas time short would be a huge mistake all over the guise of being "respectful"  and "no one could replace Chadwick" I mean with Spiderman, Batman, James Bond and superman movies, no one is replacing the actor that played the character before them, but rather they are a successor. And the same should be done for Chad. I mean look at what he has said in interviews, no where does it sound like he wanted the character to live and die with him. He wanted to keep inspiring people as the character on obviously, but he wanted the character to continue to grow. Plus I really just have a hard time not seeing Shuri as a Tony Stark type, quippy and fun, but not serious enough for the role of ruler and BP, and if you have a sudden change in personality it can be weird..

And again I am all for Black girl empowerment, it's a great thing, however, it needs to be demanded and pushed in it's own vein with characters who are their own stand alone heroes and not supporting cast members of other heroes trying to take the role fro. The protagonist. That rarely ever works and it's a huge disservice to the franchise to do so. Plus when seeing all these articles popping up about how marvel can tribute T'Challa they are frankly... All about agendas and nothing about honoring Chad. Latest one was killing T'Challa off in a post credit scene and having the person who does it be the next big bad to "have him die heroically whole also setting up how dangerous the next big villain is and setting their arc in motion" and it just reeks of agenda and using T'Challa as some sort of prop for someone else. So for me? I will keep pushing back and supporting a recast so T'Challa can get his fill story told to completion and he gets the respect he deserves and Chad gets the respect for all his hard work that he deserves as well


Ezyo

Quote
I think so too. Losing Chad was a heart breaker no doubt but I think that they have to carry on with T'Challa as BP and do a recast. It would be alot worse to lose both Chad and T'Challa.

marvell2100

Quote
I think the bottom line is? They're going to have to recast T'Challa...and do it for the next movie. My entire heart has been riven by the loss of T'Chadwick. I can only approach it with a bit of surrealism, like I know it's real...but not really. Same thing when considering someone like JDW to be his replacement as T'Challa. It...doesn't feel real. Even though I am absolutely certain that T'Chadwick would want us to replace him and indeed knew that even if had beaten colon cancer, T'Chadwick could only play T'Challa for a short period of time in his life. And T'Challa would both be played by younger actors and T'Challa the character would outlive us all.

supreme illuminati


PREVENT THE ASSASSINATION OF T'CHALLA THE BLACK PANTHER!

(https://mb.web.sapo.io/fac33d771ea7c075e229b310bb0f3ff116a27c96.jpg)

RESIST THE A.G.E.N.D.A.

Chadwick Boseman's legacy deserves nothing less!



 Brother Ture? I can't thank you enough for your tireless, peerless excellence.
Title: Re: BP OP - What some real fans think about T'Challa the Black Panther's Future
Post by: Marvell2100 on September 28, 2020, 05:35:37 am
Another voice:

Quote
Quote from: Chesterfield;5164172
Then actors need to Man the hell up! It's a job, a job that comes with a huge responsibility which is why it's important to cast the right actor for the role BUT not to kill the character off or replace him! This is an opportunity to contribute to something meaningful. What does it say about black men too afraid to be asked questions and compared to Boseman's portrayal? Cowardice, that's what it says. If that's the case and mind set then we don't deserve another Black Panther movie period. Let black actors stick to their stereotypical comic relief, gangbanger, slave needing a white saviour roles. How many white actors and even black actors have expressed they would love to portray a character like James Bond and this is in the wake of Daniel Craig who has made the role his own despite the initial backlash to his casting? Sorry but yes, it's sad hat Boseman has passed away, he was a great T'Challa but like Shuri herself said, "...it doesn't mean it can't be improved". A potential new actor for T'Challa could explore characteristics that build upon what Boseman started. Taking on the role is a huge undertaking and responsibility and should be approached with such a purpose and not to shy away from it.[/size]
Title: Re: BP OP - What some real fans think about T'Challa the Black Panther's Future
Post by: supreme illuminati on September 28, 2020, 08:24:03 am




Another voice:

Quote
Quote from: Chesterfield;5164172
Then actors need to Man the hell up! It's a job, a job that comes with a huge responsibility which is why it's important to cast the right actor for the role BUT not to kill the character off or replace him! This is an opportunity to contribute to something meaningful. What does it say about black men too afraid to be asked questions and compared to Boseman's portrayal? Cowardice, that's what it says. If that's the case and mind set then we don't deserve another Black Panther movie period. Let black actors stick to their stereotypical comic relief, gangbanger, slave needing a white saviour roles. How many white actors and even black actors have expressed they would love to portray a character like James Bond and this is in the wake of Daniel Craig who has made the role his own despite the initial backlash to his casting? Sorry but yes, it's sad hat Boseman has passed away, he was a great T'Challa but like Shuri herself said, "...it doesn't mean it can't be improved". A potential new actor for T'Challa could explore characteristics that build upon what Boseman started. Taking on the role is a huge undertaking and responsibility and should be approached with such a purpose and not to shy away from it.[/size]




NGENDUMISO [ "WITH PRAISE/BRAVO/PRAISE HIM/CHEER FOR HIM" ], CHESTERFIELD!! He needs to come to HEF, forthwith!
Title: Re: BP OP - What some real fans think about T'Challa the Black Panther's Future
Post by: Ture on September 30, 2020, 11:32:46 am
Thanks Ture for this thread and for sharing the views of the Black Panther fans.

You are more than welcome Marvell2100. Brothers and sisters like you make it all worthwhile.
Title: Re: BP OP - Sterling K. Brown on Chadwick Boseman and 'Black Panther' Future
Post by: Ture on September 30, 2020, 11:36:09 am
What some real fans are saying...

Quote
My Two Cents: Killing off T'Challa is a short-sighted idea and would be a mistake on a number of levels, many of which are represented in MoneySpider's quote above. Absolutely loved Chadwick and am still grieving his loss. However, T'Challa could and should be bigger. He should continue to thrill and inspire our youth while providing a shining example of Black strength and excellence! This is needed and should not be dismissed. There are many more T'Challa stories to tell and more Black artists to convey them, Aldis Hodge and Jonathan Majors come to mind. Not as replacements for Chadwick, but successors. I love Letitia and Shuri and would love to see the character further explored, pursuing her own stories. In over 50 years, I've consumed a ton of stories featuring a plethora of heroes. Precious few have looked like me. Our kids have it better in this regard thanks to T'Challa and Luke Cage and Black Lightning. I had Flash Gordon, Batman and James Bond. Much as we love the players, it's the characters that allow us to imagine and dream. Now of all times is not the time to take T'Challa away. I truly believe Chadwick would agree.

My Two Cents.

Peace,

Mont

Quote
I just feel like cutting T'Challas time short would be a huge mistake all over the guise of being "respectful"  and "no one could replace Chadwick" I mean with Spiderman, Batman, James Bond and superman movies, no one is replacing the actor that played the character before them, but rather they are a successor. And the same should be done for Chad. I mean look at what he has said in interviews, no where does it sound like he wanted the character to live and die with him. He wanted to keep inspiring people as the character on obviously, but he wanted the character to continue to grow. Plus I really just have a hard time not seeing Shuri as a Tony Stark type, quippy and fun, but not serious enough for the role of ruler and BP, and if you have a sudden change in personality it can be weird..

And again I am all for Black girl empowerment, it's a great thing, however, it needs to be demanded and pushed in it's own vein with characters who are their own stand alone heroes and not supporting cast members of other heroes trying to take the role fro. The protagonist. That rarely ever works and it's a huge disservice to the franchise to do so. Plus when seeing all these articles popping up about how marvel can tribute T'Challa they are frankly... All about agendas and nothing about honoring Chad. Latest one was killing T'Challa off in a post credit scene and having the person who does it be the next big bad to "have him die heroically whole also setting up how dangerous the next big villain is and setting their arc in motion" and it just reeks of agenda and using T'Challa as some sort of prop for someone else. So for me? I will keep pushing back and supporting a recast so T'Challa can get his fill story told to completion and he gets the respect he deserves and Chad gets the respect for all his hard work that he deserves as well


Ezyo

Quote
I think so too. Losing Chad was a heart breaker no doubt but I think that they have to carry on with T'Challa as BP and do a recast. It would be alot worse to lose both Chad and T'Challa.

marvell2100

Quote
I think the bottom line is? They're going to have to recast T'Challa...and do it for the next movie. My entire heart has been riven by the loss of T'Chadwick. I can only approach it with a bit of surrealism, like I know it's real...but not really. Same thing when considering someone like JDW to be his replacement as T'Challa. It...doesn't feel real. Even though I am absolutely certain that T'Chadwick would want us to replace him and indeed knew that even if had beaten colon cancer, T'Chadwick could only play T'Challa for a short period of time in his life. And T'Challa would both be played by younger actors and T'Challa the character would outlive us all.

supreme illuminati


PREVENT THE ASSASSINATION OF T'CHALLA THE BLACK PANTHER!

(https://mb.web.sapo.io/fac33d771ea7c075e229b310bb0f3ff116a27c96.jpg)

RESIST THE A.G.E.N.D.A.

Chadwick Boseman's legacy deserves nothing less!



 Brother Ture? I can't thank you enough for your tireless, peerless excellence.

My humble appreciation for your kind words Brother Supreme Illuminati. Fans and enthusiasts like yourself are the reasons why I do what I do.
Title: Re: BP OP - What some real fans think about T'Challa the Black Panther's Future
Post by: Ture on September 30, 2020, 11:39:24 am
Quote
Then what's the point of a Black Panther movie? T'Challa IS the story. I dont care how many people want to go on about Shuri this or M'Baku that; they're not it T'challa is. If people want to see Wakanda without T'Challa then they can go and petition for a D+ show or whatever.

I can't take Thor seriously. He's become somewhat of a joke since EG. Sure, he had his comedic moments from the start but that whole hippy fat thing...nah. They can do whatever they like with Thor, he's become somewhat inconsequential to me BUT T'Challa is a very different case. I do care and the character and his world need to be given the appropriate respect, care and treatment and that means ensuring T'Challa is at the forefront. But like you said, Marvel will tell whatever story they want and if there's no T'Challa; I'm 100% out.

CBR's Chesterfield

We hear you loud and clear.
Title: Re: BP OP - After backlash Minneapolis police cancel 'Black Panther' movie night
Post by: Ture on October 10, 2020, 05:33:32 pm
After online backlash, Minneapolis police cancel 'Black Panther' movie night
The screening was to be held at Chicago Ave and Lake St.
BY DECLAN DESMOND

An attempt at community outreach seems to have backfired for Minneapolis police, at least in the unforgiving comments sections of social media.

The Minneapolis Police Department (MPD) has announced that a free public showing of Marvel Studios' "Black Panther," which was scheduled for 7:00 p.m. Friday, is postponed "until further notice."


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ej1gYbKWsAIiZks?format=jpg&name=900x900)

The tentative cancellation came a day after the event was announced. MPD's social media accounts did not offer a reason for the decision, but it was clear from hundreds of comments on both Twitter and Facebook that the movie night was not well received.

Some comments called the screening "tone deaf," while others criticized the choice of venue as well as the decision to show Black Panther. A number of users also questioned the safety of holding such an event in the middle of a pandemic.

Others thought the timing of the move was poor, as it came the same week Derek Chauvin — the former officer who killed George Floyd in May — was released from jail on bond, a decision that led to a protest at the intersection where Floyd died.

There was some support for the screening, however, with some commenters praising the police department for the gesture.

BringMeTheNews has reached out to MPD for comment on the cancellation.


https://bringmethenews.com/minnesota-news/after-online-backlash-mpls-police-cancel-black-panther-movie-night
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Ture on October 15, 2020, 08:02:20 am
Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Marvel Comics is subtly rewriting the history of the Black Panther, revealing a line of Panther Kings stretching to 1,000,000 years ago.
BY THOMAS BACON

(https://static3.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Black-Panther-Thor-Thunder.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=960&h=500)

Marvel Comics is rewriting the history of Black Panther. In 2018, Black Panther took the world by storm. The film starred the late, great Chadwick Boseman, and it proved a cultural event, grossing a phenomenal $1.3 billion worldwide. Unsurprisingly, Marvel Comics recognized the character's newfound celebrity, and Black Panther has grown ever more prominent in the comic book universe as well. He's currently leader of the Avengers, operating an intelligence service that crosses the globe and has helped repel numerous cosmic invaders.

After the release of the film, everybody thinks they know the origin story of Wakanda's king. According to legend, Black Panther is the champion of the Panther God Bast, granted superhuman strength, speed and agility in order to defend the nation. The first Black Panther was the man who unified the tribes of Wakanda, and who first discovered the potential of vibranium, the alien metal that crashed to Earth millennia ago in an asteroid impact. King T'Challa is just the latest Black Panther, albeit the first to act on a global stage.

And yet, in an interesting recent development, Marvel Comics is systematically rewriting Black Panther's origin story. So many of the things fans thought they knew are turning out to be assumptions, and whole new elements are being written into the history of Wakanda - both in the pages of the Avengers and the X-Men comics.

The First Black Panther Served Alongside The First Avengers.


(https://static3.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2017/07/Marvel-Legacy-1000000-BC-issue-1-full-lineup.jpg)

The rewrites began in 2018, with the release of the Marvel Legacy one-shot. This introduced the Avengers of 100,000 BC, a powerful alliance whose very existence had been lost in the mists of time. These were dark days, with Mephisto ruling the world and the nascent human race struggling to survive. But the humans soon found themselves defended by champions; gods and mystics, cosmic avatars and even a Black Panther. "The Panther was the first to discover some manner of vibrating rock or such," Odin recollected in Jason Aaron's Avengers #4, "And the first to begin to unlock its many secrets. Never have I been more impressed by a mortal." Aaron's Avengers run has been skipping through the timeline with joyous abandon, and he's been offering the origin stories of many of these first Avengers. He's yet to do so, however, for this first Black Panther.

Regardless of the details, though, there have been certain clues. The Black Panther mantle strongly suggests this man is not only the first to discover vibranium, but he is also blessed by the Panther God, Bast. What's more, he has the kind of confidence and bearing you would expect from a king, suggesting he is already ruler of a tribe residing in Africa. But an important distinction is that he is no isolationist, but rather stands in defense of the entire planet, daring to wage war against cosmic entities like the Celestials and standing alongside the first Sorcerer Supreme and the first Ghost Rider.

The First Black Panther Wielded Mjolnir.


(https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/Black-Panther-Worthy.jpg)

Even more staggering, Avengers #36 revealed this first Black Panther wielded Mjolnir. Jason Aaron's seminal Mighty Thor run rewrote the history of Mjolnir as well, revealing that eons ago Odin found himself locked in combat with a cosmic force known as the God Tempest. This God Tempest was imprisoned within the legendary hammer, and Odin himself wielded it for a time, although the God Tempest resented his attempts to use his power. Evidently it had no problem with the first Black Panther, who it deemed worthy of its majesty, and according to T'Challa, this first Panther King used Mjolnir against Mephisto himself. Ever since, anyone who Bast deemed fit to become Black Panther has apparently also been worthy of Mjolnir.

The X-Men Just Introduced Skybreaker.


(https://static2.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Marvel-Comics-Skybreaker-Wakanda.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=740&h=370)

The latest development has been introduced in the X-Men's "X of Swords" event. Ten X-Men have been chosen to wield ten legendary blades in defense of the entire planet, and Storm is one of them. In Marauders #13, she revealed her assigned weapon is an ancient Wakandan sword called Skybreaker. According to Storm, Skybreaker dates back to the day a vibranium meteorite crashed into a sacred mountain, and one local tribal leader led his people to the site. "The ancestors of those that would become Wakandan forged a weapon to speak with the boom of thunder," Storm observed. Skybreaker serves as a conduit, amplifying and channeling energy into a devastating weapon, and it was used in Wakanda's defense.

The creator of Skybreaker is remembered only in Wakandan legends, which called him "Olumo" or "Knower." Apparently he realized no normal fire could tame the metal, and built a special forge near the lip of a volcano. There, he labored for many days with his oldest daughter and his oldest son, using the heat of the volcano to soften and temper the vibranium. Given Odin's comment that the Panther he served alongside was the first human to learn the secrets of vibranium, it's reasonable to assume they are one and the same person. But it is unlikely he ever used Skybreaker in Odin's presence, because it appears to have been devoted to the protection of Wakanda, thus it was presumably kept by his representative. Still, it is no wonder he was capable of mastering Mjolnir; the first Black Panther was no stranger to cosmic power.


(https://static2.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/Black-Panther-and-Storm-with-Skybreaker.jpg?q=50&fit=crop&w=740&h=370)

According to Marauders #13, Skybreaker is the key to Wakanda's technological development. The Wakandans studied Skybreaker, attempting to understand its powers, and in doing so, they gradually unlocked the secrets of vibranium. "The conduit helped them unlock a deeper understanding of the world," Storm revealed, "and develop technology at a blistering pace. It helped catapult Wakanda into the future." Thus Skybreaker exists, to this day, as a symbol of Wakanda's spirit.

Marvel Comics writers have clearly decided it is time to explore the ancient history of Black Panther, to reveal the true history of the very first ancestor to bow the knee to Bast and receive the blessing of the Panther God. But in exploring all this, they're also rewriting the rich lore surrounding T'Challa, adding whole new elements into it. It will be fascinating to see how it all comes together, and how all these revisions ultimately affect Black Panther's standing in the Marvel Universe.


https://screenrant.com/black-panther-origin-story-rewritten/
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Battle on October 15, 2020, 08:17:08 am
re: Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story




This is a spectacular proposal!  :D

Especially for readers who may have a new found interest in world history and how it relates to the Black Panther mythos.  Bellissimo!  :)
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: CvilleWakandan on October 15, 2020, 08:34:22 am
I don't like if they're not going to lock things in. Too much ambiguity. There are like three new origins in the past two years.
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Ezyo on October 15, 2020, 12:02:59 pm
The problem with this thst it's not being devetin the BP Solo, by a writer whos sole purpose for exploring this is to expand T'Challas world and enrich and elevate HIM. These other book's aren't doing this to enrich T'Challa bit to tell their own stories and push plot, continuity be damned, especially mauraders, so no, explore it on the BP solo, not avenger's or ESPECIALLY, an x book
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Booshman on October 16, 2020, 11:22:17 pm
The problem with this thst it's not being devetin the BP Solo, by a writer whos sole purpose for exploring this is to expand T'Challas world and enrich and elevate HIM. These other book's aren't doing this to enrich T'Challa bit to tell their own stories and push plot, continuity be damned, especially mauraders, so no, explore it on the BP solo, not avenger's or ESPECIALLY, an x book

Well, he's a black dude, so no worry about him getting any major/lasting shine in an X-Book.
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Emperorjones on October 17, 2020, 06:23:53 am
Ture,

Looking over the thread, and I saw you define real fans as those who back recasting T'Challa. Though I do not have the depth of knowledge that you, Supreme, and many others here do when it comes to Black Panther, I also don't think people who have differing views, about whether to recast or promote Shuri or another character as the next BP are necessarily not real fans of BP or are pushing an anti-black male agenda either. Some of them I think are, but I wouldn't just assume that of everyone, myself included here.
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Ezyo on October 17, 2020, 01:05:15 pm
Maybe it's bott the greatest to say there bot real fans, but at the very least it calls into question the intention for replacing and killing T'Challa on screen when HE is still alive and his story is far from over. I'm sure some people are genuinely thinking that it's the best thing to Honor T'Chadwick, but based on what he has said in interviews, I don't think he wants the character to retire or die with him, quite the opposite, he has been seen in interviews fighting for more Black folks to exist in one space and wanted the character to outlive us all
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: supreme illuminati on October 17, 2020, 02:10:51 pm
The problem with this thst it's not being devetin the BP Solo, by a writer whos sole purpose for exploring this is to expand T'Challas world and enrich and elevate HIM. These other book's aren't doing this to enrich T'Challa bit to tell their own stories and push plot, continuity be damned, especially mauraders, so no, explore it on the BP solo, not avenger's or ESPECIALLY, an x book

Well, he's a black dude, so no worry about him getting any major/lasting shine in an X-Book.

QFT!!!
Title: Re: BP OP - Marvel Is Rewriting Black Panther's Origin Story
Post by: Ture on October 18, 2020, 10:49:07 am
Ture,

Looking over the thread, and I saw you define real fans as those who back recasting T'Challa. Though I do not have the depth of knowledge that you, Supreme, and many others here do when it comes to Black Panther, I also don't think people who have differing views, about whether to recast or promote Shuri or another character as the next BP are necessarily not real fans of BP or are pushing an anti-black male agenda either. Some of them I think are, but I wouldn't just assume that of everyone, myself included here.

I didn't define real fans as much as I quoted them and I count you among their numbers Emperorjones.
I posted What some real fans are saying...as a response to the plethora of articles stating fans did not want a recast because such was simply not the case. Such articles came off to me as chumming the MCU BP landscape for the attempted assassination of T'Challa the Black Panther.

Different, disparate or divergent viewpoints on recasting the Black Panther doesn't operationally define fandom as it merely displays the diversity of opinions on the subject. Like you I would not assume anything but I do choose to discuss or even debate what is written for the world to see when it concerns Black Panther.

The A.G.E.N.D.A. I speak of is not rooted in contemporary politics as they are just new branches on an old tree. It dates back to soon after Lee and Kirby introduced the Black Panther and has been a constant detriment to the character and his world ever since.