Hudlin Entertainment Forum

Comics => Black Panther => Topic started by: Jakuta on August 10, 2006, 07:27:45 pm

Title: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Jakuta on August 10, 2006, 07:27:45 pm
After seeing the Ultimate Avengers 2, I like many of you was upset at how the Panther was played. Come on now Wakandans were chucking spears and shooting arrows and an Alien horde. They had computers and a munitions depot but, they couldn't have any technically advance weaponry? I guess they are not the most advanced Nation on the earth after all.
I think we need to voice our opinion. I went to the Ultimate Avenger website clicked on the Forum and there were no entries for the Panther.
We need to over load that forum with how we feel about the way the Panther was played.
The reason I shouted "Small World" is because I think we should rush that forum like Be-Be’s Kids.
Don’t get me wrong this is our Forum this is where we get our chat on but, I think we need to nipe this B.S. in the bud on the way the Panther is being played.
We need to let them know or this is what we can expect for the Panther Movie if there ever is one.

http://forums.lgf.com/forumdisplay.php?s=9b359bd4d6903ad977ea00ef9fed6346&f=140

This the Marvel Studios address:
The Executive Producers are Avi Arad, Craig Kyle, and Eric S.Rollman
Marvel Studios
9242 Beverly Boulevard
Suite 350
Beverly Hills, CA 90210

Let's show we care.
SMALL WORLD!!! >:(
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on August 11, 2006, 04:18:29 am
Jakuta  :)

Don't stress yourself over this. I recognize that I could always be mistaken, but in the case of how Wakanda and her warriors were presented in Ultimate Avengers II, I don't believe there was any insult intended or unintentionally inflicted upon African-American viewers of the program. I humbly suggest that those of us who are African-American who might feel a measure of embarrassment or anger over the way the Wakandan warriors were portrayed in the movie may have internalized the hateful and dehumanizing attitudes of our ignorant white countrymen. Those European-Americans who got their guffaws on while watching the so-called "primitive",  spear-bearing Wakandan warriors being seemingly routed by the Wasp are probably among those of our ignorant countrymen who harbor and spew those hateful and dehumanizing attitudes at African-Americans.

Years ago, Marvel Comics produced and sold video cartoons based upon their comic books. The animation wasn't very good at all because the process used for creating these cartoons involved taking actual panels from pre-existing comic books and animating one or more portions of that individual's body to give the appearance of movement  :D  One of the videos produced was of Captain America. It featured the early stories of his and Bucky Barnes' fight against the Red Skull and the nazis during WWII. The lyrics to the theme song for those adventures are as follows:

"When Captain America throws his mighty shield,

All those who chose oppose his shield must yield.

If he's lead to a fight and a duel is due,

Then the red and white and the blue'll come through.

When Captain America throws his mighty shield."

So you see, it's all well and good when Captain America throws his mighty shield. But when Wakandan warriors throw their mighty spears, then we've got a problem with that  :)  We can believe Captain America's shield can penetrate metals and bisect humanoids - alien or otherwise - because we have been conditioned to believe that it's possible. When Hawkeye is able to take out all manner of super-powered miscreants with specially-designed arrows, we accept that he must be able to do that because he is Hawkeye. It doesn't matter that he isn't looking at the specific arrow he needs for any particular situation. When Hawkeye says, "I need a stun-arrow to deal with this bozo!", reaches into his quiver without looking, selects the very arrow he needs apparently by feel alone and after firing that arrow, achieves his desired objective, then we're fine with that. He's Hawkeye afterall, not some "spear-chucking" Wakandan warrior  ;)

Getting back to the world we live in Jakuta...presently, there is concern among this nation's leaders and thinkers that we could soon be overtaken by China as this world's superpower nation. The Chinese have recently enjoyed successes in their space program, their military dwarfs our own and is just as technologically advanced, if not more so, and their slave-labor economy is busting our chops. And in many of China's most "modern" hotels - at least the last time I'd heard or read anything about it - they are lacking modern plumbing and toilet facilities. Once, during a visit by President Bush to their country, they had to specially equip a bathroom complete with American-style toilet facilities, in his suite   :)

I don't want to ramble on and on Jakuta, but I hope you at least are beginning to see the point I have attempted to make here. 

Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on August 11, 2006, 05:21:10 am
Are you serious?


I see where you are trying to come from but come on,thats part of Cap's Myth or whatever. His shield is his main selling point.


But Wakanda's is their Advanced Technology.

Come on,don't you think it's a bit ridiculous for the most Advanced Nation in the world to be throwing SPEARS at ALIEN SPACE SHIPS???


They could have written in something better then that,and really showed off how Special Wakanda really is.   
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on August 11, 2006, 05:46:06 am
Are you serious?


I see where you are trying to come from but come on,thats part of Cap's Myth or whatever. His shield is his main selling point.


But Wakanda's is their Advanced Technology.

Come on,don't you think it's a bit ridiculous for the most Advanced Nation in the world to be throwing SPEARS at ALIEN SPACE SHIPS???


They could have written in something better then that,and really showed off how Special Wakanda really is.   

 :D Friends!! Friends!!!!

What is it about the Wakandan warriors using spears - beside the fact that they are supposedly the most advanced nation in Marvel Comics continuity - that bothers us?

Captain America's shield is his primary weapon. Thor's hammer (battleaxe in the Ultimate Universe), is his primary weapon. Hawkeye utilizes a bow and arrow. The Swordsman used a specially-equipped sword. The Mockingbird used a quarterstaff. The Black Knight dressed up like one of King Arthur's knights of the round table and used the Ebony Blade as his primary weapon. We don't seem to have a problem with any of that  :D  Why?

Wakanda is special. Wakanda is advanced technologically. Remember though, before Mr. Hudlin's "re-boot" of the Panther story, how were those warriors who confronted Klaw's mercenaries depicted? There was even one scene that I remember that showed T'Chaka prepared to lead his warriors against Klaw armed with a shield and a spear.

I know many of you would have preferred to have seen Wakanda unleash the "flying wheel" warships and walking, laser-firing, Panther land-conveyances we saw in Christopher Priest's version of the Black Panther. In my view, that would have been predictable and kind of boring.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: blkyoda on August 11, 2006, 06:48:42 am
Are you serious?


I see where you are trying to come from but come on,thats part of Cap's Myth or whatever. His shield is his main selling point.


But Wakanda's is their Advanced Technology.

Come on,don't you think it's a bit ridiculous for the most Advanced Nation in the world to be throwing SPEARS at ALIEN SPACE SHIPS???


They could have written in something better then that,and really showed off how Special Wakanda really is.   

 :D Friends!! Friends!!!!

What is it about the Wakandan warriors using spears - beside the fact that they are supposedly the most advanced nation in Marvel Comics continuity - that bothers us?

Captain America's shield is his primary weapon. Thor's hammer (battleaxe in the Ultimate Universe), is his primary weapon. Hawkeye utilizes a bow and arrow. The Swordsman used a specially-equipped sword. The Mockingbird used a quarterstaff. The Black Knight dressed up like one of King Arthur's knights of the round table and used the Ebony Blade as his primary weapon. We don't seem to have a problem with any of that  :D  Why?

Wakanda is special. Wakanda is advanced technologically. Remember though, before Mr. Hudlin's "re-boot" of the Panther story, how were those warriors who confronted Klaw's mercenaries depicted? There was even one scene that I remember that showed T'Chaka prepared to lead his warriors against Klaw armed with a shield and a spear.

I know many of you would have preferred to have seen Wakanda unleash the "flying wheel" warships and walking, laser-firing, Panther land-conveyances we saw in Christopher Priest's version of the Black Panther. In my view, that would have been predictable and kind of boring.


I can't speak for anyone else. I have no particular shame with 'spears' as opposed to other weapons. But each of the examples that you use (Thor, Cap etc.) are examples of ancient anachronistic weapons that have magical or extra-special abilities. From what I and many other people who are reading this have heard, they weren't throwing 'magical' or 'grenade tipped' spears they were throwing regular spears. Which is exactly the kind of primative, non-advanced image of Africa that Whites have perpetuated for years. What makes it even more degrading and annoying is that Black Panther is ruler of a very advanced nation and such a very advanced nation would USE advanced weapons. That's not using the 'white man' as a standard that's just advances in military technology. Shaka Zulu was famous for NOT using long spears in his arsenal. He broke his spear off - so that was only about a quarter of the length of the average long spear and changed military tactics in the southern part of Africa forever. (He named his particular weapon 'Assagai' - for those who have never heard of this he claimed his short spear was enchanted and it was revered by friends and enemies alike as a kind of 'Excalibur' for it's power on the battlefield.) The point is military advances are military advances and the failure of this movie to demonstrate that this 'African' nation did not advance militarily like the rest of the planet is insulting at the bare miminum and a perpetuation of a long standing racist stereotype at the maximum. The French were famous for using foils and fencing, does the modern day french army use 'rocket propelled' foils to battle their enemies? North African Nations all the way down to the Sudan often armed their warriors with Cymitars (sp?) in ancient times when they battled. Do you see modern armies in the Sudan, Mali or Egypt running around with 'modern day' Cymitars? No, I know what you're getting at Sin, that this is all about black folks being afraid or ashamed of our culture or past cuz of the white man etc. etc. but I must respectfully disagree with you on this one. 'Spear chuckin' is just wack and racist no matter how you spin it.
Lastly, and I don't wanna get into a 'priest' debate, but he made a point on his website once about technology and BP. That it made NO sense that this guy, who supposedly designed the Quinjet and outsmarted REED RICHARDS and the Fantastic Four would live in a country of people who still hung out in straw huts. They would advance just like everyone else. That's not a white/black or European issue. Hell, a black American Man invented mobile refrigeration, you don't think the brothers in Wakanda would bust out with some air-conditioning as soon as possible? That was always one of the lame contradictions about panther that this guy with all of this power and tech at his disposal still ran around in a black jumpsuit instead of using all of the resources at his disposal. Plus as far as 'Priest's' reboot - this is how his version of events differed from that of the current writer. In the priest run, Wakanda was a hidden African Nation that nobody had ever heard of, except Cap whom they took out. When Klaw attacked they had been so isolated that their spears and skin shields were no match for the military tech that most of the world was using. Then again, since nobody had really bothered them at all they hadn't seen any need to get much more advanced. It was KLAW'S invasion, and the shock of seeing T'Chaka killed that led to Wakanda going crazy on the technology tip. In a span of 20 or so years they went from an anachronistic society to being the most advanced on the planet. The current writers version is that Wakanda was ALWAYS more advanced than anyone else (even though the coolest thing they could come up with to defeat five mercenaries was a skycycle :D

I don't one version is any better than the other but I think you mischaracterized priest's run.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on August 11, 2006, 07:33:22 am
Well yoda, I'm not certain of this, but I believe the spears used by the Wakandan warriors were tipped with Vibranium.

As you've said my friend, I suppose this is just another one of those times we will have to agree to respectfully disagree. You say that 'spear chuckin' (you've really got to lose that bit of terminology yodicus  :), is "wack" and "racist". Until I am able to discern something in the movie that I haven't seen as of yet, I'm not convinced that there was racist or intended insult or even ignorance - benign or otherwise - present.


As always, the rest of your post had within it information that was enlightening and things that just made me shake my head and chuckle. I don't fully understand nor can I agree with the negativity and upset attached to the Wakandan warriors using spears in battle, but I can appreciate that it apparently, most of you are of a different opinion.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on August 11, 2006, 07:56:38 am
Haven't picked up the movie yet(today, hopefully), but I read on another board that the spears were supposed to be vibranium tipped.  Also, this is the Ultimate Universe's Wakanda, not 616, so I don't think we should judge it using Mcgregor/Priest/Hudlin standards.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: bluezulu on August 11, 2006, 08:11:31 am
i am one ususally ready for an e protest or uprising but on this issue you are contextually wrong if not artisticly correct. if you watch the dvd extras as well as read the write up of the dvd movie premise you will see that the use of spears and dress are of a symbolic nature. the wakandans embrace their past and utilize the future technology to enhance their knowledge. one of the reasons the white man has been able to be so dominant in "conquring" other nations of the world. militiristicly (sp) the rifle and later the pistol is a superior weapn to any other hand held weapon. the chinese invented and sucussfuly used "gun powder" for years but because of their culture stuck with their traditional weapons untill with constant trade with other contries started to use the rifle more and more.

the wakandans have been isolated. so much so that with their brilliance they used the crashed hull of the ship to enhance the weapons they already had. the movie had tchalla sending his son off to school and this was supposed to be the first time something like this happend. they would not know what a plasma cannon or a traditional rifle would be.

i for one loved the indestructable tribal shileds. they were deflecting the munitions of the alieans as well as iron mans fire power. the spears penetrated iron man's armor and force filed. iron man armor is supposedly the most advance tech in the world and he could not stand up to the wakandas.

the zulu spear and shiled are known throughout the world to be magnificing in design and use. those weapons and shaka zulu's superior tactics is what had him almost conqure all of africa and held his own against invading forces using their cannons and rifles and muskets. so yes the most intelligent and sophisticated country in the world was using spears. how i see it they would deflect the hollow points from my glock using their shield and then impale me with their vibranium spears. west is not always the best. just my two cents. :'(
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Gooch on August 11, 2006, 12:29:52 pm
I am guilty for stating this , spear chucking thing,   but one thing i must point out,  this is how a white man thinks an afircan nation would be.   Hence the fact he said hew anted to go with traditionl gar, and traditional weapons.   

I can see where you cats ase coming from when it comes with how great the spear is in our culture.  Lord knows i have trained with both boe sitcks, short spear, long spears, swords and sheilds.   

I did say the spears were vibranium tipped and what not.   
   

But the explanation and the writing was kind of poor.

  they said the Wakandns shot down the sh*tari ship, but you cannot tell me that they used a spear or catapult to knock it out the air from 10,000 feet away.


What the sh*t reminded me of was, and probaly inspired by the ewoks destroying the empire in return of the jedi 

It would have been more believable for everybody to have panter tipped darts firing out of thier hands like the panther.   Maybe them deploying advanced automotons that just disables
 thier oppenents
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: bluezulu on August 11, 2006, 02:04:52 pm
bro  i understand where you are coming from and in a scenario that you describe i could hear the critics call it unrealistic. i remember when the movie boomerang first came out white critics called it a black fantasy world and how unrealistic it was imagine successful black people. i think the answer is somewhere in the middle because you have to remember we have been programed to feel that african culture is somehow beneath european and even eastern culture. i find it kind of god like the image of the nubian warrior standing among the african plains with zulu spear and shield in hand. 8)
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: zeraze on August 12, 2006, 07:16:23 pm
  they said the Wakandns shot down the sh*tari ship, but you cannot tell me that they used a spear or catapult to knock it out the air from 10,000 feet away.

The Wakandans likely used cannons loaded with vibranium shells just as they did to repel the latest Chitauri invasion.

Quote
What the sh*t reminded me of was, and probaly inspired by the ewoks destroying the empire in return of the jedi 

That's a fair comparison.

Quote
It would have been more believable for everybody to have panter tipped darts firing out of thier hands like the panther.   Maybe them deploying advanced automotons that just disables
 thier oppenents

That would have better underscored why the Wakandans did not believe they needed outside aid.  Sure, the Chitauri's sheer numbers would have forced even Wakanda to ally with the Avengers, but I think Black Panther's country would have still come out looking better.

zeraze
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: True Father 7 on August 12, 2006, 09:17:52 pm
After seeing the Ultimate Avengers 2, I like many of you was upset at how the Panther was played. Come on now Wakandans were chucking spears and shooting arrows and an Alien horde. They had computers and a munitions depot but, they couldn't have any technically advance weaponry? I guess they are not the most advanced Nation on the earth after all.
I think we need to voice our opinion. I went to the Ultimate Avenger website clicked on the Forum and there were no entries for the Panther.
We need to over load that forum with how we feel about the way the Panther was played.
The reason I shouted "Small World" is because I think we should rush that forum like Be-Be’s Kids.
Don’t get me wrong this is our Forum this is where we get our chat on but, I think we need to nipe this B.S. in the bud on the way the Panther is being played.
We need to let them know or this is what we can expect for the Panther Movie if there ever is one.

[url]http://forums.lgf.com/forumdisplay.php?s=9b359bd4d6903ad977ea00ef9fed6346&f=140[/url]

This the Marvel Studios address:
The Executive Producers are Avi Arad, Craig Kyle, and Eric S.Rollman
Marvel Studios
9242 Beverly Boulevard
Suite 350
Beverly Hills, CA 90210

Let's show we care.
SMALL WORLD!!! >:(


it's not that serious.  I loved seeing my favorite character in a movie.  The fact that he makes an appearance in the Ultimate Universe in a movie before the comics says something already.  Maybe in an animated feature film called Black Panther you'll get more of what you want, but this was an Avengers movie.  Other then that, if it's that serious, write ya own story to submit to Marvel instead of expecting white cats to do Panther the way you want, PEACE
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: True Father 7 on August 12, 2006, 09:21:41 pm
Are you serious?


I see where you are trying to come from but come on,thats part of Cap's Myth or whatever. His shield is his main selling point.


But Wakanda's is their Advanced Technology.

Come on,don't you think it's a bit ridiculous for the most Advanced Nation in the world to be throwing SPEARS at ALIEN SPACE SHIPS???


They could have written in something better then that,and really showed off how Special Wakanda really is.   

like what?  What should they have been using?  Give some ideas
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: True Father 7 on August 12, 2006, 09:27:50 pm
Well yoda, I'm not certain of this, but I believe the spears used by the Wakandan warriors were tipped with Vibranium.

As you've said my friend, I suppose this is just another one of those times we will have to agree to respectfully disagree. You say that 'spear chuckin' (you've really got to lose that bit of terminology yodicus  :), is "wack" and "racist". Until I am able to discern something in the movie that I haven't seen as of yet, I'm not convinced that there was racist or intended insult or even ignorance - benign or otherwise - present.


As always, the rest of your post had within it information that was enlightening and things that just made me shake my head and chuckle. I don't fully understand nor can I agree with the negativity and upset attached to the Wakandan warriors using spears in battle, but I can appreciate that it apparently, most of you are of a different opinion.

I want to get me an african spear and put on display in my house.  Take one of those over them clumsy guns kids accidentally kill themselves with every day
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on August 12, 2006, 10:27:12 pm


I want to get me an african spear and put on display in my house.  Take one of those over them clumsy guns kids accidentally kill themselves with every day

 :D  True. The average American child would be most likely to kill themselves with a gun than with a spear.

In an earlier post, I included a link attached to an image of Kenya's national flag to demonstrate to our friends posting to this topic, that Africans have a sense of pride in those traditional weapons with which they fought for their freedom and their lives. I'm not sure that relating the following tidbit of information will help or hinder matters, but there is a famous picture of the founder of the Black Panther Party, Huey Newton, wearing the signature Panther black beret, seated in a large chai, holding a rifle in one hand and a spear in the other.

A black warrior - no matter his national origin - recognizes the noble significance of the spear.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: True Father 7 on August 13, 2006, 01:36:57 am


I want to get me an african spear and put on display in my house.  Take one of those over them clumsy guns kids accidentally kill themselves with every day

 :D  True. The average American child would be most likely to kill themselves with a gun than with a spear.

In an earlier post, I included a link attached to an image of Kenya's national flag to demonstrate to our friends posting to this topic, that Africans have a sense of pride in those traditional weapons with which they fought for their freedom and their lives. I'm not sure that relating the following tidbit of information will help or hinder matters, but there is a famous picture of the founder of the Black Panther Party, Huey Newton, wearing the signature Panther black beret, seated in a large chai, holding a rifle in one hand and a spear in the other.

A black warrior - no matter his national origin - recognizes the noble significance of the spear.

TRUE INDEED!  LIke I said any idiot can use a gun but a spear takes SKELLZ!
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on August 14, 2006, 10:25:49 am


I want to get me an african spear and put on display in my house.  Take one of those over them clumsy guns kids accidentally kill themselves with every day


 :D  True. The average American child would be most likely to kill themselves with a gun than with a spear.

In an earlier post, I included a link attached to an image of Kenya's national flag to demonstrate to our friends posting to this topic, that Africans have a sense of pride in those traditional weapons with which they fought for their freedom and their lives. I'm not sure that relating the following tidbit of information will help or hinder matters, but there is a famous picture of the founder of the Black Panther Party, Huey Newton, wearing the signature Panther black beret, seated in a large chai, holding a rifle in one hand and a spear in the other.

A black warrior - no matter his national origin - recognizes the noble significance of the spear.




(http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/fileadmin/historyLearningSite/huey_n1.jpg)


(http://www.zachriel.com/gotm12/zulu/spears277.jpg)
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on August 18, 2006, 06:59:41 am


I want to get me an african spear and put on display in my house.  Take one of those over them clumsy guns kids accidentally kill themselves with every day


 :D  True. The average American child would be most likely to kill themselves with a gun than with a spear.

In an earlier post, I included a link attached to an image of Kenya's national flag to demonstrate to our friends posting to this topic, that Africans have a sense of pride in those traditional weapons with which they fought for their freedom and their lives. I'm not sure that relating the following tidbit of information will help or hinder matters, but there is a famous picture of the founder of the Black Panther Party, Huey Newton, wearing the signature Panther black beret, seated in a large chai, holding a rifle in one hand and a spear in the other.

A black warrior - no matter his national origin - recognizes the noble significance of the spear.




([url]http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/fileadmin/historyLearningSite/huey_n1.jpg[/url])


([url]http://www.zachriel.com/gotm12/zulu/spears277.jpg[/url])


Well Done, voodoochild!

Thank you.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 10, 2007, 02:13:11 am
Whoa!! I understand I am a newbie here and this reply is waayy late, but what are you guys talking about ???? I agree with Jakuta. That movie's depiction of BP and Wakanda was WHACK!!! You can say all you want about the vibranium tip spears and all that, but the representation was still this backward, primitive culture that is supposed to be one, of if not the MOST, technological on the planet and they were using spears against aliens and Ult Avengers who were routing them. If you go with some of the explanations of shields that can withstand the alien weapons and the African garb being ceremonial or whatever, it still came across as a "Tarzan" like image of Africa when not even the poorest country in Africa has a military that doesn't use modern weapons with it's soldiers. Now, if the movie had shown a mix of Wakanda's soldiers, some with shields and spears and others dressed and using modern or futuristic equipment (like Priest did in his comic series on occasion), I wouldn't have found the movie insulting.

And let's go deeper...A few of you said you were glad to at least see you favorite character depicted in this movie. But they depicted him pretty weak (with a weak a@# older costume) and couldn't win a fight against anyone with out help. Isn't this one of the very underlying issues that many of us believe that some fanboys are angry with Hudlin's BP because he is strong, smart and kicks butt? Shoot! in the final battle with the alien leader he had to have Cap's help and even then he turned into some half panther monster to do it. And let's not forget that when Cap and BP first met Cap beats him up, throws him out a window and down a building and was about to continue whipping is a@# until Nick Fury showed up and stopped him. You didn't see any of the strategist, cunning warrior, super intelligent hero that even Jack Kirby showed back in the day, forgetting how even HE depicted Wakanda as a whole.

I understand what you are talking about that blacks should not be turned off by certain aspects of African culture, such as the spear. Hey, I am a big proponent of that myself. But I don't believe that applies here and I don't believe the creators of the Ultimate Avengers 2 story (none who happened to be of African descent) were thinking about that when they put out that movie.

Finally, I went to the Ultimate Avengers 2 site when that movie came out to list my concerns there. When I saw the page their were seceral posts, all of them expressing the same criticisms I and Jakuta had. Unfortunately, when I tried to add my comments the site would not accept any further submissions even though there were only three or four listed! I'm not saying the moderator shut down the visitor submission, but I have to admit it sure did seem too coincidental.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: bluezulu on January 10, 2007, 08:59:14 am
Welcome brother, and thanks for your comment. Yea we had a week or two long discussion about this. Overall every body came away mixed impressed by the movie. We all loved the ideal behind it but it lacked execution in some parts. The spear is at least equal to the sword and both are less then guns.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 10, 2007, 03:05:15 pm
Whoa!! I understand I am a newbie here and this reply is waayy, but what are you guys talking about?? I agree with Jakuta. That movie's depiction of BP and Wakanda was WHACK!!! You can say all you want about the vibranium tip spears and all that, but the representation was still this backward, primitive culture that is supposed to be one of if not the MOST technological on the planet and they were using spears against the aliens and Avengers who were routing them. If you go with some of the explanations of shields that can withstand the alien weapons and the African garb being ceremonial or whatever, it still came across as a "Tarzan" like image of Africa when not even the poorest country in Africa has a military that doesn't use modern weapons with it's soldiers. Now, if the movie had shown a mix of Wakanda's soldiers, some with shields and spears and others dressed and using modern or futuristic equipment (like Priest did in his comic series on occasion), I wouldn't have found the movie insulting.

And let's go deeper...A few of you said you were glad to at least see you favorite character depicted in this movie. But they depicted him pretty weak (with a weak a@# older costume) and couldn't win a fight against anyone with out help. Isn't this one of the very underlying issues that many of us believe that some fanboys are angry with Hudlin's BP because he is strong, smart and kicks butt? Shoot! in the final battle with the alien leader he had to have Cap's help and even then he turned into some half panther monster to do it. And let's not forget that when Cap and BP first met Cap beats him up, throws him out a window and down a building and was about to continue whipping is a@# until Nick Fury showed up and stopped him. You didn't see any of the strategist, cunning warrior, super intelligent hero that even Jack Kirby showed back in the day, forgetting how even HE depicted Wakanda as a whole.

I understand what you are talking about that blacks should not be turned off by certain aspects of African culture, such as the spear. Hey, I am a big proponent of that myself. But I don't believe that applies here and I don't believe the creators of the Ultimate Avengers 2 story (none who happened to be of African descent) were thinking about that when they put out that movie.

Finally, I went to the Ultimate Avengers 2 site when that movie came out to list my concerns there. When I saw the page their were seceral posts, all of them expressing the same criticisms I and Jakuta had. Unfortunately, when I tried to add my comments the site would not accept any further submissions even though there were only three or four listed! I'm not saying the moderator shut down the visitor submission, but I have to admit it sure did seem too coincidental.

I didn't like the depiction at all.I haven't seen the whole movie,but I saw the clips in question on Youtube.Now,even the allowing them the greatest possible lattitude that I'm aware of,I still find the "spear chucking" image to be offensive and sans the IN-STORY justification that we are talking about.In other words,there isn't a scene that I'm aware of IN THE MOVIE DURING THE FIGHTING that explain that the Wakandans are using vibranium-enhanced weaponry.There isn't an IN-STORY EXPLANATION (hell,Samuel Jackson...er,Nick Fury,could've done it when he and Cap and BP spoke together and NICK was explaining to CAP about Wakanda later) stating that Wakanda has both "tribal" elements in the outskirts away from the cities and yet their cities are the most technologically advanced in the world.It would've been the city-dwelling tech that would have read the approach of the aliens and it would've been the formidable high tech weaponry from the high-tech areas that would have fired on the invaders and dropped them from the sky in the first place.

The creators didn't do this.I think purposefully.Because their target group was mostly White guys who don't want to see that about Africa.

Furthermore,TChalla got straight handled by CAP.I'm sayin CAP put HANDS on TChalla...after the writers made it clear that the hott ass Russian superspy BW was crushin on CAP,and after CAP did the alpha-male brush off of her.What is conveyed here is a clear inferiority of both BP and Wakanda...even though these same Wakandans did well against The Avengers...er,Ultimates.But even in those instances there's a backhanded element to it.How could they take down IRON MAN but get scattered by THE WASP? They didn't underestimate her because their plan was to defeat THE AVENGERS as a whole.Where were their spears then? Hahaha.What I am saying here is that the image of even THE BEST AFRICA HAS TO OFFER IS STILL BACKWARDS (Wakandans) and STILL CAN'T EQUAL OUR BEST (Captain America defeats BP in their brief tussle in a one sided fashion) is the main message being sent.To be fair,it explains how THE AVENGERS+ WAKANDA could defeat the aliens. But also,to me,the message is clear: even at their peak and left to their own devices,Black folks still need our help to do what they want to do.

Btw,I like spears.I have a catalogue with several different types,and I'm debating as to which I should buy first.But I prefer pistols,knives,etc.And yeah,I intend to be dope with the spear.I'll devise a throwing program similar to the javelin throw in track,and of course hand to hand you know how I'll do the Chaka Zulu assegai/quarterstaff combo fighting style.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Open palm on January 10, 2007, 05:50:43 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: True Father 7 on January 11, 2007, 04:50:34 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on January 11, 2007, 05:20:57 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Open palm on January 11, 2007, 08:00:02 pm
Ultimate BP didn't meet my full expectations. The feline transformation wouldn't bet so ridiculous if it didn't come off as his own style of Hulking out. I don't understand why the Wakandans didn't study more of the technology of the fallen ship.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 11, 2007, 09:19:11 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.

I'm aware of that,bruh,and never misconstrued the two.But my point about the lack of "in-story explanation" about the vibranium tipped spears and the complete ignoring of high-tech weaponry that was utilized to drop the invaders in the first place (or am I wrong about that? Didn't the Wakandans SHOOT DOWN the aliens?) being deployed against THE ULTIMATES when they came to Wakanda.Weren't the Wakandans using spears and whatnot against IRON MAN?
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on January 12, 2007, 07:10:05 am
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.

I'm aware of that,bruh,and never misconstrued the two.But my point about the lack of "in-story explanation" about the vibranium tipped spears and the complete ignoring of high-tech weaponry that was utilized to drop the invaders in the first place (or am I wrong about that? Didn't the Wakandans SHOOT DOWN the aliens?) being deployed against THE ULTIMATES when they came to Wakanda.Weren't the Wakandans using spears and whatnot against IRON MAN?

My reply wasnt necessarily directed toward you, Supreme.  It was mostly directed at the posters who were disappointed that the animated Ultimate Panther wasnt like 616 comic book Panther.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 12, 2007, 08:12:00 am
This is just another in a Looooooooonnnnng line of things that Make Me Detest and Despise the Ultimate Universe even more.

If the Ultimate Comic book Version of T'Challa is just like the little Weak @$$ Movie Version of T'Challa then I won't be picking up the Ultimate Avengers Comic Ether.

I HATE the Ultimate Universe >.<
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Open palm on January 12, 2007, 08:46:21 am
Word, Brother Grim!  :D
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 12, 2007, 08:58:50 am
So far,I like Ultimates and Ultimate X-MEN...and of course ULTIMATE SPIDEY.I like Ultimate Elektra.So far that's all I know...I don't really really follow the Ultimate Universe...I just read the books MILLAR wrote and then ULTIMATE SPIDEY is Bendis,right? That pretty much sums up my take on the Ultimate Universe...
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 12, 2007, 06:17:18 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.

I'm aware of that,bruh,and never misconstrued the two.But my point about the lack of "in-story explanation" about the vibranium tipped spears and the complete ignoring of high-tech weaponry that was utilized to drop the invaders in the first place (or am I wrong about that? Didn't the Wakandans SHOOT DOWN the aliens?) being deployed against THE ULTIMATES when they came to Wakanda.Weren't the Wakandans using spears and whatnot against IRON MAN?

My reply wasnt necessarily directed toward you, Supreme.  It was mostly directed at the posters who were disappointed that the animated Ultimate Panther wasnt like 616 comic book Panther.

Granted. But then why are all the other heroes in the Ultimate Avengers movie competent and able to throw down? Even though it is a different universe they aren't that much different then the ones in the 616. Wakanda and T'Challa are weaker in character than all the other Ultimate universe characters.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 12, 2007, 06:23:41 pm
This is just another in a Looooooooonnnnng line of things that Make Me Detest and Despise the Ultimate Universe even more.

If the Ultimate Comic book Version of T'Challa is just like the little Weak @$$ Movie Version of T'Challa then I won't be picking up the Ultimate Avengers Comic Ether.

I HATE the Ultimate Universe >.<

I think the Ultimate 'verse sucks a@# too. I REALLY hate the Cap America. To me, he is arrogant bully. This is not the man that would inspire the ideals of America in me nor would I follow him into battle. The Cap of the 616? Though he is still a soldier, he doesn't follow blindly his orders and when he sees the true ideals of America being perverted he does something about it. He is strong, a soldier and if that character were real he would inspire me. I'd follow the guy into Mephisto's lair with only a rock in my hand if he asked.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on January 12, 2007, 08:23:38 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.

I'm aware of that,bruh,and never misconstrued the two.But my point about the lack of "in-story explanation" about the vibranium tipped spears and the complete ignoring of high-tech weaponry that was utilized to drop the invaders in the first place (or am I wrong about that? Didn't the Wakandans SHOOT DOWN the aliens?) being deployed against THE ULTIMATES when they came to Wakanda.Weren't the Wakandans using spears and whatnot against IRON MAN?

My reply wasnt necessarily directed toward you, Supreme.  It was mostly directed at the posters who were disappointed that the animated Ultimate Panther wasnt like 616 comic book Panther.

Granted. But then why are all the other heroes in the Ultimate Avengers movie competent and able to throw down? Even though it is a different universe they aren't that much different then the ones in the 616. Wakanda and T'Challa are weaker in character than all the other Ultimate universe characters.

I would guess that it's because movie Ultimate Panther is something of a rookie.  Wakanda may be weaker than 616 but they are the only country that successfully fends off the invasion.  Actually, The Ultimates and the 616 Avengers are a lot different.  Ultimates are harder edged and morally ambiguous.  More real world-ish if you will. 
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 13, 2007, 07:44:06 am
I like most parts about the Ultimate verse.  I love Cap because he seems more real to me.  Something always struck me odd about an American WWII supersoldier not willing to kill.  The one thing I hate is Luke CAge.  They did him wrong and that sh*t is unforgivable.  Other than him though I have so far like the Falcon and Misty Knight.  I think the Falcon is actually better than his 616 counterpart.

One thing we have to consider as well is that Black Panther have not been introduced in the Ultimate verse so this movie isn't necessarily reflective of the the comic universe.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 13, 2007, 07:59:36 am
I like most parts about the Ultimate verse.  I love Cap because he seems more real to me.  Something always struck me odd about an American WWII supersoldier not willing to kill.  The one thing I hate is Luke CAge.  They did him wrong and that sh*t is unforgivable.  Other than him though I have so far like the Falcon and Misty Knight.  I think the Falcon is actually better than his 616 counterpart.

One thing we have to consider as well is that Black Panther have not been introduced in the Ultimate verse so this movie isn't necessarily reflective of the the comic universe.

Just like I said before,if he ends up Sucking as hard as his movie counter Part, his comics will be another one of ALL the Ultimate comics I won't buy.The Ultimate universe is just so Crapply done,If something is not broken please don't try to fix it Marvel >.<

Come on,Giant man is a wife beater now?(And did you see how they Changed his wife to an Asian woman so it can somehow be ok for him to beat her now in this Universe >.<)

Hulk only wanted to be the Hulk so he could impress his wife??

Venom is now a drug suit you put on over your body that Drives you crazy?

Green Goblin is a huge brute monster?

Good God The Ultimate universe sucks.....
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 13, 2007, 10:45:46 am
Quote
Come on,Giant man is a wife beater now?(And did you see how they Changed his wife to an Asian woman so it can somehow be ok for him to beat her now in this Universe >.<)

Wasn't he a wifebeater in 616?  And Cap taxed him immediately.

Quote
Hulk only wanted to be the Hulk so he could impress his wife??

He wanted to be Hulk because everybody took a piss on him throughout the whole story.

Quote
Venom is now a drug suit you put on over your body that Drives you crazy?

Oh and the convoluted 616 origin is sooo much better

Quote
Green Goblin is a huge brute monster?

In contrast to the Demented Santa's Elf in 616?

Quote
Good God The Ultimate universe sucks.....
So does the regular universe, it just has a better Panther
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 13, 2007, 11:19:05 am
Wasn't he a wifebeater in 616?  And Cap taxed him immediately.

He was already a wife beater? So the Ultimate Universe just Copied a crappy Story? ::)

Good Job Ultimate Universe for keeping crappy consistency

Quote
He wanted to be Hulk because everybody took a piss on him throughout the whole story.

A Geek being picked on and wanting to be stronger story...like we have not seen THAT one before ::)

The wife making him feel like crap was a new spin tho still very Corney and weakly written.

Quote
Oh and the convoluted 616 origin is sooo much better

Hmmmm Alien from outerspace that takes over and feeds off your body making you stronger faster and meaner....

Or

Goo suit that is supposed to stop Cancer...but Drives you crazy instead.....yea

It's not hard to see which one would make a more interesting movie. :-\

Quote
In contrast to the Demented Santa's Elf in 616?

Again...

Crazy Demented Genius Santa's Elf who lobs Bombs at people,flys around on a hover craft and invents cool Gadgets and ways to off the Superhero and people close to him?

Or

Big Dumb Brute that lobs cars at people...


hmmm...

Quote
So does the regular universe, it just has a better Panther

Bull Crap, I would not Wipe my Bum with an Ultimate Comic.

616 could NEVER be as Horrible as Ultimate on it's WORSE day  :D :D :D
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 13, 2007, 02:34:35 pm
Quote
He was already a wife beater? So the Ultimate Universe just Copied a crappy Story?

Good Job Ultimate Universe for keeping crappy consistency

The wifebeating stands as a 616 idea

Quote
He wanted to be Hulk because everybody took a piss on him throughout the whole story.

A Geek being picked on and wanting to be stronger story...like we have not seen THAT one before

The wife making him feel like crap was a new spin tho still very Corney and weakly written.

May not be original, but I found it to be well told and under comic book conditions, plausible.  You bug a dude hard enough, combine that with pressure he was under and pretty soon he's gonna explode.  He just had help with a needle

Quote
Hmmmm Alien from outerspace that takes over and feeds off your body making you stronger faster and meaner....

Or

Goo suit that is supposed to stop Cancer...but Drives you crazy instead.....yea

It's not hard to see which one would make a more interesting movie.


The experiment gone wrong story would make it to screen alot faster than Spidey picking up a ball, the ball becoming a new suit, him wearing it for awhile until he has to fight it, then finally ending up on someone else story the 616 told.

A
Quote
gain...

Crazy Demented Genius Santa's Elf who lobs Bombs at people,flys around on a hover craft and invents cool Gadgets and ways to off the Superhero and people close to him?

Or

Big Dumb Brute that lobs cars at people...


hmmm...

He wasn't dumb, but he was insane.  And as the Green Goblin, Osborn was a frightening and powerful monster who knew about Peter's identity and terrorized him and his family with his crazy obsession.  I'll take that over the stupid elf with the gadgets anyday.

Quote
Bull Crap, I would not Wipe my Bum with an Ultimate Comic.

Whatever you like bro, it's your world

Quote
616 could NEVER be as Horrible as Ultimate on it's WORSE day   


Yeah it is, if not for Panther and CW, I wouldn't even bother with 616.  Almost every other 616 comic is burnt out on continuity.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Mastrmynd on January 13, 2007, 05:20:22 pm
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 13, 2007, 07:10:47 pm
The wifebeating stands as a 616 idea

Which means it also still stands that the Ultimate universe did NOTHING new,which is the whole reason it was created in the first place,to do new things.

Quote
May not be original, but I found it to be well told and under comic book conditions, plausible.  You bug a dude hard enough, combine that with pressure he was under and pretty soon he's gonna explode.  He just had help with a needle

So what?

Still dose not change the fact that this has been done in countless comics,scary movies,and comedies the world over,Again The Ultimate universe fails in what it set out to do,create new things.

Quote
The experiment gone wrong story would make it to screen alot faster than Spidey picking up a ball, the ball becoming a new suit, him wearing it for awhile until he has to fight it, then finally ending up on someone else story the 616 told.

Ohhhh God,another Science Experiment Gone wrong Story ::)

I can see a Pattern here,you love things that have been done before. Thats OK,but I HATE seeing the same thing over and over again.

An Alien Symbiot from outerspace would be and IS much more interesting.

Quote
He wasn't dumb, but he was insane.  And as the Green Goblin, Osborn was a frightening and powerful monster who knew about Peter's identity and terrorized him and his family with his crazy obsession.  I'll take that over the stupid elf with the gadgets anyday.

So what your saying is he was just a weaker Version of Venom from the 616 Universe? Dang is it me or is the Ultimate Universe lacking in creating new ideas? So they just copied and pasted Venom onto Green Goblin and threw out all the Gadgets and Inventive know how?

Then On top of that changed Venom into an "experiment Drug Gone wrong" 

thats just so....Crappy

Quote
Whatever you like bro, it's your world

Correct

Quote
Yeah it is, if not for Panther and CW, I wouldn't even bother with 616.  Almost every other 616 comic is burnt out on continuity.

Thats Perfectly fine,I would rather have good long standing Stories then Non inventive/use the same thing over again but for another character/weakly written/Stories.

If they set out to do something new then thats what they should have done,I'm Not paying my hard earned Cash for stuff that has been done before in the 616 and done BETTER.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 13, 2007, 07:27:31 pm
Quote
Which means it also still stands that the Ultimate universe did NOTHING new,which is the whole reason it was created in the first place,to do new things.

I think of the Ultimate Universe as more of a mordernized reboot, that just something new altogether, in fact, that's part of it's charm.  The old stuff reimagined and refreshed, at least in Spider-Man's case.

Quote
So what?


So I enjoyed it  ;D

Quote
Still dose not change the fact that this has been done in countless comics,scary movies,and comedies the world over,Again The Ultimate universe fails in what it set out to do,create new things.

If it was about creating new things it wouldn't have the same old characters.  It's more of a reboot.

Quote
Ohhhh God,another Science Experiment Gone wrong Story


Reminds me of the South Park episode "Simpsons did it"

Quote
I can see a Pattern here,you love things that have been done before. Thats OK,but I HATE seeing the same thing over and over again.

If you can spare the time, read the book of Ecclesiastes

Quote
So what your saying is he was just a weaker Version of Venom from the 616 Universe?

Nope, Venom at least in the early stories was just about Peter, he only threatened the fam when Peter tried to get help.  UGG was more of an overbearing threat to everyone Pete loves.

Quote
Thats Perfectly fine,I would rather have good long standing Stories then Non inventive/use the same thing over again but for another character/weakly written/Stories.

Most of the longstanding stories have not aged well and constricted the creativity of today's stuff to the point we have stuff like "Norman banged Gwen and had kids" stuff.  616 needed to start over, and that's where Ultimate comes in.  And I like the new Nick Fury too.

Quote
If they set out to do something new then thats what they should have done,I'm Not paying my hard earned Cash for stuff that has been done before in the 616 and done BETTER.

Ultimate Spider-Man kills 616 Spidey
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 13, 2007, 09:31:56 pm
I LOOOVE Ultimate Cap.That guy is--attitude-wise and physically--CAPTAIN AMERICA to me...just still fresh out the ice.he's still adjusting to our time.I couldn't stand the idea that 616 CAP can barely bench 800 pounds...when the vvarious bench press records range from 818 to 10015 pounds or so.Cap should be able to bench press TONS,and with relative EASE.So should BP...except BP should be FASTER than CAP,MORE AGILE,WITH SUPERIOR BALANCE,and all the other elements of the great cats: supremely silent movement,unmatched and extreme grace,cunning,unequaled leaping ability,among the most elite trackers worldwide,etc.He should have these attributes to a greater degree than CAP.One may argue that Cap SHOULD have greater endurance and strength than BP if BP has these clear advantages in attributes in other areas,but I don't think he should...

...anyway,I love me some ULTIMATE CAP.Especially how MILLAR and HITCH and CURRIE did him.If there's anything I don't quite hold with,it's how they depowered THOR to the point that COLOSSUS could wipe the floor with him.Thor should OBLITERATE Colossus and anybody else not named Hercules or The Sentry or of that ilk in direct combat.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 13, 2007, 10:45:03 pm
Grimskill you obviously are missing the point of the Ultimate Universe.  IT is introducing new stories with generally the same themes while modernizing them.  Everything that you have listed as not liking has been done more "realistically" than 616.  The story of Venom was always a big convoluted mess and hard to express in any movie translation.  Little things like spidey's webshooters make way more sense.  Jessica Drew now has a clearcut origin story unlike the convoluted mess of origins that she has in the 616.  Sure the Ultimate unverse isn't for everyone but it is a new take on classic stories.  IT is not suppose to serve as an alternate reality like newuniversal, Mutant X series, Age of Apocalypse or the Squadron Supreme universe.  The stories are suppose to reintroduce  and retell the stories of the 616 characters with some of the same themes but in new ways.

Ultimate Falcon PWNS 616 Falcon.

Ultimate Galactus > than 616 Galactus.  I have always disliked that character.  Too cartoony and ugly.  Ultimate Galactus would definitely translate into a better visual media format than the 616 version.

Hopefully Panther is done in a new an exciting way when he is introduced.

Oh yeah Ultimate Storm blows. They are really trying to take the "black" out of her.  RoLos can have her in that universe.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 13, 2007, 10:52:40 pm
If and when they do BP, I would like them to reimage the Dora Milaje to more of a sacred sect of royal bodyguards (more than just 2) similar to some real life African female warrior groups (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahomey_Amazons).
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 13, 2007, 10:53:00 pm
I agree about Ultimate Galactus,but I think PRIEST FALCON drops dawgs on ULTIMATE FALCON.I loved the ULTIMATE ANNUAL though with CAP and FALCON together...
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: supreme illuminati on January 13, 2007, 10:57:02 pm
If and when they do BP, I would like them to reimage the Dora Milaje to more of a sacred sect of royal bodyguards (more than just 2) similar to some real life African female warrior groups ([url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahomey_Amazons[/url]).


I remember these sistahs,and I remember stories of other legendary Black women warriors..one of whom was an archer said to have no peer in all the land.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Open palm on January 14, 2007, 12:05:59 am
Yeah, Marvel should point out the Dahomey's Ahosi (meaning 'our mothers') when critics complain about the DM.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 14, 2007, 01:06:28 am
I think of the Ultimate Universe as more of a mordernized reboot, that just something new altogether, in fact, that's part of it's charm.  The old stuff reimagined and refreshed, at least in Spider-Man's case.

There is nothing you can say to Justify the Ultimate Universe doing thing SAME things OVER again but more "Modern"(and not as Good as the Originals I might add) and get me to pay my dollas for it  :-\

Quote
If it was about creating new things it wouldn't have the same old characters.  It's more of a reboot.

So it was about doing the same things over again and getting money out of people who would pay for something like that?

OK I see,but I would rather stick with the 616 instead of a rehash gone wrong OF the 616

Quote
Nope, Venom at least in the early stories was just about Peter, he only threatened the fam when Peter tried to get help.  UGG was more of an overbearing threat to everyone Pete loves.

616 Venom = Big Dumb Brute who Threatened people.....Ultimate Goblin = Big Dumb Brute who Threatened people....hmmmm

Quote
Most of the longstanding stories have not aged well and constricted the creativity of today's stuff to the point we have stuff like "Norman banged Gwen and had kids" stuff.  616 needed to start over, and that's where Ultimate comes in.  And I like the new Nick Fury too.

pfft they can keep their Token Nick Fury :D

Didn't the DC Universe Change some characters around to Nonwhite folks WITHOUT creating a whole new Universe for it?

Quote
Ultimate Spider-Man kills 616 Spidey

From what Ive seen they are about the same,except of course 616 Spidey has better Villians ;)
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 14, 2007, 06:26:31 am
Quote
There is nothing you can say to Justify the Ultimate Universe doing thing SAME things OVER again but more "Modern"(and not as Good as the Originals I might add) and get me to pay my dollas for it 


My enjoyment of them is all the justification I really need, man.  As for your dollar, like I said, that's all you


Quote
So it was about doing the same things over again and getting money out of people who would pay for something like that?

Yep, but it taking place in this time frame makes most of the storylines and origins and possibilities way different than the originals.  And you're reading the same thing over and over again in the 616 all the same.  Basically every comic tells the same story, you're not gonna find the originality you seek in those pages.  It's all about how it's done, and Ultimate does it well.

Quote
616 Venom = Big Dumb Brute who Threatened people.....Ultimate Goblin = Big Dumb Brute who Threatened people....hmmmm

Before we go any further, have you actually read the book?

Quote
From what Ive seen they are about the same,except of course 616 Spidey has better Villians


Naw, I prefer the U versions of most Spidey villains.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 14, 2007, 07:52:12 am
My enjoyment of them is all the justification I really need, man.  As for your dollar, like I said, that's all you

Correct


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Yep, but it taking place in this time frame makes most of the storylines and origins and possibilities way different than the originals.  And you're reading the same thing over and over again in the 616 all the same.  Basically every comic tells the same story, you're not gonna find the originality you seek in those pages.  It's all about how it's done, and Ultimate does it well.

I just don't see how Rebooting something and doing the same things over can be better then whats already been done. Might as well just stick with what has already been done,if they want me to try Ultimate they better do something REALLY diffrent and new,otherwise with these weak storylines and rehashes of things that have been done I just don't see any reason nor have the drive to pick up an Ultimate Comic :-\

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Before we go any further, have you actually read the book?

Actually Ultimate Spidey is the only Ultimate Book I Read through at the comic shop every now and then,he seems the least changed in Origin out of most of the Ultimate heroes.

To bad his Villiens are so Horrible :(

And whats with the Spider girl with the brown hair hanging  out >.<

Quote
Naw, I prefer the U versions of most Spidey villains.

Yikes >.<
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 14, 2007, 12:58:42 pm
When Black Panther first appeared in the FF his country had laser cannons along its border defenses.
That's my two cents.

Nuff said

True, but that was 616 Panther.  This is Ultimate Panther.  Different dude.  Different Wakanda.  I'm not defending some of the choices the Ultimate creators made, but I think it's unfair to compare this Panther with the 616 one.

I'm aware of that,bruh,and never misconstrued the two.But my point about the lack of "in-story explanation" about the vibranium tipped spears and the complete ignoring of high-tech weaponry that was utilized to drop the invaders in the first place (or am I wrong about that? Didn't the Wakandans SHOOT DOWN the aliens?) being deployed against THE ULTIMATES when they came to Wakanda.Weren't the Wakandans using spears and whatnot against IRON MAN?

My reply wasnt necessarily directed toward you, Supreme.  It was mostly directed at the posters who were disappointed that the animated Ultimate Panther wasnt like 616 comic book Panther.

Granted. But then why are all the other heroes in the Ultimate Avengers movie competent and able to throw down? Even though it is a different universe they aren't that much different then the ones in the 616. Wakanda and T'Challa are weaker in character than all the other Ultimate universe characters.

I would guess that it's because movie Ultimate Panther is something of a rookie.  Wakanda may be weaker than 616 but they are the only country that successfully fends off the invasion.  Actually, The Ultimates and the 616 Avengers are a lot different.  Ultimates are harder edged and morally ambiguous.  More real world-ish if you will. 

But EVERYONE is a rookie in the Ultimate verse. This comic line is starting everyone fresh with a new turn on their characters. Therefore, it seems odd that Panther and Wakanda are the only elements that come across a weak.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 14, 2007, 02:06:09 pm
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I just don't see how Rebooting something and doing the same things over can be better then whats already been done. Might as well just stick with what has already been done,if they want me to try Ultimate they better do something REALLY diffrent and new,otherwise with these weak storylines and rehashes of things that have been done I just don't see any reason nor have the drive to pick up an Ultimate Comic


Well most of the stories they're redoing are incredibly dated as they are now.  Most old comics read like crap now, with the preaching to the audience, stiff unrealistic dialogue etc.  I find the reboot refreshing, it's not exactly the same at all.  I myself don't think Ultimates takes Avengers word for word.  Same with Ultimate Fantastic Four, Spider-Man, X-Men.  The stories may have elements of old stories, but it's much different from what I've read.

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Actually Ultimate Spidey is the only Ultimate Book I Read through at the comic shop every now and then,he seems the least changed in Origin out of most of the Ultimate heroes.

Yeah, it's along the same lines, but it's much better told than the original story.  And I see what you're saying, Osborn as the Goblin was initially Hulk with a Hoodie.  But when he returned, he was more inteligent and sinister.

Quote
Yikes >.<

Well not Geldoff
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 14, 2007, 03:47:24 pm
Well most of the stories they're redoing are incredibly dated as they are now.  Most old comics read like crap now, with the preaching to the audience, stiff unrealistic dialogue etc.

I could say the same thing about Ultimate spidey  ;D, Drug suit that drives you crazy??

What a way to tell kids to stay off Drugs ;D ;D ;D ;D

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I find the reboot refreshing, it's not exactly the same at all.

So for you it's all about continuity and thats why the Ultimate Universe works for you,OK I see

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I myself don't think Ultimates takes Avengers word for word.  Same with Ultimate Fantastic Four, Spider-Man, X-Men.  The stories may have elements of old stories, but it's much different from what I've read.


Yea,switching around Villain Archetypes might mix it up for a few,but I am not falling for it >.<

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Yeah, it's along the same lines, but it's much better told than the original story.  And I see what you're saying, Osborn as the Goblin was initially Hulk with a Hoodie.  But when he returned, he was more inteligent and sinister.

ill Take your word for it,I Really do Hope the ultimate Universe gets some GOOD Writers,good enough to sway me. Right now I just hope that they do not Jack up Ultimate T'Challa like he was in the movie. Until then the Ultimate Universe is Guilty until Proven Innocent with me :P

Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: bmagee on January 14, 2007, 03:58:46 pm
I LOVE the Ultimate Universe. I just hope that when it's time for Luke Cage and BP to come out Marvel will do them justice. Luke Cage hasn't been shown, YET as far as I know. If you're talking about that Ultimate Defenders version with that black dude, it sure ain't Cage.  I used to read a lot of spiderman books til it became too boring for me so I stopped long before ultimate spiderman came out. Then I loved spiderman again reading the ultimate spiderman. I think I read just about all of the ultimate books so far and I would say I am impressed with at least 90 percent of them. Ultimate Panther from the video doesn't count because it's not out on books yet.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 14, 2007, 04:40:00 pm
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I could say the same thing about Ultimate spidey  , Drug suit that drives you crazy??

I like that better than alien suit that just wants to be friends.  And the dialogue in the Ultimate Uni I can actually see people saying unlike the soap opera speak in the oldie comics.

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So for you it's all about continuity and thats why the Ultimate Universe works for you,OK I see

Yeah, something like that.

Quote
Yea,switching around Villain Archetypes might mix it up for a few,but I am not falling for it >.<

It's more than a switch up here and there, it's a different take on old characters

Quote
ill Take your word for it,I Really do Hope the ultimate Universe gets some GOOD Writers,good enough to sway me. Right now I just hope that they do not Jack up Ultimate T'Challa like he was in the movie. Until then the Ultimate Universe is Guilty until Proven Innocent with me


I can agree with that, while I wasn't totally put off by the UA Black Panther, they oughta be smacked for giving him that costume.  Black Panther's garb is one of the coolest looking outfits ever in comics.  It's simple, it's mysterious, it's dramatic and they make THAT for the movie?  But anyway, I put Bendis under Hudlin as my fav writer and he kicks ass on U Spidey
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 15, 2007, 03:09:47 am
I like that better than alien suit that just wants to be friends.  And the dialogue in the Ultimate Uni I can actually see people saying unlike the soap opera speak in the oldie comics.

Far be it for an Alien Life form to want to take over your body and use it for nourishment,Lets just make it into a Drug that Drives you Crazy :-\ ;D ;D

And the way people talk in the UU is NOT all that Different from 616,On top of that it seems forced most of the time. But to each his own I Guess

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It's more than a switch up here and there, it's a different take on old characters

A new take which has pretty much been done already (Hulk) Or is so far out there and goofy it just puts me off the book (Iron man...come on...a invisible forcefield suit to stop an odd type of Cancer?? ???) and then pretty much switching up their Villain Archtypes

Quote
I can agree with that, while I wasn't totally put off by the UA Black Panther, they oughta be smacked for giving him that costume.

I Believe thats a Costume Panther used to wear a loooong time Ago in the 616,but I Agree they should have NEVER Brought it back. They had him Running around looking like Cat Woman's Little Brother >.<
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Wise Son on January 15, 2007, 03:20:52 am
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.
Differences of opinion!
OH NOEES!!!111!1
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: voodoochild on January 15, 2007, 10:01:41 am
But EVERYONE is a rookie in the Ultimate verse. This comic line is starting everyone fresh with a new turn on their characters. Therefore, it seems odd that Panther and Wakanda are the only elements that come across a weak.

No, the Ultimates aren't exactly rookies in this film.  Cap still has all of his WW2 experience.  The Black Widow is still a world class spy.  Iron Man has been around for a minute.  As a team, they might be new, but not as individuals.  Tchalla on the other hand hasn't really been active as long.  I was under the assumption that this was his first time leaving Wakanda as the Panther.  And finally, this is The Ultimates show, guest starring Black Panther.  Not the other way around.  There's no way that the creators are going to show the Panther kicking the Ultimates ass in their own cartoon! ;D

I look at the show with "the glass is half full" eyes.  Yeah, Panther was weak, he had questionable taste in ceremonial garb, the Wakandans were throwing spears, and the dialogue was clunky...but we had the Panther on the cover of a major DVD release.  The character is more high profile now than he has ever been. 
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 15, 2007, 11:21:38 am
But EVERYONE is a rookie in the Ultimate verse. This comic line is starting everyone fresh with a new turn on their characters. Therefore, it seems odd that Panther and Wakanda are the only elements that come across a weak.

No, the Ultimates aren't exactly rookies in this film.  Cap still has all of his WW2 experience.  The Black Widow is still a world class spy.  Iron Man has been around for a minute.  As a team, they might be new, but not as individuals.  Tchalla on the other hand hasn't really been active as long.  I was under the assumption that this was his first time leaving Wakanda as the Panther.  And finally, this is The Ultimates show, guest starring Black Panther.  Not the other way around.  There's no way that the creators are going to show the Panther kicking the Ultimates ass in their own cartoon! ;D

I look at the show with "the glass is half full" eyes.  Yeah, Panther was weak, he had questionable taste in ceremonial garb, the Wakandans were throwing spears, and the dialogue was clunky...but we had the Panther on the cover of a major DVD release.  The character is more high profile now than he has ever been. 

I see what your trying to say,But it annoys me that the Cons Outweigh the Pros in this situation so much >.<
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 15, 2007, 02:55:30 pm
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Far be it for an Alien Life form to want to take over your body and use it for nourishment,Lets just make it into a Drug that Drives you Crazy   


Far be it a man tries to cure cancer and just takes a serious wrong turn with a super suit.  Comics have always asked us to accept some ridiculous things, both Venom origins ask alot, no biggie.

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And the way people talk in the UU is NOT all that Different from 616,On top of that it seems forced most of the time. But to each his own I Guess

I read quite a bit of the Ultimate Universe, and while it has alot of familiar characters and some stories are based on famous 616 storylines, but it's still a much different take than the original.  It may not be good all the time, but it's far from a carbon copy.

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A new take which has pretty much been done already (Hulk) Or is so far out there and goofy it just puts me off the book (Iron man...come on...a invisible forcefield suit to stop an odd type of Cancer?? ) and then pretty much switching up their Villain Archtypes

Or a refreshing new start for classic characters like Spider-Man and X-Men (even though X-Men has been slippin a bit).  It's not without faults, but I enjoy it.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 15, 2007, 03:57:16 pm
Far be it a man tries to cure cancer and just takes a serious wrong turn with a super suit.  Comics have always asked us to accept some ridiculous things, both Venom origins ask alot, no biggie.

Yikes >.<

Let me Break it down...

Aliens are Cool....But  Drugs???.....not so much

The writers should have took what they tell you in School, Drugs are no Good  :D :D :D,The Alien Origin Just makes so much more since.

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I read quite a bit of the Ultimate Universe, and while it has alot of familiar characters and some stories are based on famous 616 storylines, but it's still a much different take than the original.  It may not be good all the time, but it's far from a carbon copy.


Of course,because you still have the switched around Villains in the Mix  ;D ;D

Quote
Or a refreshing new start for classic characters like Spider-Man and X-Men (even though X-Men has been slippin a bit).  It's not without faults, but I enjoy it.

And Again,Switch around the Villain Archetypes and there you have,the Ultimate U  :P
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 15, 2007, 05:34:59 pm
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Yikes >.<

Let me Break it down...

Aliens are Cool....But  Drugs???.....not so much

The writers should have took what they tell you in School, Drugs are no Good    ,The Alien Origin Just makes so much more since.

Yes, Drugs are bad, but so are aliens, I mean come on, that thing was just too damn clingy and had mental issues itself.  Alien symbiotes acting like jilted girlfriends?  Come on, that didn't make any sense, we all just ignored that cause Venom was cool a villain.

Quote
Of course,because you still have the switched around Villains in the Mix   


The change in times is the real difference
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 15, 2007, 07:33:01 pm
Yes, Drugs are bad, but so are aliens, I mean come on, that thing was just too damn clingy and had mental issues itself.  Alien symbiotes acting like jilted girlfriends?  Come on, that didn't make any sense, we all just ignored that cause Venom was cool a villain.

You keep Making my Points even BETTER ;D ;D :D :D

A Movie about a Clingy Alien Girlfriend would Be SOOOOOOOOOOOOO Much Better then a Movie about some Guy on Drugs LOL

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The change in times is the real difference

Blaaa,The Change in times has happend in the 616 as well
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 15, 2007, 08:15:27 pm
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You keep Making my Points even BETTER   

A Movie about a Clingy Alien Girlfriend would Be SOOOOOOOOOOOOO Much Better then a Movie about some Guy on Drugs LOL

My Super Ex Girlfriend is not SOOOOOO much better than a experimental cure for cancer.
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Blaaa,The Change in times has happend in the 616 as well

but the restart to present times adds a refreshing element with things starting over again.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 15, 2007, 08:54:44 pm
My Super Ex Girlfriend is not SOOOOOO much better than a experimental cure for cancer.

Come on,if Uma Thurman asked if she could cling to you and feed off of you and "Bond" with you Like a Symbiot....I Doubt you would say no :-\


Quote
but the restart to present times adds a refreshing element with things starting over again.

Oh yes...the changing around of the Villains and their "Drug" Habits :D :D
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 15, 2007, 11:35:28 pm
But EVERYONE is a rookie in the Ultimate verse. This comic line is starting everyone fresh with a new turn on their characters. Therefore, it seems odd that Panther and Wakanda are the only elements that come across a weak.

No, the Ultimates aren't exactly rookies in this film.  Cap still has all of his WW2 experience.  The Black Widow is still a world class spy.  Iron Man has been around for a minute.  As a team, they might be new, but not as individuals.  Tchalla on the other hand hasn't really been active as long.  I was under the assumption that this was his first time leaving Wakanda as the Panther.  And finally, this is The Ultimates show, guest starring Black Panther.  Not the other way around.  There's no way that the creators are going to show the Panther kicking the Ultimates ass in their own cartoon! ;D

I look at the show with "the glass is half full" eyes.  Yeah, Panther was weak, he had questionable taste in ceremonial garb, the Wakandans were throwing spears, and the dialogue was clunky...but we had the Panther on the cover of a major DVD release.  The character is more high profile now than he has ever been. 

Wait a minute... I can buy the idea of Cap having his experience from WWII and Black Widow being a master spy, but I don't believe that can be said for sure about the other Ultimate Avengers. In fact, as far as Black Widow's experience goes, we can definitely ASSUME she is experienced based on our experience with her in the 616 'verse, but this is the Ultimate Universe where everything is getting a make over. Iron Man was becoming noticeable to the public at the start of the first movie which is why Nick Fury wanted to recruit him, but I don't recall anything in the Ultimate movies saying this guy had loads of experience. That leaves the Wasp, Hank Pym, Thor (again we have to assume he has loads of experience) and the Hulk who was pretty much a non-team member other than to help trash aliens before he turned on his team mates. Irregardless of all this the Ultimate Avengers as a team are rookies as they really just got done with their adventure in the first movie.

As for T'Challa, he still had to have warrior prowess to don the Panther suit. We don't see this in the film but if we are to assume that the Ultimate Avengers were made up of experienced people, than why not assume T'Challa went through the battle of the strongest men in Wakanda to wear the Panther title? What about his schooling abroad? Not just iof the mind but of the body and fighting skills outside of Wakandan martial arts? This would all be assumptions, but I say that you have to make assumptions about all the main characters except for Cap.

Also, I don't think it would be a stretch to have Panther put a smack down on the Ultimate Avengers. After all, the movie, "The Panther's Prey" is about the Ultimates meeting up with T'Challa for the first time who rightfully should be an Ultimate Avenger himself. So it's HIS cartoon too. They just should have called it (the Panther Pu@#$) based on the way he he was portrayed. And you're still not addressing the fact that Wakanda itself was portrayed as a "backward" African nation with a few alien inspired weapons.

To be honest, I really wouldn't have been that upset, if Panther had at least got Cap back for handling him and throwing him down a building. Or even if BP had taken out each of the Ultimates one at a time as he did to the Fantastic Four when he was originally introduced in the 616 'verse. That way it would have shown me the character was well respected and prove he was a peson to be reckoned with. Frankly, it seems that the Ultimate creators are just making him out to be the tired C class hero he was in the 616 before Priest and Hudlin started writing him.

And yes, that suit they had him in was pretty bad, even if it was an older version from the 616. Give him a bow tie and he could have joined the Chipmunks Exotic male dancers. :(

Just my two piece and a biscuit.....

Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 16, 2007, 02:31:55 pm
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Come on,if Uma Thurman asked if she could cling to you and feed off of you and "Bond" with you Like a Symbiot....I Doubt you would say no

Don't be silly, now if it were Jessica Alba....

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Oh yes...the changing around of the Villains and their "Drug" Habits 


The only thing that's really the same is Spider-Man's costume and some major characteristics of the heroes, besides that, hate it or love, the UU is very different than 616
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 16, 2007, 04:12:05 pm
Don't be silly, now if it were Jessica Alba....

Ewwwwwwww, Jessica used to be hot back in the Day when she had those full lips and that Booty,but not no more >.<

She is a Boney Pole Hollywood white standerd of Beauty Havin Actress now >.<

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The only thing that's really the same is Spider-Man's costume and some major characteristics of the heroes, besides that, hate it or love, the UU is very different than 616

If by Different you mean Suckyer,then I Agree  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 16, 2007, 04:35:23 pm
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Ewwwwwwww, Jessica used to be hot back in the Day when she had those full lips and that Booty,but not no more >.<

She is a Boney Pole Hollywood white standerd of Beauty Havin Actress now >.<


Don't care one bit

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If by Different you mean Suckyer,then I Agree     


U Spidey owns 616
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Open palm on January 16, 2007, 07:37:35 pm
U.Spidey cusses too much.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 16, 2007, 11:35:59 pm
Don't care one bit

Gosh could we be more diffrent >.<

1) I Hate The Ultimate Universe but you Love it

2) I Hate Rehashes with minor changes,you love em

3) I Like Boobs,Hips and Booty, But you Hate ALL of that >.<

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U Spidey owns 616

Maybe in an Alternate Reality where everything is upside down and Black is White and Up Is Down :-\
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Wise Son on January 17, 2007, 01:04:55 am
D and Grim, you guys have a difference of opinion. That's all. If you're actually having fun with all this back-and-forth, then by all means keep at it, but it doesn't seem to be generating any real points any more, and I don't think either of you is in danger of changing the others' mind.

Still, if you're enjoying banter about Jessica Alba's arse, please do continue. ;)
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Mastrmynd on January 17, 2007, 07:08:02 am
i have to agree about alba.
she was fine back in the day when she was hispanic.
but not that she's white, well, dayam...she's the same size as the olsen twins.

ugh.

give me Dark Angel jessica any day.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 17, 2007, 07:38:29 pm
i have to agree about alba.
she was fine back in the day when she was hispanic.
but not that she's white, well, dayam...she's the same size as the olsen twins.

ugh.

give me Dark Angel jessica any day.

Like I said, I don't care, to us, she's basically a picture on the net or a movie, and she looks fly there, I haven't seen the one without the curves.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: D- Ruck on January 17, 2007, 07:42:05 pm
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Gosh could we be more diffrent >.<

1) I Hate The Ultimate Universe but you Love it

2) I Hate Rehashes with minor changes,you love em

3) I Like Boobs,Hips and Booty, But you Hate ALL of that >.<

Well once again, if that's the way you wanna look at it....
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on January 21, 2007, 02:39:20 am
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.

Remembering this post and its fine author, I purchased only my 4th, 5th, and 6th issues of an Ultimate Marvel comic book last week. The previous issues were of Ultimate Captain Marvel. I thought the character was extremely well done, better than any "616" Captain Marvel in my always humble opinion.

I purchased "Ultimate Vision". I haven't read the issues yet. However, scanning the first issue, I was pleasantly surprised to see that Ultimate Falcon is not like the "616" "Snap" Wilson at all. In the Ultimate Universe, he is "Dr. Sam Wilson", S.H.I.E.L.D. big-brained scientist.

One thing strikes me as odd about Ultimate Vision. Her "hardcore connections" are apparent all over her body, but she has succulent feminine lips, and a rather pleasing feminine form. Why? Why would Ultimate Vision be equipped with luscious child-bearing hips and mammary glands when there isn't the remotest possibility of her ever conceiving, birthing or nursing a child?
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 21, 2007, 07:47:06 am
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.


One thing strikes me as odd about Ultimate Vision. Her "hardcore connections" are apparent all over her body, but she has succulent feminine lips, and a rather pleasing feminine form. Why? Why would Ultimate Vision be equipped with luscious child-bearing hips and mammary glands when there isn't the remotest possibility of her ever conceiving, birthing or nursing a child?


Because they need an alien/creature/robot for Ultimate Falcon to hook up with.  And here I thought he was going to hook up with Ultimate Misty Knight

(http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/6976/ue040041dn.th.jpg) (http://img250.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ue040041dn.jpg)


Naw the real reason is that she was rebuilt by a highly advanced civilization to mimic the look and language of any civilization that she meets.  It's funny cuz Vision was always said to be Marvels version of Martian Manhunter.  Well 616 Vision was never really the shapeshifter type.  This one is although I don't think "she" can mimic a form "exactly" just a robotic version of it.
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: sinjection on January 21, 2007, 07:53:24 am
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.


One thing strikes me as odd about Ultimate Vision. Her "hardcore connections" are apparent all over her body, but she has succulent feminine lips, and a rather pleasing feminine form. Why? Why would Ultimate Vision be equipped with luscious child-bearing hips and mammary glands when there isn't the remotest possibility of her ever conceiving, birthing or nursing a child?


Because they need an alien/creature/robot for Ultimate Falcon to hook up with.  And here I thought he was going to hook up with Ultimate Misty Knight

([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/6976/ue040041dn.th.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ue040041dn.jpg[/url])


Naw the real reason is that she was rebuilt by a highly advanced civilization to mimic the look and language of any civilization that she meets.  It's funny cuz Vision was always said to be Marvels version of Martian Manhunter.  Well 616 Vision was never really the shapeshifter type.  This one is although I don't think "she" can mimic a form "exactly" just a robotic version of it.


 :D Yaw, you know better than to do that sort of thing to me.

 You realize I was believing almost everything you wrote until you released me from my growing terror with "Naw the real reason is....."
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 21, 2007, 08:19:07 am
put the Black Guy with an Alien is now..

Put the Black Guy with a Robot >.<
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 21, 2007, 08:58:35 am
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.


One thing strikes me as odd about Ultimate Vision. Her "hardcore connections" are apparent all over her body, but she has succulent feminine lips, and a rather pleasing feminine form. Why? Why would Ultimate Vision be equipped with luscious child-bearing hips and mammary glands when there isn't the remotest possibility of her ever conceiving, birthing or nursing a child?


Because they need an alien/creature/robot for Ultimate Falcon to hook up with.  And here I thought he was going to hook up with Ultimate Misty Knight

([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/6976/ue040041dn.th.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ue040041dn.jpg[/url])


Naw the real reason is that she was rebuilt by a highly advanced civilization to mimic the look and language of any civilization that she meets.  It's funny cuz Vision was always said to be Marvels version of Martian Manhunter.  Well 616 Vision was never really the shapeshifter type.  This one is although I don't think "she" can mimic a form "exactly" just a robotic version of it.


 :D Yaw, you know better than to do that sort of thing to me.

 You realize I was believing almost everything you wrote until you released me from my growing terror with "Naw the real reason is....."


lol I was being funny but they still might hook up

Ultimate Vision 1
(http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/7696/uv01onlyorko0092qh.th.jpg) (http://img295.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uv01onlyorko0092qh.jpg)



Final Issue of the series:
(http://marvel.com/comics/onsale/covers/0407/ULTVIS005_cov_SM.jpg)


Sorry :'(
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: Yaw on January 21, 2007, 09:00:30 am
put the Black Guy with an Alien is now..

Put the Black Guy with a Alien Robot >.<

fixed
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: GrimSkill on January 21, 2007, 12:34:59 pm
put the Black Guy with an Alien is now..

Put the Black Guy with a Alien Robot >.<

fixed

 ;D ;D ;D :D ;)
Title: Re: Voice your Opinion "SMALL WORLD!!!"
Post by: The Evasive 1 on January 21, 2007, 04:49:34 pm
i'm standing up for the ultimate univers cuz i like it.
but that's just me.


One thing strikes me as odd about Ultimate Vision. Her "hardcore connections" are apparent all over her body, but she has succulent feminine lips, and a rather pleasing feminine form. Why? Why would Ultimate Vision be equipped with luscious child-bearing hips and mammary glands when there isn't the remotest possibility of her ever conceiving, birthing or nursing a child?


Because they need an alien/creature/robot for Ultimate Falcon to hook up with.  And here I thought he was going to hook up with Ultimate Misty Knight

([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/img250/6976/ue040041dn.th.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://img250.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ue040041dn.jpg[/url])


Naw the real reason is that she was rebuilt by a highly advanced civilization to mimic the look and language of any civilization that she meets.  It's funny cuz Vision was always said to be Marvels version of Martian Manhunter.  Well 616 Vision was never really the shapeshifter type.  This one is although I don't think "she" can mimic a form "exactly" just a robotic version of it.


 :D Yaw, you know better than to do that sort of thing to me.

 You realize I was believing almost everything you wrote until you released me from my growing terror with "Naw the real reason is....."


lol I was being funny but they still might hook up

Ultimate Vision 1
([url]http://img295.imageshack.us/img295/7696/uv01onlyorko0092qh.th.jpg[/url]) ([url]http://img295.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uv01onlyorko0092qh.jpg[/url])



Final Issue of the series:
([url]http://marvel.com/comics/onsale/covers/0407/ULTVIS005_cov_SM.jpg[/url])


Sorry :'(


(http://i128.photobucket.com/albums/p182/clarkebr/sanjuro4.jpg)

WTF!!!! You got be sh@#ing me!