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Messages - KIP LEWIS

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31
SI asked which Warlock would make for a good fight....I think I've decided that the best battle would be BP vs the original Starlin version of Magus.  In many ways, that Magus is the Evil Black Panther.  Warlock/Magus is the superior man, who is incredibly shrewd, a plotter on the level of Thanos or T'Challa.  (That shrewd brain took over an interstellar empire.)  Plus, like the BP, he's the center of a religion.
He has access to advance tech and magic, plus he has the Soul Stone.  Thanos found that the only way to beat him was to stop Warlock from becoming Magus.

32
The issues isn't how Ewing wrote Tchalla or Foreman drawing him in action. The issue is how he designed him. The whole second season was lacking compared to Rocaforts beautifully drawn first season.
This:


Compared to this:
I would except that... The only problem is that the artists would need to get on board with it which is where the problem has always arisen. One artist you get a detailed habit, like Rocafort, Marquez, or Acuna, then the next you get this:



For cosmic stuff the difference was night and day.

Travel did fine on the mk knights mini, but cosmic os not his forte


No argument from me, brother Ezyo.

Guess a matter of taste here, because I'm not actually a fan of Rocaforts' design of the mask.  But that might be because I'm not a big fan of his art on the book.  (And I like the other guy's art even less.)

But I think your point would be more fair, if you compare action shot to action shot or face shot to face shot.  I think a lot of artists would favor the less detailed mask in a full body action shot over a talking-head shot.

33
You may see so many variations, because some artists (not all, but some) have a philosophy that they want to leave a mark on character's look, so they change something to make it "theirs."  The old days of keeping everything "on-model" aren't as prevalent as They were.  That's both good and bad.

Well again that's how I would go about making thing's easy to identify, color code then so it's bot confusing. But the problem is that many artist subscribe to the same basic all Black with white eyes balls look as shown in the image I posted above. Sometimes that can work, if you use shading to give the finer details, something David Marquez pulls off (and then when he activated the solar flare with Tony we saw the finer details of how intricate the habit is when it lit up) the it's fine.

But Travel Foreman's version generally becomes the standard and it's a problem because it often times comes off as lazy and a lack of care to Tchallas detail. Artists have no issue with Spider-Mans costume But can't be bothered to give Tchalla more details.

That's why I respect artists like Acuna, Marquez and Rocafort so much for their attention to his appearance


Yeah, Ultimates' artist just wasn't a good artist at all.  Lots of substandard art in that book.

34
You may see so many variations, because some artists (not all, but some) have a philosophy that they want to leave a mark on character's look, so they change something to make it "theirs."  The old days of keeping everything "on-model" aren't as prevalent as they were.  That's both good and bad.

35
Now. With the above being said, let's return to the topic of the thread.

T'Challa vs The High Evolutionary, who is an extremely. Extremely. Formidable intellect. Maybe they clash because The HE sees Interstellar Empire Wakanda as a menace hundreds or thousands of years in the future, and the HE wants T'Challa to initiate certain changes now in order to prevent the future menace of Wakanda? Or something?

Who wins, T'Chalal or The HE? And why?

Eh, HE always loses.  But it could be fun if his "son" showed up to save him from T'Challa.  Warlock vs T'Challa would be interesting.  (depending on which version of Warlock.  One version became the Living Tribunal--Of course, Starlin wrote that.)



Yes, T'Challa vs Warlock would also be quite interesting. I remember suggesting such a matchup before, but it was T'Challa vs Zombie Warlock and Zombie Guardians of the Galaxy [ the Original Guardians ]. Which Warlock are you thinking of? And the "whys" behind such a scrap would be as interesting as the fight itself.

But I also think that the straight up throwdown with T'Challa vs Stranger, Maximus and the revamped Horde would be a massive, massive test of T'Challa's prep and abilities in every regard. I do think that T'Challa would kill Maximus for this affront, though.

Which Warlock?  There are so many options.

You could actually go the marvel route... first Warlock fights BP then they team  up to battle Stranger and Maximus.

36
Now. With the above being said, let's return to the topic of the thread.

T'Challa vs The High Evolutionary, who is an extremely. Extremely. Formidable intellect. Maybe they clash because The HE sees Interstellar Empire Wakanda as a menace hundreds or thousands of years in the future, and the HE wants T'Challa to initiate certain changes now in order to prevent the future menace of Wakanda? Or something?

Who wins, T'Chalal or The HE? And why?

Eh, HE always loses.  But it could be fun if his "son" showed up to save him from T'Challa.  Warlock vs T'Challa would be interesting.  (depending on which version of Warlock.  One version became the Living Tribunal--Of course, Starlin wrote that.)

37
I think you misunderstand that definition of Audism.  If you think Deafness should/would be cured by technology, it could show a view point that only happens bc you think being Deaf is less than having your hearing.

Example, do you remember the Star Trek the Next Gen episode, with the Deaf ambassador.  In the story, his Chorus, (interpreters) were killed.  The original storyline was for the doctor to create a device to give him hearing like Gordi' visor provides sight.  The Deaf actor said, no.  He made them change that to encouraging people to learn sign language rather than fix something he didn't feel needed to be fixed. 


 

38
I've seen this over and over again, the Deaf community--Deafness is not a disability; they are not broken, Deaf do not view themselves as Disabled by as members of a linguistic minority that has been constantly oppressed by people who can hear to force them to be like the majority.  As far as many in the Deaf Community, it does not need to be fixed; they haven't lost anything--they consider hearing as an unnecessary thing.  If you try to fix them, you're oppressing them.  Basically, if you assume that hearing is better than deaf, that's audism.



That's not accurate.

The help given to deaf persons is not about fixing them, it's about providing assistance.  That's why the device designed to place in their ear is called a 'hearing aid'.



Besides the eugenics program was an argument about special needs people [read: retarded individuals] reproductive rights;  once upon a time, it was believed that if a special needs is allowed to have children, those children will produce more of the same kind. 

This was proven to be a violation of one's Constitution rights as well as Civil Rights, if not Human Rights.


"Activists in the Deaf community claim that audists harm Deaf culture by considering deafness a disability, rather than as a cultural difference.[...Some Deaf activists call cochlear implants the audists' tool of cultural genocide that is wiping out the Deaf community."
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audism] 

So yes,  in the eyes of the Deaf Community,  it's oppression.

39
However I'm getting off my point.

my point was that what you consider to be a positive move in society, somebody else might view that as being a negative or oppression. You think it's good while someone else thinks it's evil. in order to do a program like this you have to make an assumption that everyone wants the same result, I don't think that's ever true. And to those who are on the other side of the argument, they will always view this as evil, oppressive or some other negative term.

40
I don't mean "eugenics" in that sense. I mean the sense of purposefully developing the Wakandan national populace towards their maximum potential in all things good.


Yeah, but that's the logic of all eugenics programs--Maximum potential.  No one views their eugenics program as oppressive, or evil; they see it as "for the common good", "the betterment of mankind" or "maximum potential."

Did you know that Alexander Graham Bell used to promote the concept that Deaf individuals should not be allowed to marry other Deaf individuals, so to reduce the chance of Deafness being passed on to children. I'm sure he saw it as a good thing for the betterment of mankind, to help children reach their best.  The Deaf Community still views him as an oppressor and evil.   (He was wrong about the premise, too.)

Right, now, if you were to say there are no Deaf individuals in Wakanda, the Deaf Community would label that as Audism (the oppression of the Deaf).



They would be wrong. Because the fact is, the OTHER people who professed "eugenics" weren't actually trying to better humanity...they were racists, elitists, and corrupt people in power trying to enforce their racist, elitist, and/or corrupt idea of a specific ideal on a people that initially didn't share such ideals and would not have naturally developed such ideals en masse on their own. Like a blonde hair blue eyed "super race". Or whatever. Wakandans have all kinds of advantages and the track record to end all of that. Ending all forms of sicknesses and maladies is not the oppression of the sick; it's the result of using natural foods, remedies etc to prevent sicknesses and maladies, or curing sickness and maladies once introduced to the healthy via outside forces. In order for deafness to happen? There has to be dysfunction of the cochlea, inner ear, or brain. If this dysfunction never occurs? That's not intolerance of deaf people. That's promotion of health.

In order for Audism to happen? There first have to be an inclination toward OPPRESSION OF DEAF PEOPLE. Is curing the damage to the cochlea, inner ear or brain the same as OPPRESSION OF DEAF PEOPLE? Not. At. All. That's CURING DYSFUNCTION. There are no deaf, blind, etc people in Wakanda to oppress. There's a very significant difference between oppression of the deaf and ensuring that deafness, blindness, sickness, etc never occur by NATURALLY preventing and correcting the in vitro imbalances and dysfunctions that lead to deafness AND USING TECHNOLOGY TO RESTORE HEARING, SIGHT, ETC. ONCE IT'S BEEN TAKEN BY OUTSIDE FORCES.

Wakandans are very much NOT disposed toward OPPRESSING ANYONE. Oppression? Is a prolonged, negative, controlling response aimed specifically at one or selected groups and forced upon said groups to the lasting detriment to said group or groups. It is a negative, destructive,  systematic response aimed toward a specific group of people which grows from a philosophical bigotry, prejudice, etc that has ingrained itself within the institutions of a society, government or civilization. No such philosophy exists in any part of Wakanda, because the people of Wakanda are too culturally, spiritually, mentally and emotionally mature for such pettiness to exist within them. This is precisely the same reason that such stupidities as Rape Camps cannot exist within Wakanda because the corruption of the heart that allows rape to happen doesn't exist in Wakandan hearts. If a formerly hearing person ELECTED to REMAIN deaf and forego treatment for whatever reason? That person would NOT be mistreated.

There ARE exceptions to the rule. Baron Macabre. Zenzi. Tengu. Etc. But their presence makes the rule...the rest of the 99.9% of Wakandans and Wakanda...shine even brighter.

In precisely the same way that a deaf person who undergoes surgery or whatever in order to correct their dysfunctional cochlea so they can hear IS NOT ENGAGING IN AUDISM, so too is Wakanda NOT engaging in Audism by preventing and/or curing deafness from happening in the first place. The same way there are no cancers, or any other form of sickness naturally occurring in Wakanda doesn't meant that the Wakandan people are inclined toward bigotry against the sick; rather it shows Wakanda's unmatched, unequaled successes in promoting universal health at optimal levels.

"here's a very significant difference between oppression of the deaf and ensuring that deafness, blindness, sickness, etc never occur by NATURALLY preventing and correcting the in vitro imbalances and dysfunctions that lead to deafness AND USING TECHNOLOGY TO RESTORE HEARING, SIGHT, ETC. ONCE IT'S BEEN TAKEN BY OUTSIDE FORCES. " 

 By the definition of audism, that what you are describing is exactly AUDISM.   

I've seen this over and over again, the Deaf community--Deafness is not a disability; they are not broken, Deaf do not view themselves as Disabled by as members of a linguistic minority that has been constantly oppressed by people who can hear to force them to be like the majority.  As far as many in the Deaf Community, it does not need to be fixed; they haven't lost anything--they consider hearing as an unnecessary thing.  If you try to fix them, you're oppressing them.  Basically, if you assume that hearing is better than deaf, that's audism.

I've seen the Deaf refer to attempts to cure Deafness as genocide and even some will go the extreme of calling putting Cochlear Implant on children is child abuse.  (Yes, I'm serious.)

"Some Deaf activists call cochlear implants the audists' tool of cultural genocide that is wiping out the Deaf community."
[https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Audism]  fixed,  wrong link.


Do you that there are many Deaf who are sad when they find out their children can hear?

41
So I was wondering, since I haven't read any of it; if this wasn't T'challa and Wakanda, would this be a good story?

Honestly? To start yes. The first 4 Issues (basically where we the readers and the character don't Know much at all) would be interesting. However, now? Nah it gets to repetitive very quickly. Too many characters getting introduced now that we are supposed to care about or be a big deal but they don't matter cone the end of the issue they debut.

It's quite baffling how an interesting concept like this is so boring


I read the first trade (library copy).  I did enjoy it, but I just don't see how it fits as a Black Panther title.  If this was Wakanda 10K years in the future, or an alternate reality, but it just doesn't fit the 616 universe.  But it is supposed to be happening in Marvel's current time period, right?  The fact that BP has been there for at least 8 years??? It just doesn't fit.

42
I don't mean "eugenics" in that sense. I mean the sense of purposefully developing the Wakandan national populace towards their maximum potential in all things good.


Yeah, but that's the logic of all eugenics programs--Maximum potential.  No one views their eugenics program as oppressive, or evil; they see it as "for the common good", "the betterment of mankind" or "maximum potential."

Did you know that Alexander Graham Bell used to promote the concept that Deaf individuals should not be allowed to marry other Deaf individuals, so to reduce the chance of Deafness being passed on to children. I'm sure he saw it as a good thing for the betterment of mankind, to help children reach their best.  The Deaf Community still views him as an oppressor and evil.   (He was wrong about the premise, too.)

Right, now, if you were to say there are no Deaf individuals in Wakanda, the Deaf Community would label that as Audism (the oppression of the Deaf). 

43

[even though for some stupid reason they keep switching Wakanda's location in Afrika ]:



Due to the various writers/artists assigned to the Black Panther comicbook, MARVEL has switched the location of Wakanda many times for over 50 years in the comicbooks. 

For years, I got the impression that Wakanda was somewhere in the center of the African continent.

Wakanda  now seems to be located in East Africa.


Regarding Wakanda in relation to the other African nations & the Big Blue Marble?

Perhaps, you could pen a world history book of Africa featuring Wakanda for a little hyper-realism fun. 

Don't you know that's intentional! How else do you think they kept the kingdom hidden for so long.  It moves.  They have their own version of the reality stone and periodically they move Wakanda, keeping everyone guessing where it really is. GRIN

44
Next comes the big screen destruction of Wakanda. Much to the delight of a lot of "fine people". No surprise after after disney showed dead black kids in Avengers : Civil War.

Idk if that will happen, brutha. Wakanda seems to have survived Thanos, even though both Shuri and T'Challa were killed by The Snap. And? BP 2 is coming prolly in 2021. Soooo. I really don't think that Wakanda is or will be destroyed. Let's see how it goes.



Besides, they already destroyed Asgard.  And moved the remnant to a "shanty fishing village." (A friend's quote.)  They didn't destroy the city until they were done with new Thor movies.  Destruction of Wakanda probably wouldn't happen until we reach the final BP movie, and it might not happen then either--especially if the same creative crew that put it together writes that final story.

Though, I wouldn't be surprised if they have another "big battle."  Marvel movies do like those big battle scenes.

COSIGN.

We're definitely going to have some big battle scenes ahead, and we're looking at monsta throwdowns in the near future. We mess around and get us THE ULTIMATES in name and mostly in roster onscreen. With the F4 and X-Men coming to Disney? Don'tbe surprised if we see AVX or even more unexpected...AVFX: Avengers vs Fantastic 4 and X-Men. Or some kind of massive multifranchise mashup combining the teams.

You wanna see a big fight? Imagine Silver Surfer and THE GUARDIANS OF THE GALAXY scrappin vs some major intergalactic menace...like the Skrull Empire.

Mess around and see Doom, Malekith and The Grandmaster team up...especially with The Eternals on the horizon. Wouldn't it be absolutely nuts to introduce THE STRANGER in a SILVER SURFER franchise or this here ETERNALS joint to set THE STRANGER up to be a major foe?

You know what's likely to beat all of the team vs team mashups, though? Yep. a multifranchise SECRET INVASION type storyline. That would also give us another humongous Wakanda war scene...essentially SEE WAKANDA AND DIE in the MCU.

And wouldn't it be absolutely friggin crazy to get the first Battleworld with THE BEYONDER or some such coming? And that could herald the return of Steve Rogers as Captain America or The Captain.

And we haven't even touched the kinda fun that Doctor Strange could have. Maybe reintroduce BLADE and DOCTOR VOODOO via a pair of Doctor Strange movies. And Shang Chi movies? Sounds like a good way to bring in Iron Fist, The Punisher ,and pretty much the whole DEFENDERS too.

If Shang-Chi can't do it? Remember the much overlooked and very fun ANT-MAN AND THE WASP team ups aren't going away, and they can bring in good people, too. Maybe Lunella.

If War Machine is on deck, then both Pepper Potts and ReRe Williams have a real opening here. I mean, there's lots of things that even my sleepy brain on a Sunday midafternoon can throw around. And I'm not getting paid millions todream this stuff up. The MCU heads ARE getting millions and even billions to do so. Therefore, I think we can rest assured that the future is in good hands, and we won't see Wakanda butt filleted by the movie variant of the LCBRD.

I wonder about Silver Surfer, because they seemed to have placed Captain Marvel into that role.  Thinking about Endgame; practically every scene she was in, I could see the Silver Surfer in each spot.

45
Next comes the big screen destruction of Wakanda. Much to the delight of a lot of "fine people". No surprise after after disney showed dead black kids in Avengers : Civil War.

Idk if that will happen, brutha. Wakanda seems to have survived Thanos, even though both Shuri and T'Challa were killed by The Snap. And? BP 2 is coming prolly in 2021. Soooo. I really don't think that Wakanda is or will be destroyed. Let's see how it goes.

Besides, they already destroyed Asgard.  And moved the remnant to a "shanty fishing village." (A friend's quote.)  They didn't destroy the city until they were done with new Thor movies.  Destruction of Wakanda probably wouldn't happen until we reach the final BP movie, and it might not happen then either--especially if the same creative crew that put it together writes that final story.

Though, I wouldn't be surprised if they have another "big battle."  Marvel movies do like those big battle scenes.

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