Author Topic: Talking Race: Getting into trouble on othere message boards for even doing so.  (Read 42258 times)

Jenn

  • Guest
they prefer stereotypical images...there was a similar comment recently under BP # 23's comment thread on www.uncannyxmen.net where one said. "......now if BP starts to have lots of imperfections and starts to beat his wife."

Remember when people were talking about one of them having an affair? Preferably BP, of course, because Storm is oh-so-perfect and you know those colored men will screw anything moving.  ::)

Offline D- Ruck

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 675
    • View Profile
Quote
I agree, Bendis wrote the first depiction that I liked.  Even Priest's Cage was shallow to me.  Reggie's brief depiction seemed to stem from Bendis so I liked that as well.  However I disagree that I only want Bendis writing him. I liked Reggie's version alot and think the vernacular flowed a little more naturally.  Sometimes Cage's vernacular under Bendis feels a little forced and inauthentic.

I agree, when he was beating up Purple Man the venacular didn't flow like it when he was in the Panther, I heard his voice from Hudlin alot more than from Bendis when regularly speaking.  But in the Collective arc when he was talking to the media and when he stood up to registration he was straight dope.  I didn't altogether exclude anybody else from writing him, but Bendis definitely set the standard.

 
Quote
Also Bendis married Cage to a white woman  .  While I liked the evolution of their relationship (because Bendis is a good writer) I still have my qualms about it.  For one, I would like to see more Black intraracial marriages.  Also Cage being presented as a man who possesses a strong sense of Black community awareness as well as a strong Black identity, seems to fall short when looking at his wife.  I mean it is not as if it doesn't happen in reality (yes I know it does) but that sort of thing always seems to be an oxymoron (in reality).  Sistas can't get no love? I would have been all over Monica Rambeau or Misty Knight.

Lol, far be it for me what another man wants to share his bed and life with.  Cage found a woman he loved, had a child with her and did the right thing and married her.   He's not afraid of what people would think about his relationship, he knew what he wanted and went after it, and he's not ashamed at all.  IMO that speaks of his strong black identity as much as anything else.  He's in own man, he has no problem with Misty of Monica, it just wasn't in the cards for him.  He aint no coon.
"Playa Hatas

Elevate us

If you Cross Me

You'll Die"

Wise Lebron

Jenn

  • Guest
Cage found a woman he loved, had a child with her and did the right thing and married her.   He's not afraid of what people would think about his relationship, he knew what he wanted and went after it, and he's not ashamed at all.  IMO that speaks of his strong black identity as much as anything else.  He's in own man, he has no problem with Misty of Monica, it just wasn't in the cards for him.  He aint no coon.

Eh, I think that's bunk. I have no problem with IR relationships, but something about Cage's doesn't ring true. It's like they intentionally paired Mr. Too-Black-Too-Strong with a white woman (after having an OOW child from a loveless union, of course!) as some sort of bizarre joke. I like Cage and I like Jessica, but together they make little sense and have no chemistry whatsoever.

Offline JLI Jesse

  • Honorary Wakandan
  • *****
  • Posts: 3788
  • We are men of action. Lies do not become us.
    • View Profile
    • Grab Them By The Pod
But remember, before Cage got together with Jessica, he was pretty much in limbo.  His relationship paved the way for New Avengers, Daredevil, and the Pulse.  He he wasn't paired with Jessica, theres a good chance he wouldn;t be paired with anyone because he wouldn;t be showing up anywhere,

Offline D- Ruck

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 675
    • View Profile
Cage found a woman he loved, had a child with her and did the right thing and married her.   He's not afraid of what people would think about his relationship, he knew what he wanted and went after it, and he's not ashamed at all.  IMO that speaks of his strong black identity as much as anything else.  He's in own man, he has no problem with Misty of Monica, it just wasn't in the cards for him.  He aint no coon.

Eh, I think that's bunk. I have no problem with IR relationships, but something about Cage's doesn't ring true. It's like they intentionally paired Mr. Too-Black-Too-Strong with a white woman (after having an OOW child from a loveless union, of course!) as some sort of bizarre joke. I like Cage and I like Jessica, but together they make little sense and have no chemistry whatsoever.

Well I'm sure haven't read as much as you so I can't say much.  But from what little I read from the Pulse and the new Avengers even I don't see much of a problem with their relationship,  it's nowhere near BP/Storm dynamic.
"Playa Hatas

Elevate us

If you Cross Me

You'll Die"

Wise Lebron

Offline Yaw

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 771
  • Brother Voodoo (Papa Vodu)- The Foundation
    • View Profile
But remember, before Cage got together with Jessica, he was pretty much in limbo.  His relationship paved the way for New Avengers, Daredevil, and the Pulse.  He he wasn't paired with Jessica, theres a good chance he wouldn;t be paired with anyone because he wouldn;t be showing up anywhere,

No I agree with this 100%.  It's sad to me in a way but yes I think his relationship with Jessica has made him more palatable to mainstream tastes.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 10:26:19 am by Yaw »

Jenn

  • Guest
I think his relationship with Jessica has made him more palatable to mainstream tastes.

THAT'S it. I knew I was explaining myself poorly. It's almost like "Look! Here's a kinder, friendly, less 'racist' Luke Cage! He loves white people now! He even married one!" *gags* And the way they went about it? Pathetic.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 10:33:05 am by Jenn »

Offline stanleyballard

  • Honorary Wakandan
  • *****
  • Posts: 1812
    • View Profile
Cage could have been more interesting with a Black woman...and it would have been in continuity of his characterization.   ;)

Question: If Black people don't tell Black history then who will ...White people?  If Blacks don't support Black owned businesses then we will continue to see a decline in our overall employment and ability to effect global economies (read: Africa...a resource rich continent). If Blacks don't love ourselves and marry successfully amongst ourselves then what happends to our culture, language, identity...it becomes HIS-story and everything is westernized and white washed.  That's real.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 11:07:26 am by stanleyballard »

Offline Marvelous

  • HEF FOI
  • Honorary Wakandan
  • *****
  • Posts: 3410
    • View Profile
    • PhotograFX
Cage could have been more interesting with a Black woman...and it would have been in continuity of his characterization.   ;)

How would Cage be seen if he didn't stay with her after her pregnancy.  Would that've been in characterization to him or black people?  ???


"2. IF YOU DON'T READ THE BOOK BUT ARE WILLING TO ARGUE ABOUT IT EITHER YOU ARE:
a) An idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.
b) A liar who is a fan who can't admit it to himself or others."

Jenn

  • Guest
Marrying someone just because they're pregnant is as old a time - and just as stupid. It's an ancient idea rooted in sexism ("OH NOEZ!!11 SHE'S RUINED!"), and it rarely goes well, even after all this time. Cage could've been portrayed as being a good and responsible father to his daughter without marrying some drunk broad that he got pregnant. That's way too "noble Negro" for me. And heaven knows him having a girlfriend AND a babymama would've made him a lot more interesting than he is now.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2007, 11:54:26 am by Jenn »

Offline D- Ruck

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 675
    • View Profile
Quote
Marrying someone just because they're pregnant is as old a time - and just as stupid. It's an ancient idea rooted in sexism ("OH NOEZ!!11 SHE'S RUINED!"), and it rarely goes well, even after all this time. Cage could've been portrayed as being a good and responsible father to his daughter without marrying some drunk broad that he got pregnant. That's way too "noble Negro" for me. And heaven knows him having a girlfriend AND a babymama would've made him a lot more interesting than he is now.

I dunno, to me, Jessica Jones and the unnamed child are side effects to me as far as Cage, they don't make him anymore or less interesting or authentic.  He's a kickass character and this thing with Jessica helped him get some spotlight, no harm no foul?  <ducks>
"Playa Hatas

Elevate us

If you Cross Me

You'll Die"

Wise Lebron

Jenn

  • Guest
No harm, no foul...no point I dunno; I guess after reading a pair as passionate and loving as BP and Storm, Luke and Jessica come up way short. They're buddies. A team. But a husband and wife? Nah.

Offline Marvelous

  • HEF FOI
  • Honorary Wakandan
  • *****
  • Posts: 3410
    • View Profile
    • PhotograFX
I might be mistaken but Cage and Jes' relationship did grow, it wasn't just out of the blue with the nuptials.  It's not about him doing the right thing.  I really think he fell for her in the end.  Jes' was the one that was hesitant, and sorry for getting off topic.   ;)

Alias was one of the best reads this century so far, imho.


"2. IF YOU DON'T READ THE BOOK BUT ARE WILLING TO ARGUE ABOUT IT EITHER YOU ARE:
a) An idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.
b) A liar who is a fan who can't admit it to himself or others."

Offline Moose100

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 253
    • View Profile
Quote
2.) Speaking of authenticity; and I say this with the utmost respect to the creator of these black charactors as they are truly legends..but do you think that whites writing a black character is equal to "comics blackface". ( Hopefully im not being to controversial!! lol) Or is it a matter of a writer being good enough and talented enough to write these black characters authentically.

With me it's always more about the quality of work rather than the ethnicity of the writer.  If a writer is talented and sincere in his depiction of a character then there's no problem at all.   For instance, I was amazed with Bendis's depiction of Cage in the New Avengers.  I don't think I'd want anybody else writing Cage but Bendis.  He displays every facet of Cage's character perfectly, being blackman is a major part of who Cage is, but he brings out the unwavering sense of justice and willingness to take stand against almost anything to do the right thing.  Anyway, I'll shut up, lol.

Hey I feel you there..I loved Bendis' depiction of Cage.  Hopefully the rumors are tryue that hes actually going to pen a solo series sometime in the future!!!!

Offline Yaw

  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 771
  • Brother Voodoo (Papa Vodu)- The Foundation
    • View Profile
No harm, no foul...no point I dunno; I guess after reading a pair as passionate and loving as BP and Storm, Luke and Jessica come up way short. They're buddies. A team. But a husband and wife? Nah.

naw i think they are a loving couple.  From Alias to Pulse to Daredevil to New Avengers, the relationship does grow and blossom.  Bendis did a good job of showing this and Cage's speech in Pulse about why they should get married makes it feel authentic.  In fact I like his speech moreso because it didn't deal the the false illusion of "romantic love" common  in Western society that usually ends in divorce.  That is not why he said they should get married.  It was more practical but still heartfelt.