Author Topic: Contradiction or misunderstanding?  (Read 3351 times)

Offline Zai

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Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« on: August 26, 2016, 06:44:14 pm »
Canon: The heart shaped herb works like a poison for those who are not from royal blood.
Canon: Everyone gets a chance to fight the Black Panther one a year. If they defeat him and pass some test, they become Black Panther.

Then what happens when someone doesnt have royal blood? Like Zuri, for example. They cant eat the heart shaped herb even if they completed the test?
I didnt understand that.

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2016, 09:23:16 am »
Canon: The heart shaped herb works like a poison for those who are not from royal blood.
Canon: Everyone gets a chance to fight the Black Panther one a year. If they defeat him and pass some test, they become Black Panther.

Then what happens when someone doesnt have royal blood? Like Zuri, for example. They cant eat the heart shaped herb even if they completed the test?
I didnt understand that.

Simplest explanation:. Marvel is inconsistent.

Possible in story reason:. The Herb isn't poison, but a gateway to the test by Bast... That is potently fatal.

Or, after 10,000 years, everyone in Wakanda and beyond have some royal blood in them.

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2016, 11:01:24 am »
What really happened is that Hudlin started his Who is the Black Panther story and it was supposed to be out of continuity.

It was liked so much that Marvel made it the new origin for Wakanda and BP and retconed the old one away and Hudlin had to make it work and somewhat gel with past stuff.

From there, its mostly fan theory. The best one is that the Herb puts you before Bast. Bast judges your worthiness. If you aren't worthy, you die.

That kinda gels with past stuff as well. There was multiple mentions in McGregors and Priest stuff about the herb strengthening the bound between the BP and the Panther God. So you can stretch the imagination a bit and say that connection = Basts judgement.

The only time int he history of the HSH where we have seen an adverse reaction is Killmonger though. Spider-Man ate it fine. Apparanetly Zawadi did as well, althought I can't find an on panel reference to her actually taking it. T'challa didn't even know what was about to happen when Killmonger took the Herb... remember, he didn't want him dead because then he became BP by default which was an embarrassment. Hunter seemed to have hinted he knew what was about to happen though. So... was Killmonger judged by Bast and deemed unworthy? If so... why did he not die? He was just put in a deep coma. You are telling me a God couldn't kill him? Maybe the god only put Killmonger in a coma so T'challa could retain his dignity? This is pure fan theory sh*t though.

So, killmonger is the conundrum really. So... you could try and fan theory away Killmonger's getting sick which may be easier than anything else. Maybe the stuff he did to enhance his strength and speed didn't mix well with the HSH and caused the reaction? Maybe Hunter poisoned it and it caused that reaction? Killmonger is the one that stated the line of Bashenga is the only one that could handle it... maybe he was just freaking wrong lol? How would he know but no one in the royal family or close advisers knew?

I've been reading waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much on this lately lol.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2016, 11:19:08 am by MindofShadow »

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #3 on: August 27, 2016, 11:25:12 am »
Another thought

Honestly, the whole "poison" thing is ridiculous. It literally cannot be that "only direct line of Bashenga can eat the herb"

It doesn't even fit Priest's run where it was originated. How can you have these trial by combats which end in the victor getting the herb (if he finishes the right of ascension) and then have it be a rigged contest? I honestly don't know what Priest was thinking there.

Another reason that doesn't make sense is that T'challa was going to allow Kasper to take the herb if he finished the right of ascension. He would not of sentenced Kasper to death like that.

So, Killmonger has to have been wrong. Has to. He either got a bad herb, it mixed weird iwth whatever he did to himself, Hunter poisoned him, out Bast put him in a coma instead of killing him for T'challa's sake.

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #4 on: August 27, 2016, 02:34:52 pm »
What really happened is that Hudlin started his Who is the Black Panther story and it was supposed to be out of continuity.

It was liked so much that Marvel made it the new origin for Wakanda and BP and retconed the old one away and Hudlin had to make it work and somewhat gel with past stuff.

Exactly that.

I'm sure those two theories in the OP will be consolidated at some point, whether by Coates or a future BP writer. But at the moment, it is a result of two popular runs having their own means for one to become a BP.

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #5 on: August 27, 2016, 02:48:50 pm »
And im not gonna blame hudlin either bc priests version of tchsllas ascension to the thrown differs from Avengers vol 1 87 as well.

BP writers keep ignoring sh*t, but hudlin has an actual certifiable reason

Offline Vic Vega

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2016, 08:18:48 am »
Another thought

Honestly, the whole "poison" thing is ridiculous. It literally cannot be that "only direct line of Bashenga can eat the herb"

It doesn't even fit Priest's run where it was originated. How can you have these trial by combats which end in the victor getting the herb (if he finishes the right of ascension) and then have it be a rigged contest? I honestly don't know what Priest was thinking there.

He was probably thinking what prevents Wakandans (or anybody else for that matter) from just...snatching the darn herb and being done with it.


Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2016, 08:30:05 am »
Another thought

Honestly, the whole "poison" thing is ridiculous. It literally cannot be that "only direct line of Bashenga can eat the herb"

It doesn't even fit Priest's run where it was originated. How can you have these trial by combats which end in the victor getting the herb (if he finishes the right of ascension) and then have it be a rigged contest? I honestly don't know what Priest was thinking there.

He was probably thinking what prevents Wakandans (or anybody else for that matter) from just...snatching the darn herb and being done with it.

Well, pre-priest, one could assume that the reason someone couldn't just take it was its remote location (the whole mountain thing) and then mcgregor established it had to be prepared a certain way to reach peak potency.

So, that should have kept J'oe Wakandan from getting any use out of it.

Of course, it doesn't explain why someone like Killmonger couldn't just climb the damn mountain himself lol.

Which is why the Bast thing works best when explaining what the HSH does. J'oe Wakandan would be a nightime snack.

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2016, 08:48:53 am »
Re: Killmonger


That opens up another possible fan theory for Killmonger being the one and only person to suffer negatively from the Herb...

Killmonger skipped all the right of ascension steps except for kicking some wakandan warrior ass. Putting together the various pieces from other runs, most notably McGregor's stuff, maybe part of the right of ascension and tribal ritual would have been properly preparing the herb for someone who wasn't in the line of Bashenga.

By the time it got to T'challa and Shuri, the line had developed such a tolerance for the Herb that they could eat whole roots/leaves without any adverse affect.

Killmonger being a cocky MOFO, would have thought he was strong enough to take the whole herb.

Hunter being a sneaky MOFO is the one that re-itterated that the ceremony was unnecesarry and to just give him the damn Herb.

Fan theories are fun!

Offline Vic Vega

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2016, 09:20:47 am »
Re: Killmonger


That opens up another possible fan theory for Killmonger being the one and only person to suffer negatively from the Herb...

Killmonger skipped all the right of ascension steps except for kicking some wakandan warrior ass. Putting together the various pieces from other runs, most notably McGregor's stuff, maybe part of the right of ascension and tribal ritual would have been properly preparing the herb for someone who wasn't in the line of Bashenga.

By the time it got to T'challa and Shuri, the line had developed such a tolerance for the Herb that they could eat whole roots/leaves without any adverse affect.

Killmonger being a cocky MOFO, would have thought he was strong enough to take the whole herb.

Hunter being a sneaky MOFO is the one that re-itterated that the ceremony was unnecesarry and to just give him the damn Herb.

Fan theories are fun!

When you put it that way, you have to wonder how smart Killmonger really is, if the dude just downs @##$% he found in the woods just 'cause somebody told him to...

Dude didn't even bother to peel it or nothing.

Hunter's like: "Go ahead Brah, just chomp that @#$$".




Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Contradiction or misunderstanding?
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2016, 10:22:00 am »
Hunter Be like