Author Topic: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?  (Read 2801 times)

Offline The Wakandan

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BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« on: September 18, 2016, 07:40:16 am »
Considered putting this on the big Coates run thread, but felt the topic was different and important enough to have its own thread.

As we all know by now, one of the things at stake in this run is the monarchy itself. Prior to the start of this run, Coates expressed his initial opinion of the monarchy: why would an advanced civilization as Wakanda have a monarchy? His writing so far has shown various parties being at odds with the monarchy.

We've already have the obvious players against it in Tetu, Zenzi, and Stane.

The MAs and their followers are a bit of a wildcard, but its safe to say at this point that they would support a change of the guard, under the right conditions.

Changamire has been advocating for democracy and appears to get gaining some support, including overseas.

There are other factors at play. Though the Wakandan people haven't openly revolted, #1 has made it clear that, internally, resentment towards the monarchy has been building up, due in large part because of previous events.

It's still somewhat vague at the moment, but the seemingly common thread in the stories in Shuri's journey are various lessons about leadership: connecting and being one with the people, patience, fortitude, etc. Coates said that Shuri will be a "different" character once she comes back from the Djalia. I suspect that difference will be on display vis-a-vis her approach and perspective in governing.

All in all, the in-story seeds of potential change in Wakandan governance (as well as Coates' personal opinions on the issue) are there and could result in a new style of governing that doesn't follow the traditional monarchy model.

Thus the question: what type of government will Wakanda have once #12 concludes? Will the monarchy remain as is, or will there be something different?

When the run started, I felt that Wakanda would transition towards a constitutional monarchy similar to the UK model. T'Challa is still king and the monarchy is still a highly influential part of Wakanda, but it no longer holds as much authority as it once did. A newly-formed Wakandan parliament--which will succeed the Wakandan council seen in the Hudlin run--will have the most amount of power and will be made up of elected members, including a prime minister.

However, I wouldn't be surprised if Wakanda ended up going with a modified version of a Diarchy that includes a strong parliament consisting of elected members. The monarchy stays around and has authority, only equaled by parliament. In case of a disagreement, the queen mother and/or an appropriate third party mediates the disagreement. I feel such a setup will be a compromise that allows Coates to get what he wants while those hoping that T'Challa is still king with authority get what they want.

Example:

T'Challa is King. Shuri is the co-ruler (helps address the gender topic that Coates pushed this season).

A new democratically-elected parliament is formed (addresses Coates desire for a more democratic voice in Wakanda).

The monarchy and parliament are somewhat equal in stature (addresses Coates desire for a more democratic voice).

Ramonda and/or a selected third party served as occasional mediators between the monarchy and parliament.

It's not perfect or my preferred choice. I prefer that things stay as is. But I would much rather go with this than the constitutional monarchy route, or an outright democracy.

So, I turn the question to you all. Do you think the monarchy will survive as is? If not, what changes do you think will occur?

Sidenote: I understand many of us would prefer for the monarchy to stay as is. As I mentioned, I do too. That said, change is on the horizon, whether we like it or not. The question is, what change do you think Wakandan government will encounter?
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 07:17:26 pm by The Wakandan »

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #1 on: September 18, 2016, 07:56:30 am »
I think it will be an altered Monarchy, but with Shuri at the helm.  I think he is leading us with sentiments like "your heart's not in it", "I'm a scientist", and even his interview where he said his BP is more superhero than King to the place of T'Challa giving up the crown.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 07:59:00 am by KIP LEWIS »

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #2 on: September 18, 2016, 08:40:53 am »
I think it will be an altered Monarchy, but with Shuri at the helm.  I think he is leading us with sentiments like "your heart's not in it", "I'm a scientist", and even his interview where he said his BP is more superhero than King to the place of T'Challa giving up the crown.

I thought about that, but I don't think it'll happen. T'Challa just got the crown back. I would be very surprise if Coates went that route.

Not to mention, T'Challa at the moment seem determined to keep the monarchy around. He may have acknowledged the appeal of a potential democracy as far as Changamire's supporters are concerned, but he appears to have no intention of stepping down, at least for now. Things might change along the way, of course.

The co-rule + parliament thing, imho, is a great workaround that fulfills Coates need for more overt female representation of the BP verse (I'm very aware that women have been, imho, well represented in the BP-verse. I'm speaking from Coates' perspective), while allowing T'Challa to be King and still be able to go out there and do some "scientist" stuff, knowing that Wakanda is in good hands when he happens to be away.

Offline Blanks

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #3 on: September 18, 2016, 03:55:25 pm »
Hm. Here are some of the possibilities I have thought over the past few weeks....

I'm guessing, to keep with some movie connections, since BP just got introduced into the Movieverse, they will keep the Crown around, if only as anything as seen as tradition, kind of like Britian. It's there, it has influence, but what does it actually do these days other than be a figurehead for the 'old days'?

The Crown will always have a seat at the table, but will no longer be at the seat of the table. And as for however sits in the seat of the crown, family linage will have a say perhaps? T'Challa, King since he is living. Shuri, if he dies, will step up as Queen, unless, T'Challa has a heir, and so on and so on, unless he reluinished his hold on the crown?

Him remaining King has to be something Marvel has a say in, to keep in line with the movies. They can say what they want about the movies not influencing the comics, but that's a soft lie. Civil War 2, coming out the same time Civil War the movie drops anyone?

Shuri, restored, will probably be one of several new government bodies to make up this new 'democractic' government. Maybe even the First Lady of the new government, with new 'awakened' knowledge that Coates is shoehorning into Wakanda's past.

Thus, this makes the role of BP, spoke of like that in the movie, a guardian role of Wakanda. And T'Challa, as we know, is the current BP, may have to undergo a normal 'challenge' from other Wakandan Warriors for the Mantle of the Panther.

This will allow T'Challa to be the 'Wondering' science-hero-king. A king with no real duties other than be the figurehead of the once most powerful, technological nation on the planet, now home just to normal any other African rape camps, who allows his younger Sister to run the show, fulfilling all of the Agenda's this writer set out to fulfill.

Damn Coates.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2016, 04:03:40 pm by Blanks »

Offline Booshman

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #4 on: September 18, 2016, 11:37:21 pm »
Blah-Nehisi Coates will probably just dissolve the leadership to something like some past African Kingdoms. Where the ruling family makes all the laws, but there's a council of "Kingmakers" who are put in place to make sure that they don't do something bad. And who have the power to usurp or at least veto them if they do.

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #5 on: September 19, 2016, 04:37:51 am »
Perfect World: Leave sh*t alone, no one cares about government bureaucracy in comics.


Almost Perfect World:

Shuri/T'challa Diarchy. Shuri handles domestic affairs. T'challa handles worldly affairs.

Restore the Tribal Council or Parliament. Instead of being "elders," the seats are elected by each tribe. Give it the power Gillis mini had (they basically had all the power once the spirit abandoned T'challa. Update that slightly to work with other runs). Perhaps if this Council is unified enough, they actually can over rule the Diarchy. Similar to the US where if a certain percentage of the Congress agrees, they can overrule a presidential veto.

The Black Panther Mantle is once again like Priests and the MCU... separate than King. Shuri is no longer a Black Panther but becomes something else (whatever the journey she is on is) which still gives her enhanced abilities as well.

Or something lol.


I really think its gonna end up something like England, perhaps with slightly more kingly power, and Changamire is gonna end up being a significant player in the government.

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #6 on: September 19, 2016, 01:51:09 pm »
Perfect World: Leave sh*t alone, no one cares about government bureaucracy in comics.

Ideal solution to me as well, but not the cards we're dealt with, it appears.


Quote
Almost Perfect World:

Shuri/T'challa Diarchy. Shuri handles domestic affairs. T'challa handles worldly affairs.

Restore the Tribal Council or Parliament. Instead of being "elders," the seats are elected by each tribe. Give it the power Gillis mini had (they basically had all the power once the spirit abandoned T'challa. Update that slightly to work with other runs). Perhaps if this Council is unified enough, they actually can over rule the Diarchy. Similar to the US where if a certain percentage of the Congress agrees, they can overrule a presidential veto.

The Black Panther Mantle is once again like Priests and the MCU... separate than King. Shuri is no longer a Black Panther but becomes something else (whatever the journey she is on is) which still gives her enhanced abilities as well.

Or something lol.

I would be down for that. Coates gets what he wants, while keeping some of the cool elements of T'Challa and the BP mythos via the monarchy. Not perfect, but def workable. Many storytelling opportunities too, especially with religion being a topic in season 2.

Quote
I really think its gonna end up something like England, perhaps with slightly more kingly power, and Changamire is gonna end up being a significant player in the government.

I really hope the UK model isn't used. Besides downgrading cool elements of the mythos, imho, it's...too easy. A bit too obvious, imo.

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #7 on: September 19, 2016, 02:52:24 pm »
I kinda miss the days of Priest. Weird ass tribal challenges with their weird rules and stuff.

I miss the "tribal" element of Black Panther Mythos. Outside of Who is the Black Panther, you didn't get much of it in Hudlin's run as well. And none of it in Liss's run obviously.

I just wish Wakanda as a whole remains... different. Retains some of the "comic book tribal" warrior stuff. I don't want it sanitized to American or England politics. It is comic books after all. A little fantasy is A-ok.

What I want is for it to be shown that the royal blood line to be so great, so strong, that the Monarchy exists because they are simply THE BEST wakanda can offer.

And if you are goign to change the system... it does need to be addressed with the dang Goddess hanging out in Wakanda. But, if he is touching on religion S2, maybe that will be touched on here a bit as well.


Offline The Wakandan

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #8 on: September 19, 2016, 04:00:23 pm »
I kinda miss the days of Priest. Weird ass tribal challenges with their weird rules and stuff.

I miss the "tribal" element of Black Panther Mythos. Outside of Who is the Black Panther, you didn't get much of it in Hudlin's run as well. And none of it in Liss's run obviously.

I just wish Wakanda as a whole remains... different. Retains some of the "comic book tribal" warrior stuff. I don't want it sanitized to American or England politics. It is comic books after all. A little fantasy is A-ok.

What I want is for it to be shown that the royal blood line to be so great, so strong, that the Monarchy exists because they are simply THE BEST wakanda can offer.

And if you are goign to change the system... it does need to be addressed with the dang Goddess hanging out in Wakanda. But, if he is touching on religion S2, maybe that will be touched on here a bit as well.

Pretty much agree with the post, but especially the bold.

One thing that made Wakanda rather cool, imho, was how different its government structure functioned. The rulership itself is rather straightforward, but when you include the BP being different from the King/Queen (in some cases), the parliament/council, the many chieftains, and the traditions that entwine all of those parties, it results in a very unique dynamic one wouldn't see often in comic books.

How cool is it, for example, that by Wakandan law, someone can flat out challenge the BP on the spot to a duel for his position. Doesn't matter the reason (I think). The stakes are even higher if said BP is the ruler of Wakanda as well. Plus, the yearly challenge for the BP position. That's quite unique and reflects Wakanda's warrior culture.

Wakandan adopting a western-style system (US, UK, or the like) makes Wakanda lose some of its mystic imho. It's uniqueness. It almost becomes no different than a lot of developed countries in the world, including the MU.

As for the monarchy being the best Wakanda has to offer...well, the monarchy did get Wakanda as far as it did, well ahead of its peers. That has to count for something. It would be a mistake to discard it altogether, imho. I mean, who honestly could've done better against Doom's schemes in Doomwar, Namor's attack of Wakanda, Thanos' initial invasionI s, and then the events of TRO? Not to mention, it was a member of the monarchy that managed to bring everyone back, after all.

I do suspect, when its all said and done, that there will be some merging of western-style governing and the monarchy system. Perhaps the modifed Diarchy system with a strong parliament, or just the monarchy and parliament being at a equal playing field in terms of authority. But I would def be disappointed if we end up with a democracy or a constitutional monarchy. Would almost feel like a downgrade to be honest.

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: BP Predictions: The Fate of the Wakandan Monarchy?
« Reply #9 on: September 23, 2016, 08:24:03 pm »
Another theory, a small adjustment to my prediction:

T'Challa is King. No co-ruler.

New Wakandan parliament is formed. Members are democratically elected. Parliament's speaker is Changamire. Parliament balances out monarchy.

In case of deadlock, appointed third party mediates.