Author Topic: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]  (Read 10569 times)

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #30 on: September 15, 2016, 04:45:57 am »
Monarchies thrived in Europe and not Africa so Coates challenge to this actually brings The Black Panther to a true pro black or African style of ruling.  Feel his stories have been complex and rather ambitious - he is definitely willing to take risks and shift as needed shown by the fact T'Challa is clearly front and center now.  Shuri is being developed steadily as the story progresses- more fully fleshed out than before.  Coates has a vision and level of skill that is giving each issue a better tone and pacing.

Um...what?

Right off the bat, the Benin Empire (which existed for several centuries) disagrees with that. It was somewhat of a constitutional Monarchy, since the ruling family was kept in check by its council, but it was still a monarchy.

How about the Pharaohs of Egypt?  That was pure control by one man.  (And doesn't Wakanda's origins reach into Egypt?)

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #31 on: September 15, 2016, 04:51:55 am »


Your prediction of the upcoming issues seem sound though. The real question may be what happens to the monarchy at issues 11 and 12.

I don't know. I have no idea. I don't think T'challa will be the sole king.

He may have the title, but not the ability to use it as a weapon as he did in Priest's run. It will be nerfed for sure. When Namor ges back, he will just start laughing at him.

I mentioned the Sparta model elsewhere, which with mild modifications, would work best IMO. Gives the people more power but not so much that it 100% nerfs what it means to be king.

What I don't want is a pure democracy and the BP title becomes a "protector only" type of a title. I don't want T'challa to have someone who can boss him around essentially. That woudl open up SOME story telling possibilities (new president or whatever wants T'challa to take out someone who T'challa does not want to) but that just seems to tread on Captain America territory.

So idk... IMO, the most logical conclusion and the best for the future of the franchise is that T'challa and Shuri rule, and after all this the Wakandan's realize how blessed they are to have such strong, powerful leaders blessed by a God. But I find that 100% unlikely... something is changing for sure.

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #32 on: September 15, 2016, 05:53:52 am »


Your prediction of the upcoming issues seem sound though. The real question may be what happens to the monarchy at issues 11 and 12.

I don't know. I have no idea. I don't think T'challa will be the sole king.

He may have the title, but not the ability to use it as a weapon as he did in Priest's run. It will be nerfed for sure. When Namor ges back, he will just start laughing at him.

I mentioned the Sparta model elsewhere, which with mild modifications, would work best IMO. Gives the people more power but not so much that it 100% nerfs what it means to be king.

What I don't want is a pure democracy and the BP title becomes a "protector only" type of a title. I don't want T'challa to have someone who can boss him around essentially. That woudl open up SOME story telling possibilities (new president or whatever wants T'challa to take out someone who T'challa does not want to) but that just seems to tread on Captain America territory.

So idk... IMO, the most logical conclusion and the best for the future of the franchise is that T'challa and Shuri rule, and after all this the Wakandan's realize how blessed they are to have such strong, powerful leaders blessed by a God. But I find that 100% unlikely... something is changing for sure.

Agreed. The way things are going, there is a strong chance that a change in government is in the horizon, not to mention that Coates himself has issues on Wakanda having a monarchy in the first place.

I remember Ezyo and I discussing if Wakanda would end up with a modified Diarchy system that is similar to what you are proposing: T'Challa and Shuri are co-rulers with more specified tasks that matches who they are, and the tribal council representing all of the Tribes/regions are a democratically elected body who has much more influence this time around. The council for example can serve as a check to the co-rulers in certain cases.

I feel that such a system will give Coates what he wants in terms of the people having a much bigger voice in Wakandan governance and reenforcing Wakanda as a more equal society gender wise (Coates perception, not mine) by having Shuri as a co-ruler with Authority.

Meanwhile, the longtime fans and like-minded individuals get a lot of what they want: the monarchy is still around. The monarchy still has a lot of authority. T'Challa himself is still king with official authority, perhaps the highest in the land still, save the co-ruler. He's still a head of state with all the perks that comes with it and can use them in stories focused outside of Wakanda, if needed.

It's not perfect and I'd much prefer that things stay the way they are, but change will happen whether I want to or not. Given the choice, I would much rather have the modified Diarchy plan or MoS's proposal, rather than a full-fledged democracy or a constitutional monarchy, which could definitely happen.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2016, 05:56:06 am by The Wakandan »

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #33 on: September 15, 2016, 06:04:12 am »
I imagine Changamire being voted some sort of prime minister of sorts and being a pain in T'challa's ass over the next 5 years

Offline The Wakandan

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #34 on: September 15, 2016, 08:12:11 am »
I imagine Changamire being voted some sort of prime minister of sorts and being a pain in T'challa's ass over the next 5 years

Changamire as prime minister? Lol, good lord.

I see some storytelling opportunities in that.

Offline Ezyo

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #35 on: September 15, 2016, 08:16:01 am »
I imagine Changamire being voted some sort of prime minister of sorts and being a pain in T'challa's ass over the next 5 years




I can see that happening, or something with the MA. Which sends the message, act out and you could get a promotion.

I would like a Diarchy system if it comes down to it with T'Challa and Shuri co leading, of they dispute Queen Mother Ramonda acts as a mediator, and if a decision Still can't be made, a democracy like council can weigh in and vote, and they act as the voice of the citizens. Even if the monarch stayed the same it think it would be good to give Shuri done form of authority so that When T'Challa is not in Wakanda, she can make decisions so these annoying coups can die off for awhile


Offline The Wakandan

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #36 on: September 15, 2016, 08:54:47 am »
I imagine Changamire being voted some sort of prime minister of sorts and being a pain in T'challa's ass over the next 5 years




LOL!

Quote
I can see that happening, or something with the MA. Which sends the message, act out and you could get a promotion.


Hmm, good point there. I do wonder what will happen to them in the end.

Quote
I would like a Diarchy system if it comes down to it with T'Challa and Shuri co leading, of they dispute Queen Mother Ramonda acts as a mediator, and if a decision Still can't be made, a democracy like council can weigh in and vote, and they act as the voice of the citizens. Even if the monarch stayed the same it think it would be good to give Shuri done form of authority so that When T'Challa is not in Wakanda, she can make decisions so these annoying coups can die off for awhile [/size][/b]


I forgot to include Ramonda into the decision making process. Good idea.
[/quote]

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #37 on: September 15, 2016, 10:19:08 am »
I imagine Changamire being voted some sort of prime minister of sorts and being a pain in T'challa's ass over the next 5 years

Changamire as prime minister? Lol, good lord.

I see some storytelling opportunities in that.

I think i'd forgive Coates for everything to see T'challa just straight back hand Changamire

Offline Blanks

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #38 on: September 16, 2016, 04:33:49 pm »
So. Issue6.

 These Fenris Twins, are they X-villains? I remember them from the Ultimate X-Men comic (the only X-Men brand I could stomach). Did Coates really write X-Crap into the Black Panther comic, X-villians as the ones behind some of the major ills behind Wakanda?

I mean, we all knew these guy really loves the X-Men. He said so, and said he wasn't excited about BP. Buuuuuuuuut no! Couldn't just just BP lore. Shove it more with X-lore. Cause the X-fans love Panther so much.

Or maybe this was his way of trying to ease out some of the damage he's done? I dunno, but Coates is slowly, slowly moving into the spot that Mayberry holds for me as the most damaging thing to happen to BP.

Offline Ezyo

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2016, 04:43:18 pm »
How T'Challas character should of started from the beginning of thrseries

http://www.cbr.com/black-panther-7-3/


Offline Blanks

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #40 on: September 16, 2016, 05:03:39 pm »
Little to late I would say.

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2016, 07:04:59 am »
So. Issue6.

 These Fenris Twins, are they X-villains? I remember them from the Ultimate X-Men comic (the only X-Men brand I could stomach). Did Coates really write X-Crap into the Black Panther comic, X-villians as the ones behind some of the major ills behind Wakanda?

I mean, we all knew these guy really loves the X-Men. He said so, and said he wasn't excited about BP. Buuuuuuuuut no! Couldn't just just BP lore. Shove it more with X-lore. Cause the X-fans love Panther so much.

Or maybe this was his way of trying to ease out some of the damage he's done? I dunno, but Coates is slowly, slowly moving into the spot that Mayberry holds for me as the most damaging thing to happen to BP.

Fernis Twins might have started in X-Men, but they float around.  they are really Hydra/Nazi white supremists villains.

Offline Blanks

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2016, 11:32:00 am »
Ok. I was wondering. I'm not to up to date on Old school X stuff (honestly, nor do I care especially after seeing how racist the X office was in the past and how the X fans can still be). So they were created in X-Nen, but became villains that migrated around in other books. Okay. Less rage.

Not by much. But it's still there, mind you, lol.

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2016, 12:04:49 pm »
Ok. I was wondering. I'm not to up to date on Old school X stuff (honestly, nor do I care especially after seeing how racist the X office was in the past and how the X fans can still be). So they were created in X-Nen, but became villains that migrated around in other books. Okay. Less rage.

Not by much. But it's still there, mind you, lol.

The worst part is they are lame.  The only staying power they have is they are Baron Strucker's kids. 
« Last Edit: September 17, 2016, 12:59:34 pm by KIP LEWIS »

Offline Blanks

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Re: Black Panther #6 SPOILERS and Discussion [spoilers on post 17]
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2016, 12:43:18 pm »
That is worse. Wakanda being overan by wack discarded X-villains. Ugh. And Coates is staying on for a second season.....