Poll

Should the MCU Recast T'Challa the Black Panther

Yes, for an actor who will further the Black Panther tradition started by Chadwick Boseman
8 (88.9%)
No, because there is no MCU Black Panther without Chadwick Boseman.
0 (0%)
Too soon for me to say.
1 (11.1%)

Total Members Voted: 9

Author Topic: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - Redjack Speaks  (Read 75634 times)

Offline Ture

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - NEW Redjack Speaks!
« Reply #360 on: July 13, 2022, 10:04:26 pm »

Redjack

Quote
it's hard because, IMO at least, all of everyone writing and drawing these things is a fan too. But we don't own them and we're never driving the car without the Hand of Marvel (or DC) and whatever the company wants for the franchise (sometimes not actually told to us) on the wheel too.

I had actually written out a couple of lines of what I wanted to do for T'Challa and Shuri here in this post but I scrubbed it because I still have a tiny glimmer of hope I'll get to write some of it, some way, some day.

But, based on what the company obviously wants (nothing gets published they don't want) I'm pretty sure my pitches wouldn't fly. What I'm hoping for is to get to do a few more out-of-continuity one-shots or mini series that don't connect to whatever's going on in the main book. Not knocking whatever another writer's doing but none of it, for the last few years, is anywhere near what I'd do.

I do feel bothered by that sometimes (which is odd, considering how long I've been doing this job. You'd think I'd be more stoic about it.) but, end of the day, it may take several massive failures, both in the comics and in the movies for the company to rethink their aims for this part of the marvel universe.

Not sure I see either of those things happening.

Glad you're digging Blood Syndicate. #3 is going to be sick.


Quote
Maybe Storm. MAYBE.

otherwise, the best you'll get is a black female lead on a team book.

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Originally Posted by DigiCom View Post
Have you ever considered pitching a consistent What-If? Sort of like what Leah Williams did with her What-If: Magik and Doctor Strange: The End?

No but I did float the idea of continuing the PANTHER'S QUEST universe in comic book form with me as the writer. Hard pass.



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Offline Ture

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - NEW Redjack Speaks!
« Reply #361 on: July 22, 2022, 09:37:01 pm »

Redjack
Quote
I think WS only ever fought Cap for about five minutes with Cap going full out. After the big reveal Cap was holding back in every fight because he was trying to save Bucky. By contrast, WS was going for the kill in every fight, every time.

WS is a second stringer compaired to cap and only gets over on him because Cap's not trying too kill anybody.

Cap and T'Challa are EQUAL as fighters and as enhanced humans. The difference between them is T'Challa WILL go for the kill stroke when he deems it necessary.

Any imbalance in their abilities you see in the movies that favors WS is because the movies aren't ever about putting a Black guy over a white guy if there's any way to avoid that. And there's usually a way.

Ant Man beat up Falcon.

Quote
As I said. The movies will never let a black guy be better than a white guy if they can avoid it. Equal is the best you'll get most of the time. The only white guys who are worse than black guys are SO much worse than the black guy that it's not even a fight. Check out Ross (joke character) and Klaw (joke villain). Contrast them ith their comic book counterparts. Well, Ross was always kind of a joke.

Quote
Well, that presupposes the Dora are regular humans. Remember, when it seemed there might be a conflict between the Widow (an enhanced being) and Ayo, a Dora, T'Challa was amused meaning he ASSUMES a Dora victory against an enhanced human. The Widow is basically the Winter Soldier without the bionics.

If there were no super beings on earth, they would be considered super beings. Wakandans are all (IMO) apex human specimens and the Dora are the best of them. The only superior fighter in the Kingdom would be the Black Panther him or herself.

IOW: Showing the Dora, so far, has been correct. T'CHALLA'S battles skills fluctuate depending on who he's fighting and who the film makers want to show as better. BP = CAP. WS is second tier WITH his arm. Without it? He wouldn't be able to take Iron Fist or Shang Chi, the Hand or any Dora Milaje.



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Offline Ture

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - NEW Redjack Speaks!
« Reply #362 on: July 24, 2022, 08:02:35 am »

Redjack

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Wakanda is an African utopia.

The Black Panther is its ruler.

There has not been a tyrannical ruler in Wakanda in living memory.

The end.
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Offline supreme illuminati

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - NEW Redjack Speaks!
« Reply #363 on: July 25, 2022, 06:13:32 pm »

Redjack

Quote
Wakanda is an African utopia.

The Black Panther is its ruler.

There has not been a tyrannical ruler in Wakanda in living memory.

The end.



There has not been a tyrannical ruler in Wakanda EVER. The very concept of Wakanda? Eliminates tyranny.

I agree with RedJack. And I'm supporting Blood Syndicate.
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Offline Ture

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'Marvel Studios’ Black Panther: Dreams of Wakanda' Book Sets Release Date For Next Month

BY LACY LONG

The book was written by contributors to the 2018 film 'Black Panther' and gives an in-depth behind-the-scenes look at art, fashion, analyses, & more.



The upcoming Marvel Studios’ Black Panther: Dreams of Wakanda book will be released on September 6. The book will explore the cultural impact of the Black Panther movie and will feature commentary on a variety of topics, from fashion to representation, from the creators, writers, and comic legends behind the story.

Along with beautiful original art illustrations, an example of the content in the book includes input from costume designer Ruth E. Carter, who takes readers through her Afrofuturistic designs. Writer Tre Johnson talks about the writing process and metaphoric qualities of vibranium. Author Yona Harvey’s commentary deals with the film’s reception and impact on audiences across the African diaspora. Last but not least, journalist Hannah Giorgis discusses Black Panther’s soundtrack and how it fits into the sonic portraits of Blackness overall.

Marvel’s Black Panther was the first of its kind to feature a superhero protagonist of African descent. The film, based on the comics of the same name, follows T’Challa (Chadwick Boseman), or Black Panther, who takes on the duty of King of Wakanda after his father dies. However, things take a turn as his cousin N’Jadaka (Micheal B. Jordan), or Killmonger, challenges T’Challa for the crown with the intention to change the isolationist principles that Wakanda has held for generations and with the country’s technological advances, begin a global revolution.

The film brought a refreshing uniqueness to the usual superhero vs. villain stories of previous Marvel films as each character had grey areas of morality. The aesthetics and designs of the characters were inspired by the traditional looks of various tribes and cultures in Africa. It showed that audiences were interested in more than the usual white protagonist and that people of color have a place in the Marvel Universe.

Disney also has its own event planned in celebration of Dreams of Wakanda’s release. The company has partnered with Penguin Random House to donate books to First Book and Books for Africa. The total value Disney plans to donate to First Book totals approximately $1M - not a bad gain for a great cause! For those who aren’t familiar with the organization, First Book is the leading nonprofit organization that aids in educational equity, basic needs, and more, in underserved communities.

Penguin Random House is donating some of their published titles to Books for Africa; the donation will total approximately $100K - again, not a bad gain for a great cause. Books for Africa was founded to end the book famine in Africa, and its sole mission is to collect, sort, and ship books, computers, and other educational resources to Africa.

full article:
https://collider.com/black-panther-dreams-of-wakanda-release-date/

I wonder if any of the contributors will comment on the current affairs concerning the killing off of T'Challa the Black Panther? You know, because the Black Panther movie was the first of its kind to feature an Afrakan superhero protagonist. A film, based on the comics of the same name a film about T’Challa the Black Panther. Just wondering.




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Offline Emperorjones

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Exclusive: Black Panther: Wakanda Forever: The Courage to Dream Introduces an Inspiring New Hero to Our Favorite Universe

http://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/exclusive-black-panther-wakanda-forever-140000118.html

Offline Ture

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True indeed Emperorjones.



I saw this posted on The Root site this morning. They're really going all in on the girls gotta have Wakanda. Apparently these writers not only want to assassinate T'Challa, they want to evict him. Check out this other article.


Why Black Panther 2 Must Move the Franchise Beyond T'Challa to Wakanda
https://www.cbr.com/black-panther-2-challenge-honors-tchalla-balances-wakanda-mcu/

My response remains the same.

First off, Recast T'Challa the Black Panther.

Second,

Miss me with the variant T'Challa being our only hope for seeing T'Challa the Black Panther in cinema. Variants are just that, variations from the original. Marvel can deliver all the variants they want but without the original what do they merit other than being a substitution. Cinematically speaking if MCU T'Challa the Black Panther has made transition then he should become King of the Wakandan Dead. This presents an opportunity to show T'Challa the Black Panther going on a quest in the afterlife to become king once again.





T'Challa the Black Panther's trials and challenges in the Wakanda of ancestors and ancestresses could showcase untapped narratives and story followups. He could meet, confer and contest with previous historical Black Panthers. Via sacred ritual T'Challa the Black Panther and Shuri could commune and visit one another. Through some twisted sorcery Klaw could manifest as his energy being thus presenting another foe to vanquish.

His arch adversary could once again be Killmonger and his advisor Zuri. Not to mention that his father T'Chaka is there as is Killmonger's dad N'Joba. No wonder there aren't any men in Black Panther Wakanda Forever they're all dead. I could build a conspiracy theory around that but the HEF faithful can do that for themselves.

The potential love interest would be staggering. T'Challa the Black Panther being involved with historical Wakandan women would unleash a floodgate of stories. T'Challa the Black Panther could revisit the original Dora Milaje concept when there were only two and they were meant to be betrothed to the king.

T'Challa the Black Panther - King of the Dead is the way to go forward. It can be introduced in Black Panther 3 and made into a Disney+ drama, fantasy series. This way everybody wins. The woke get their female driven Wakanda Forever narrative led by Shuri and other guest stars. The faithful fans and enthusiasts get T'Challa the Black Panther as king, genius, master tactician and strategist, mystic and a man who finds love and romance with some very interesting Wakandan women. It honors Chadwick Boseman by having the cinematic character he worked so hard to bring to life all while heroically suffering the ravages of cancer live on. While both character and actor have died this allows them both to be immortalized and live in a new way and continue to inspire generations to come.


1854966


And third,

If T'Challa is to die by being killed in battle (ridiculously unnecessary) or from injury or succumb to illness (adding further insult) the entire lineup from Endgame had better show up for the funeral. Notable standouts and conversations should be heard taking place in T'Challa the Black Panther's Techno Jungle.



Old man Cap - He was the most honorable and forgiving man I've ever met.



M'Baku - He proved himself the most capable leader of Wakanda. He spared my life and we became brothers in arms.



Bucky - He offered me sanctuary when there was no place left for me to go.



Sam Wilson - Shuri told me it was T'Challa who designed, built and gifted me these wings and uniform.



Namor - We first met during the annual combat trials hosted by our respective kingdoms. He best me on several occasions. Once, I am ashamed to say, even under water.



Hawkeye - He made beating me look easy. Now I don't feel so bad.



Okoye - He defeated Killmonger when myself and several Doras could not. Quiet as it is kept, he was the greatest warrior of Wakanda.



Ayo to the Winter Soldier -  It was T'Challa who designed your new arm with the disarming protocols. Though reluctant to use it, he even developed a kill switch for Vision.



Shuri - Few know that I got the idea for my lab from this, his secret techno jungle. He was just a boy, much younger than me when he designed and built Baba's new Panther habit here. T'Challa upgraded the design for himself some years later. He designed and built the first royal talon fighter. T'Challa was a true polymath and with all that he always let me shine, he was that humble. Never needing approval or seeking applause. I stand tall because I stand on his shoulders.

These conversations take place in the Ancestral Realm.



Zuri to T'Chaka - I've yet to greet T'Challa.



Killmonger - He is hiding from me. We have some unfinished business.



T'Chaka - I think your business will have to wait quite some time.

And this conversation occurs Nowhere.



Bast - My regrets for your family and friend's sorrow. I pulled you from their spacetime line to prepare you for Kang and the Secret War to come.



T'Challa - So shall it be.


PUT SOME, NO, MUCH RESPECT ON HIS NAME AND TRULY HONOR AND PAY HOMAGE TO T'CHALLA THE BLACK PANTHER!


1862687


The courage to dream is something Black Panther comic book writers remain in search of as fans and enthusiasts suffer their nightmares.



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Offline Ezyo

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Just so we're clear. We are going to remove T'Challa the black panther from his own franchise, ya know, in honor of Chad, then we will start creating a bunch of female characters, really just go all on and skew what used to be a pretty balanced cast, pushing Black boys out and tell them to sit down and let Black girls take it from here

Then we will try and slowly shift from "Its a mantle" and "it was always about Wakanda" to "It was Always about the women of Wakanda" and "It was always about Shuri, Okoye and the Doras"  and then completely transition away from T'Challa like abd bury him with Chad... Out of respect for him of course.

Offline Emperorjones

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Just so we're clear. We are going to remove T'Challa the black panther from his own franchise, ya know, in honor of Chad, then we will start creating a bunch of female characters, really just go all on and skew what used to be a pretty balanced cast, pushing Black boys out and tell them to sit down and let Black girls take it from here

Then we will try and slowly shift from "Its a mantle" and "it was always about Wakanda" to "It was Always about the women of Wakanda" and "It was always about Shuri, Okoye and the Doras"  and then completely transition away from T'Challa like abd bury him with Chad... Out of respect for him of course.


Yep, and when this fails in the comics (and perhaps at the box office too), black males will be blamed.

Offline supreme illuminati

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Just so we're clear. We are going to remove T'Challa the black panther from his own franchise, ya know, in honor of Chad, then we will start creating a bunch of female characters, really just go all on and skew what used to be a pretty balanced cast, pushing Black boys out and tell them to sit down and let Black girls take it from here

Then we will try and slowly shift from "Its a mantle" and "it was always about Wakanda" to "It was Always about the women of Wakanda" and "It was always about Shuri, Okoye and the Doras"  and then completely transition away from T'Challa like abd bury him with Chad... Out of respect for him of course.


Yep, and when this fails in the comics (and perhaps at the box office too), black males will be blamed.



Sounds like an excellent argument for us to monetize our own incredibly rich, unsurpassed stories, folklore, etc.

Imagine a movie about Menes defeating the Arab and Roman invaders, outsmarting and manipulating the remaining Greeks, and dealing with the warriors of Ptah-Seti, Kush, Wawat, Wose and Nowe...and oh, yeah. Our interactions with Bharatavajra. That story would knock heads clean OFF.

...imagine the story of Ze Pilintra and Maria Navalha TOLD RIGHT. Imagine the story of High John The Conqueror making it to the movies. Imagine AMANIRENAS making her movie debut. Imagine the gajillion stories about the Orisha just HOPPING UP AND DOWN to be told. Imagine the infinite stories about us being founders of and interacting with human civilizations worldwide...

...imagine the imagined and untold story of the brother of Mansa Musa making it to The New World. With the glory and grandeur of his Empire of Mali behind him. The STORIES we could tell...
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Offline Ture

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - Redjack Speaks
« Reply #370 on: September 11, 2022, 08:32:54 pm »

Redjack

Quote
What a lot of folks seem to aggressively and conveniently forget is that T'Chaka and ESPECIALLY T'Challa are (or used to be) UNIQUE in the history of WAKANDA. Father and son are both looking out at the larger world and realizing Wakanda needs to be part of it. T'Chaka was the slow walk, trying to ease things along. T'Challa is the CANNON, forcing his people and the world together, not out of personal desire but out of necessity. Their days of hiding are over as a matter of survival.

Prior to this father and son, the Black Panther mantle-holders were, essentially, interchangeable. Wakanda was a stable, utopian hermit kingdom. So, while every Panther is a badass fighter, NOT every Panther is a scientific genius (T'Challa) and ZERO Panthers were trying to re-connect Wakanda to the outside world (T'Chaka and T'Challa).

Whatever "political strife" occurred in Wakanda did so and was handled thousands of years ago. Wakandan society is an example of how all human society should be. Or, rather, it was that. Now there are rape camps and misogyny, among many other ills. A generation of writers and editors desired to have Wakanda reflect many of the modern and traditional realities of real African nations.

This was and remains a mistake. Not only because super-hero comics are the antithesis of "realism" but because, even within the fictional universe, zero of those ills have ever touched Wakanda. It couldn't have survived as long as it did if they had. No chance. So, we're talking about selective realism and that's just as corruptive.

What you want is naturalism (the character(s) feel like believable people) and plausibility (yeah, in the context of this universe, THAT could happen) in super-hero comics. never actual realism.

The editorial choices that have taken the character and the nation away from their foundation have ultimately gutted their uniqueness and importance.

After all, we don't tell the stories of how everything was perfect for ten thousand years. We tell the story of change and the upheaval that brings.We tell the story of NOW. Right now. Super-hero comics are always NOW. There's no beginning and no end. These aren't actually stories but extended vignettes.

This is the difference between corporate thinking– which is ultimately to sell as much of the product to as many people as they can by basically any means– and good storytelling.

The Black Panther is Wakanda. Wakanda is forever.

IMO, of course.

Redjack stays in the game and in T'Challa the Black Panther's corner. It is just a matter of time (a year or two) as to when we will be reading his iteration. Man he has a lot of crap to clean up but I am so looking forward to seeing it done.




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Offline supreme illuminati

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Re: FEAR OF A BLACK PANTHER - Redjack Speaks
« Reply #371 on: September 13, 2022, 05:06:35 pm »

Redjack

Quote
What a lot of folks seem to aggressively and conveniently forget is that T'Chaka and ESPECIALLY T'Challa are (or used to be) UNIQUE in the history of WAKANDA. Father and son are both looking out at the larger world and realizing Wakanda needs to be part of it. T'Chaka was the slow walk, trying to ease things along. T'Challa is the CANNON, forcing his people and the world together, not out of personal desire but out of necessity. Their days of hiding are over as a matter of survival.

Prior to this father and son, the Black Panther mantle-holders were, essentially, interchangeable. Wakanda was a stable, utopian hermit kingdom. So, while every Panther is a badass fighter, NOT every Panther is a scientific genius (T'Challa) and ZERO Panthers were trying to re-connect Wakanda to the outside world (T'Chaka and T'Challa).

Whatever "political strife" occurred in Wakanda did so and was handled thousands of years ago. Wakandan society is an example of how all human society should be. Or, rather, it was that. Now there are rape camps and misogyny, among many other ills. A generation of writers and editors desired to have Wakanda reflect many of the modern and traditional realities of real African nations.

This was and remains a mistake. Not only because super-hero comics are the antithesis of "realism" but because, even within the fictional universe, zero of those ills have ever touched Wakanda. It couldn't have survived as long as it did if they had. No chance. So, we're talking about selective realism and that's just as corruptive.

What you want is naturalism (the character(s) feel like believable people) and plausibility (yeah, in the context of this universe, THAT could happen) in super-hero comics. never actual realism.

The editorial choices that have taken the character and the nation away from their foundation have ultimately gutted their uniqueness and importance.

After all, we don't tell the stories of how everything was perfect for ten thousand years. We tell the story of change and the upheaval that brings.We tell the story of NOW. Right now. Super-hero comics are always NOW. There's no beginning and no end. These aren't actually stories but extended vignettes.

This is the difference between corporate thinking– which is ultimately to sell as much of the product to as many people as they can by basically any means– and good storytelling.

The Black Panther is Wakanda. Wakanda is forever.

IMO, of course.

Redjack stays in the game and in T'Challa the Black Panther's corner. It is just a matter of time (a year or two) as to when we will be reading his iteration. Man he has a lot of crap to clean up but I am so looking forward to seeing it done.




73244




The moment this happens? Me and the squad and 24 members of my family are back. In full effect. Supporting T'Challa. Until then? I'm warily watching Marvel from a distance, and rolling with Nightwing.
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