Author Topic: BLACK PANTHER - DISNEY PLUS - D23 'The King is Dead'  (Read 44921 times)

Offline Ezyo

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #120 on: February 26, 2021, 11:05:12 am »
I think honestly we haven't seen T'Challa this powerful since before Hickman. Hickmans BP talked but never was allowed to Carry the weight behind his threat's.

Frankly, Redjacks panther is wholly unique to CJP always prepared panther, abd RH hardcore Panther. I would say RJ Panther is straight up the most dangerous man alive imo.



As much as I usually agree with and always respect and appreciate Ezyo's opinions? I have to both agree and disagree here. I completely agree that Hickman BP was too often NOT carrying through his threats, and NOT acquiring decisive, satisfactory, solo and unaided victories ON PANEL that were unambiguous and permanent. However...

My brother, I think you forgot three major feats HICKMAN BP pulled off which have trumped everything that any iteration of BP has done since. And that would be? KING OF THE DEAD UNITING MARVEL ZOMBIES Black Panther. INFINITY GAUNTLET Black Panther. REALITY GEM wielding Black Panther, who literally rewrought and brought into existence the current MCU as it exists.

Brother S.I I would counter with: Unfortunately Hickman decided he needed Namors help to get the zombies to actually follow him, this heavily cheapening what would of been a wonderful feat. Yes he wielded the IF gauntlet and it's impressive how well he held up and survived god Doom, he still got utterly trounced and was lying broken at dooms feet. Abd yes we see that he rewrote the mu and brought back 616, that unfortunately was also overshadowed by the FF sacrificing themselves and remaking the multiverses. Too much tell, bot enough show, and too much over reliance on outside forces when it should of been his own doing.

Whereas Redjack shows T'Challa turn the tide for his people, decimate the enemy forces when he jumps into the battle,  immediately figures out and crafts a plan to beat back knulls forces and his dragon, and does what Every hero in this event has failed to do, rid part of the planet of knulls control. Abd he did it with his own power and resources and introduced us to T'Challas (his own creation btw) contingency to take down the Phoenix. No speeches, no outside help, no empty threats. Just T'Challa taking command and leading his forces to victory while being THE guy to beat knulls forces. How is that not showing the the most dangerous Black Panther?

Again
Priest- Always prepared Panther
Hudlin- Unapologetic hardcore Panther
Redjack- Most dangerous Panther 

Offline supreme illuminati

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #121 on: February 26, 2021, 03:51:02 pm »
I think honestly we haven't seen T'Challa this powerful since before Hickman. Hickmans BP talked but never was allowed to Carry the weight behind his threat's.

Frankly, Redjacks panther is wholly unique to CJP always prepared panther, abd RH hardcore Panther. I would say RJ Panther is straight up the most dangerous man alive imo.




As much as I usually agree with and always respect and appreciate Ezyo's opinions? I have to both agree and disagree here. I completely agree that Hickman BP was too often NOT carrying through his threats, and NOT acquiring decisive, satisfactory, solo and unaided victories ON PANEL that were unambiguous and permanent. However...

My brother, I think you forgot three major feats HICKMAN BP pulled off which have trumped everything that any iteration of BP has done since. And that would be? KING OF THE DEAD UNITING MARVEL ZOMBIES Black Panther. INFINITY GAUNTLET Black Panther. REALITY GEM wielding Black Panther, who literally rewrought and brought into existence the current MCU as it exists.


Brother S.I I would counter with: Unfortunately Hickman decided he needed Namors help to get the zombies to actually follow him, this heavily cheapening what would of been a wonderful feat. Yes he wielded the IF gauntlet and it's impressive how well he held up and survived god Doom, he still got utterly trounced and was lying broken at dooms feet. Abd yes we see that he rewrote the mu and brought back 616, that unfortunately was also overshadowed by the FF sacrificing themselves and remaking the multiverses. Too much tell, bot enough show, and too much over reliance on outside forces when it should of been his own doing.

You already know that I absolutely agree with the criticisms you level above. How is it that Hickman and every other White writer who touches BP except Ellis, Aaron [ and he still has an "asterisk" after his name ], Liss and Cates seem unable to write BP without diluting his victories in some way...whereas they can write White characters who're arguably LESS CAPABLE than BP somehow doing far more than they allow BP to do; without besetting the White characters with the dilution and disrespectful and "needing outside help from someone nonWhite" requirements and tropes they routinely beset BP with? Answer: because these writers are either blatantly or casually racist, that's why.

Whereas Redjack shows T'Challa turn the tide for his people, decimate the enemy forces when he jumps into the battle,  immediately figures out and crafts a plan to beat back knulls forces and his dragon, and does what Every hero in this event has failed to do, rid part of the planet of knulls control. Abd he did it with his own power and resources and introduced us to T'Challas (his own creation btw) contingency to take down the Phoenix. No speeches, no outside help, no empty threats. Just T'Challa taking command and leading his forces to victory while being THE guy to beat knulls forces. How is that not showing the the most dangerous Black Panther?

Aaaaand aaaaaand aaaanad he faced down, outmaneuvered and outfought Knull Shuri without having to beat her down, showing once and for all that BJ BP is overall superior to Shuri, which is as it should be. Being "THE 616 AND MCU ALL AROUND BEST AROUND" is BP's thing...but with them constantly on the sly and in our faces with the consistent reduction in excellence and prominence of the Afrakan male in T'Challa the true BP and elevation of Shuri [ as if both siblings can't be spectacularly unequaled at the same time without such unflinching peerless achievement coming at the expense of the other ] as an excuse for their not so subtly hidden, ingrained impulse and desire to not show the prominent Afrakan male at all; and most especially not show the gargantuan possibilities of the union of the hypercapable Afrakan man, Afrakan woman and Afrakan family as a result of the tragic passing of Boseman? We in comicdom more than anyone else needed to see this sibling confrontation and resolution. The resolution having come without T'Challa having to physically strike Shuri is extremely important for many many reasons [ which we all likely know here and don't need me to delve into ], aaaand it reenforces the canon established by RH BP who...on some G code mode... stated that: "I would never fight a woman. I have people for that..."





All of which you know that I and airyone on HEF including you are here for. Won't catch any disagreement from me on that. I would however add a double supplement: One. The feats enumerated above still don't overshadow rockin the IG solo and facing God Doom solo. Two and my Counterpoint [ part of the reason I want RJBP in 2021 and beyond ]: It took Hickman two whole entire books..with weekly releases no less...to finally cobble together two feats for BP that are of cosmic WHOA factor. RJBP? Did it in ON HIS FIRST TRY AT WRITING JUST ONE BP BOOK. A TIE IN TO A MAJOR EVENT, too.  Aaaand had BP decisively score a win that nobody else in the 616 MU has gotten for THEIR favorite character. Aaaand not only did RJBP just defecate on Coatesverse BP and drew zero racist hatin backlash from the LCBRD in the process, he drew their support...a feat that was heretofore nigh impossible, prior to the world changing and hate smashing power of MCU BP. We long suffering Afrakan Black Panther comic book nerds are forever in your debt, Coogler and Boseman.
.


Again
Priest- Always prepared Panther
Hudlin- Unapologetic hardcore Panther
Redjack- Most dangerous Panther 



I would add one more name to the above to form the original Afrakan Writer Triumvirate which is now a Quartet...Iqele Labane, "Group of Four" in Xhosa...Dwayne McDuffie the OG whom we must never forget.Co-creator of the most popular "pure Afrakan comic creation" in this world to my knowledge...Static Shock...





it was "The Maestro" Dwayne McDuffie [ aka DMD like DMC from Run DMC ] who wrote the original blend of Priest BP and RH BP, plus added his own flava with DMD BP when he wrote BP in the F4. I know you never forgot him, but we must not allow the internet gods to profane the memory of any one of our family; including our brother, our inspiration, our elder, and yes even our leader Dwayne McDuffie for any particle of any fraction of time.



[/color]
« Last Edit: February 26, 2021, 04:41:27 pm by supreme illuminati »
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Offline Ture

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #122 on: February 28, 2021, 06:55:35 pm »
I wonder if there were any communications between the editorial departments of the Black Panther King in Black and the Avengers? The Hand of Bast is an excellent weapon that could be very useful in T'Challa's upcoming confrontation with the Phoenix.



It is a waste that Redjack isn't given a solo BP title to write. I would like to see The Hand of Bast mete out some cosmic level feats, because we must remember two things. First, this is what The Hand... is going to have to contend with.









Second thing is The Hand of Bast is not what defeated the Knull's dragon...





it was T'Challa the Black Panther. I am hoping Aaron gives the Black Panther a respectable victory over the Phoenix because anything less simply would not make sense.












SHOW THEM WHO WE ARE!










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Offline Ezyo

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #123 on: March 01, 2021, 08:59:08 am »
Redjack has said the hand of Bast could take down the Phoenix so I trust him, Okoyes Job was to distract the dragon, I won't lie it would of been a good fear for the weapon, however, since RJ isn't the solo writer it was ultimately probably best he gets the feat as it's T'Challas book. Honestly I just want to see all of Wakandas heavy hitters on full display in the solo:

Wakandan quinjets
Boseman helicarrier
Nyami mothership

Prowler hulk buster
Doomsday prowlers
Panther zord
Hand of Bast

Those are the things I want to see in the Solo and getting some feats. Yes the panther zord was supposed to appear in the cancelled agents of Wakanda tie in but it's still a cool concept I want to see be made Canon


Offline Redjack

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #124 on: March 01, 2021, 09:38:31 am »
The line is "The Hand of Bast was BUILT to kill the Phoenix."


Can it actually do the job?


\_(ツ)_/
[/size][/color]
[/size]It's an energy construct of immense power, tapping into multiple forms of cosmic and muoltdimentional energy at once. It would definitely have killed Knull's dragon, regardless of T'Challa's actions but the Phoenix is the Phoenix. That fight would be a toss-up. [/color]

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Offline supreme illuminati

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #125 on: March 01, 2021, 09:52:16 am »
The line is "The Hand of Bast was BUILT to kill the Phoenix."


Can it actually do the job?


\_(ツ)_/
[/size][/color]
[/size]It's an energy construct of immense power, tapping into multiple forms of cosmic and muoltdimentional energy at once. It would definitely have killed Knull's dragon, regardless of T'Challa's actions but the Phoenix is the Phoenix. That fight would be a toss-up. [/color]




COSIGN!!!

And RJ gotta tell you that I loooove the use of Klaw's sonic weapon in this issue of yours! I neeeever saw that coming! I looove it!!
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Offline Ture

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #126 on: March 01, 2021, 03:59:47 pm »
This is why it is always better to show than to tell and better to tell (having the actual writer do such) than to speculate (fan's postulating and guessing). Nothing like having the author himself state the facts and it is greatly appreciated."an energy construct of immense power, tapping into multiple forms of cosmic and multidimensional energy at once." Wakandan technology is a match for anything.

Could you imagine witnessing T'Challa creating the Hand of Bast and testing out in deep space, having it destroy some lifeless planet or even a star of a dead solar system. This is why I wanted to see what Redjack could do with an ongoing or in the case of King in Black a three issue mini series. We may have bared witness to the Hand of Bast showing some cosmic level feats.

You know what else is cool? T'Challa didn't even need the Hand of Bast to defeat Knull's dragon and we got a free look at a potential Phoenix killer. This is how the Black Panther should be written. I also appreciate Redjack stating an inconclusive outcome of the battle between the Hand of Bast and the Phoenix. That's the way its supposed to be in comics... highly competitive. I'm still holding out that Redjack will get a call from Marvel and be set loose to take the Black Panther to new heights.
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Offline Ture

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #127 on: March 18, 2021, 08:34:14 pm »
This is what we got to look forward to.


courtesy of CBR's  KingNomarch



I wonder if the next BP scribe will incorporate the characters and aesthetic of the Black Panther film into the new ongoing series.?
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Offline supreme illuminati

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #128 on: March 23, 2021, 08:26:19 am »
How many times are we going to see them lighten the skin of The Dora Milaje, de-Afrikanize their features, and Whiten these beautiful sistahs the way they did to Storm FOR DECADES before we finally stop this BS and call it for the blatant disrespectful racism that it is?
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Offline Ture

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - King in Black!
« Reply #129 on: April 12, 2021, 11:59:06 pm »
DISNEY+ DROPS SAMPLE OF HOW THEY MAY HANDLE THEIR UPCOMING WAKANDA SERIES!



While Disney+ has not eclipsed Netflix shows like Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage or Punisher, Falcon and the Winter Soldier is a good Marvel live action series. Zemo is doing an excellent job at maintaining complexity, mystique and charm. It would have been great to see how he and T'Challa would have interacted.

Karli Morgenthau is another good character that I'm really diggin' as she tries to do what she believes is necessary without going completely to the dark side. The conversation between her, Nakia and T'Challa could have been very interesting. I liked how Mandripor was visited. It reminded me of when T'Challa, Nakia and Okoye were in Busan. What a great place to have T'Challa meet with Hunter who he has stationed there.



I like how they use individual characters' cinematic theme music and was really excited to hear the Dora Milaje chant. Ayo looked gorgeous and fierce while radiating a near lethal, no nonsense attitude. The other two Doras were also quite effective in how they came across. Ayo literally disarming the Winter Soldier was a stand out moment.

They lost me with the generic cityscape that was supposed to be Wakanda. It was insult enough not sync up Infinity War with the Black Panther solo as to render a consistent Wakanda and the same applies here. What I'm about to state next is nitpicking however god is in the details. I didn't like seeing the thread hole of the Kimoyo beads Ayo left for Bucky to find. I imagine the beads being held together magnetically or by some vibranium attraction.

What was really disconcerning was how they went out of their way not to mention T'Challa. The Winter Soldier said he was grateful for what Shuri and Ayo did for him but neglected to show any remembrance of the Black Panther. Bucky failed to broach the subject that it was T'Challa who bought him to and sheltered him in Wakanda; that it was T'Challa who placed him in suspended animation and not a Wakandan jail cell; and that it was T'Challa who presented him with a new arm. If this is what Disney and Feige meant by honoring Chadwick's legacy by omitting what T'Challa actually did on screen they can miss me with all that.



Though sprinkled with populist rhetoric and a hint of BLM, it worked in the series and thus far Marvel has been able to, notwithstanding a few foibles, integrate contemporary political concerns with respect to the cultural integrity of individual superheroes and even villains for that matter.

Sam is cool or least getting there but he still has some of that sidekick residue on him. Sam's penchant for Bagger Vancing to Steve is wearing thin as was his speaking up for the Avengers.

As all roads lead back to T'Challa the Black Panther, this series fourth episode showed that Marvel has some idea on how to disseminate aspects of the Black Panther's mythos. If this is true they have to realize that any such dissemination looses its potency in the absence of T'Challa the Black Panther.












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Offline Ture

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Offline Ezyo

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - The Disney+ Experience - Falcon and the Winter Soldier
« Reply #131 on: April 13, 2021, 06:25:48 pm »
Yeah I have gone through this so many times about how this whole Honoring Chad with is so far from the truth and that of they truly wanted to honor hom they would of done actual impactful honoring and then not retired the character, he battled through cancer and treatments to bring to the big screen because he knew the importance of T'Challa.

I have signed the petition and I hope more people actually start to see that getting rid of T'Challa is not the big "Honor" they think it is. All the while picking the mythos clean and likely relegating Wakanda to a backdrop to simply have stuff happen to it to prop up threats

Offline MindofShadow

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - The Disney+ Experience - Falcon and the Winter Soldier
« Reply #132 on: April 14, 2021, 09:59:03 am »
Quote
What was really disconcerning was how they went out of their way not to mention T'Challa. The Winter Soldier said he was grateful for what Shuri and Ayo did for him but neglected to show any remembrance of the Black Panther. Bucky failed to broach the subject that it was T'Challa who bought him to and sheltered him in Wakanda; that it was T'Challa who placed him in suspended animation and not a Wakandan jail cell; and that it was T'Challa who presented him with a new arm. If this is what Disney and Feige meant by honoring Chadwick's legacy by omitting what T'Challa actually did on screen they can miss me with all that.

Yeah that was... weird to me.

T'challa is still around in this timeline as far as anyone knows. So, why is everyone going out of the way to avoid mentioning his name?

How is that honoring anything? How is erasure honoring? I don't get it.

"Chadwick did such a great job bringing black PAnther to life. HE IS T'challa. So, from now on, we are going to act like he never existed in his honor."

LIke... wtf?

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - The Disney+ Experience - Falcon and the Winter Soldier
« Reply #133 on: April 14, 2021, 06:09:05 pm »
Quote
What was really disconcerning was how they went out of their way not to mention T'Challa. The Winter Soldier said he was grateful for what Shuri and Ayo did for him but neglected to show any remembrance of the Black Panther. Bucky failed to broach the subject that it was T'Challa who bought him to and sheltered him in Wakanda; that it was T'Challa who placed him in suspended animation and not a Wakandan jail cell; and that it was T'Challa who presented him with a new arm. If this is what Disney and Feige meant by honoring Chadwick's legacy by omitting what T'Challa actually did on screen they can miss me with all that.

Yeah that was... weird to me.

T'challa is still around in this timeline as far as anyone knows. So, why is everyone going out of the way to avoid mentioning his name?

How is that honoring anything? How is erasure honoring? I don't get it.

"Chadwick did such a great job bringing black PAnther to life. HE IS T'challa. So, from now on, we are going to act like he never existed in his honor."

LIke... wtf?

Quote
By not recasting, it could stifle the opportunity for one of the most popular, leading Black superheroes to add on to their legacy. The #1 way to kill a legend, is to stop telling their story

Honestly what it feels like. Start out small, first it's Bucky saying the above, then it's mention about how Shuri or Ayo provided aid during CW, or how Shuri and Okoye fought hard and we're instrumental in turning the tide on the battle for WK vs the Black order and the battle against Thanos in EG, then they start mentioning how the outreach program was Shuris idea or her work then they completely just write T'Challa out as if he was snapped out of existence.

What did Ayo do for Bucky? She never even talked to him or seen him for that matter in the MCU till the show. T'Challa gave Bucky the arm. No mention that Shuri made it for him or anything.

If the WK show comes out before the sequel you can bet that they will push this even further, essentially soft push people to just accept T'Challa is gone without a trace by reconning what happened in the MCU

Offline Ture

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Re: BLACK PANTHER - The Disney+ Experience - Falcon and the Winter Soldier
« Reply #134 on: April 14, 2021, 09:12:07 pm »
Quote
What was really disconcerning was how they went out of their way not to mention T'Challa. The Winter Soldier said he was grateful for what Shuri and Ayo did for him but neglected to show any remembrance of the Black Panther. Bucky failed to broach the subject that it was T'Challa who bought him to and sheltered him in Wakanda; that it was T'Challa who placed him in suspended animation and not a Wakandan jail cell; and that it was T'Challa who presented him with a new arm. If this is what Disney and Feige meant by honoring Chadwick's legacy by omitting what T'Challa actually did on screen they can miss me with all that.

Yeah that was... weird to me.

T'challa is still around in this timeline as far as anyone knows. So, why is everyone going out of the way to avoid mentioning his name?

How is that honoring anything? How is erasure honoring? I don't get it.

"Chadwick did such a great job bringing black PAnther to life. HE IS T'challa. So, from now on, we are going to act like he never existed in his honor."

LIke... wtf?

The obfuscation and discrediting of T'Challa the Black Panther has been practiced for decades.

DOOM 2099









This is all the mention of T'Challa the Black Panther we would receive.



Attempts at obscuring, overwriting or even replacing T'Challa the Black Panther were unsuccessful and short lived.

KASPER COLE





SHURI







THE GAYE DORAS





COATES CREW







WALKING DEAD BLACK PANTHER 2099







The pages above evidence a wanton act of negative propaganda. As insultingly demonstrated in the scenes of these Marvel's comic books, so shall it be proven in the forthcoming films of the MCU sans T'Challa. No matter how bad nor how good, there is no Black Panther product or franchise of worth or measure without a well presented, fully actualized T'Challa the Black Panther.













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