Author Topic: What do we do with Whites when...?  (Read 13758 times)

Offline Cheirel

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #15 on: October 03, 2007, 01:22:23 pm »
"one of the PARENTS stole my daughter's pompoms."


OMG!! Cheiri, that is sooo pathetic!! Just proves my point: money, color of skin, social status, etc.. has nothing to do with a person's honor. Stealing a child's cheer leading pom-poms..? Unbelievable someone would stoop so low!

I hope your daughter does well at her new school. Tell her I'll send her a set of official NFL pom-poms so she can rattle them in those snoobs faces if she likes!! LOL.
I will tell her! SMOOCHES!!!

Offline Tanksleyd

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #16 on: October 03, 2007, 06:11:04 pm »
Frederick Douglas, CJ Walker, heck even Mos Def. I still want to see what happens at the Woddrow Wilson 60 year mark. It was 60 years after the Washington DC post office was integrated that Woodrow Wilson re-segregated it. I want to be alive in just a few short years, 2024, at the 60 year mark of the Voting Rights Act of 1964.

But by all means enjoy your NFL pom poms.

Offline Goat

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2007, 09:01:01 am »
"I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong."
By Frederick Douglas

There is no royal, flower-strewn path to success. And if there is, I have not found it for if I have accomplished anything in life, it is because I have been willing to work hard.
By Madam CJ Walker


I’m not sure you do Mr Douglas and Madam Walker justice by placing Mos Def on the same level.

This statement by Mos Def seems to directly contradict Osama Bin Laden’s own admittance.

Al-Qaeda was not responsible for 9/11,
By Mos Def

Fact:
Shortly before the U.S. presidential election in 2004, in a taped statement, Bin Laden publicly acknowledged al-Qaeda's involvement in the attacks on the U.S, and admitted his direct link to the attacks. in a videotape aired on Al Jazeera, on October 30, 2004, bin Laden said he had personally directed the 19 hijackers.

Not to totally disagree with you Tank, since I do admire Mos Def’s outspoken stance and distaste for the governments reaction in regards to Katrina. However I find his use of anti-American type doctrines as a viable reaction to racism to be mis-informed, mis-guided and simply put. Idiotic!

 “It is important to distinguish between Islamists and Islamist terrorists: "While ignoring the overwhelming majority of Islamists who have nothing to do with terror and making them virtually irrelevant and stigmatized in Western political discourse ... To ignore the complexity of political Islam and tar all Islamists with the same brush of terrorism guarantees Bin Laden's success”

In my opinion Mos Def does his religion an injustice since this type of view only serves to further a misguided view of Islamism.

As for Woodrow Wilson, despite any regard that one might grant him for his pioneering work on the eventual creation of what was to become the “League of Nations” and for what seemed to be an huge effort to promote world peace he at the same time expressed views of racism, anti-women rights, as well as anti-immigrant views against Irish Americans and by all accounts could be considered as supporter of Zionism.  His interference in the affairs of Haiti, and other Latin American Countries was made to appear as beneficial to them yet was only a means to gain US control over their politics. His “war to end all war’s” statement may have been honorable in the intent to instill peace throughout the world yet was at the same time seen as dishonorable by the methods he used to place America into the war. He created the Fair Trade commission and was a strong influence on the demise of the practice of child labor. He was anti-union yet pro labor.

Woodrow Wilson it seems was an enigma and a contradiction all to himself.??? For every thing that he had a hand in which could be seen as beneficial to the world you can find something that was just as detrimental.

Lastly, as far as enjoying pom poms.. heck!! doesn't everybody? ;)

Offline Magic Wand

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #18 on: October 15, 2007, 09:03:30 pm »
First of all, save yourself. When a plane is going down, and the oxygen masks pop out, they instruct you to PUT ON YOUR OWN MASK FIRST, even before you put it on your child.  If you pass out, you can't help your child or your self. I think this is metaphorical to life.  Make sure your mind, heart and soul are together.  Make sure your business is straight.  Then you can help others. 

As bad as things are for black people as a whole, there is PLENTY of room for individual achievement.  It's everywhere.  A black man runs American Express.  A black woman is Secretary of State.   My Asian and Hispanic colleagues admire the success of black filmmakers in Hollywood.  You can go as far as you want to in life.  Never accept anything but the best from yourself and from the world. 

And don't let anyone guilt you that you are selling out by succeeding at your goal.  Selling out only means doing something you don't believe in.  There's a lot of people (of all races) who are scared of success. They will sabotage themselves and undermine you.  Leave them in the dirt and keep moving.

Success is on the horizon line;  meaning it can feel like you will never get there.  A few years ago I had a mild case of depression.  I was sleeping 13, 14 hours a day, really mopey.  Finally went back home to visit my family.  I was talking about my state with my Uncle Richard.  He asked me why I felt so depressed.

I told him I made a movie and it flopped;  shot a TV pilot and it didn't get picked up;  wrote a spec script and it didn't get bought;  went to Europe with my girlfriend and it wasn't the most fun time. 

He said back to me:  "So in one year, you did all that...and you're depressed?  You know, any one of those things can be someone's lifetime goal". 

he fixed me right then and there.  My perspective had gotten so skewed I didn't appreciate my life.  But ever since then, I appreciate everything. My positive mindset has led to greater success and even more happiness.
I still have the same drive, but I smell the flowers along the way.  Happiness is a choice.

I say all that to say, you may never feel like you've "made it".  Not only do I feel like I"m still struggling to make it; I talk to some of the most successful people in the world who say the same thing.  So you can't put off living or giving until after this mythical "I'm straight" point, because you will never get there.  However, giving will add to your joy, because it is better to give than receive. 

Helping comes in an infinite number of ways.  I believe most people on this board do something.  You can fight the power, save the children, reach out to our brothers and sisters of other races....all of these are worthwhile actions to make the world better.  Always remember one person can make a difference.  It would nice to have help, but a dedicated individual makes it happen with or without group consensus.

Word!

And mega-props to Uncle Richard!

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." --Aristotle, Greek philosopher

Доверяй, но проверяй

wgreason

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #19 on: October 16, 2007, 05:49:21 pm »
I feel individual achievement as long as it aligns with the historical principles of collective achievement valued by Frederick Douglass, Ida Wells-Barnett, Ella Baker, Earl Lewis, and, yes, Mos Def.

A few African Americans have chosen individual achievement at the expense of collective achievement and that is nothing but betrayal.

Offline Goat

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #20 on: October 16, 2007, 06:49:22 pm »
I’m sorry, I just don’t get it? what exactly did Mos Def do to contribute to the benefit of mankind? To widen and broaden collective achievement? How much of his earnings from his rap music did he contribute to the victims of Katrina? Or does anti-government parades provide answers instead of simply plat forming for one’s own benefit to enhance his profile and what? Sell more records?   Betrayal to me, is to defend this countries most notorious terrorist as if he was the victim.
Mos Def has no place nor right to be included in a list such as: Frederick Douglass, Ida Wells-Barnett, Ella Baker and Earl Lewis. And yes this is just my opinion and I will defend to the death your right to voice yours as well as Mos Def’s. But I will neither agree nor disagree with the politics and opinions of an individual based solely on the color of his skin. How does a comment about the connection between past presidents and free masons have anything to do with post-Katrina politics? I thought it was about the veterans in the Gulf war who were becoming victims of the use of Agent Orange?? Just when I thought he was making an admirable stance on our countries war veterans behalf according to Mos it was about Katrina?? What the??  In all accounts Mos Def is not a patriot of America. What then keeps him here? His house in Bel air?

What is it they are calling his rap music these days? Mos-mumbling with some reggae thrown in??

Apologies, I seldom get into any political debates here at HEF. No insults intended, but I admit I have no love for Mos Def.

wgreason

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2007, 09:27:46 am »
Betrayal to me, is to defend this countries most notorious terrorist as if he was the victim.

Mos Def has no place nor right to be included in a list such as: Frederick Douglass, Ida Wells-Barnett, Ella Baker and Earl Lewis. And yes this is just my opinion and I will defend to the death your right to voice yours as well as Mos Def’s.

But I will neither agree nor disagree with the politics and opinions of an individual based solely on the color of his skin. How does a comment about the connection between past presidents and free masons have anything to do with post-Katrina politics? I thought it was about the veterans in the Gulf war who were becoming victims of the use of Agent Orange?? Just when I thought he was making an admirable stance on our countries war veterans behalf according to Mos it was about Katrina?? What the??  In all accounts Mos Def is not a patriot of America. What then keeps him here? His house in Bel air?

What is it they are calling his rap music these days? Mos-mumbling with some reggae thrown in??

Apologies, I seldom get into any political debates here at HEF. No insults intended, but I admit I have no love for Mos Def.


I include him with the previous generations of black leadership because, like each of them, he has been labeled a public enemy or a terrorist by the government authorities of American society.  Douglass was America's most wanted terrorist from 1848-1860.  Wells-Barnett was public enemy number one from 1880-1889.  King and his cronies drove Baker from the SCLC because she was 'too radical.'  I'm sure you're already aware of Earl Lewis' suffering at the hands of the police.

Mos has crafted statement after public statement celebrating the beauty and intelligence of African people around the world from "Brown Skin Lady" to "There is a Way" ... he educates his audience about the psychological and physiological crises facing them around the world over the coming generations from "New World Water" to "Crime and Medicine" ... he confronts the powerful and amplifies the silenced from "Bin Laden" to "Katrina Clap".

Whether it's autobiographical novels, newspapers, advocacy groups, student activism, or music, the message remains the same ... "treason to white America is patriotism to humanity"

Offline Goat

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #22 on: October 17, 2007, 03:01:55 pm »
"amplifies the silenced from "Bin Laden".."

I'd rather not hear what Bin Laden has to say on anything...


""treason to white America is patriotism to humanity"

I don't live in *white America" I live in the United States, I am not a white American, I am an American.

Mr. Greason, with all due respect that statement reeks of racism, and anti patriotism, I am not a patriot of the world. I am first and foremost a patriot to my country. When it comes to us against them, I choose us.

Lastly "King and his cronies?" am I the only one that finds issues with this statement? and as far as the authorities of America mis-labeling people who dare to speak the truth as enemies of the state, race and/or religion as history as proved as little to do with it.

To enjoy the benefits of free speech granted by those that laid their life down to ensure your freedom and at the same time praise a world that generates a terrorist such as bin laden is a disgrace to this country. Try speaking your mind in a country such as China and see how long it takes before they run you over with a tank.

 

wgreason

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #23 on: October 17, 2007, 04:20:17 pm »
"amplifies the silenced from "Bin Laden".."

I'd rather not hear what Bin Laden has to say on anything... (1)


""treason to white America is patriotism to humanity"

I don't live in *white America" I live in the United States, I am not a white American, I am an American. (2)

Dr. Greason, with all due respect that statement reeks of racism, and anti patriotism, I am not a patriot of the world. I am first and foremost a patriot to my country. When it comes to us against them, I choose us. (3)

Lastly "King and his cronies?" am I the only one that finds issues with this statement? (4) and as far as the authorities of America mis-labeling people who dare to speak the truth as enemies of the state, race and/or religion as history as proved as little to do with it.

To enjoy the benefits of free speech granted by those that laid their life down to ensure your freedom and at the same time praise a world that generates a terrorist such as bin laden is a disgrace to this country. Try speaking your mind in a country such as China and see how long it takes before they run you over with a tank. (5)


(1) "Bin Laden" ... a song by Immortal Technique and Mos Def.  I prefer the one with KRS-One and Chuck D, though.  It just might send you to the Patriot Act to register me and anyone else who heard it.

(2) Immigration law from 1790 to 1965 required "white" identity for acceptance into American citizenship.  You may think that race has nothing to do with citizenship in the United States presently, but I would bet that there are approximately 130 million Americans who would disagree with that position.

(3) Patriotism to a government or to a set of ideals ... I choose the latter.  Racism?  I can discuss it quite fluently.  Recognizing the patterns of historical and present white supremacy (especially to combat it) does not constitute racism ... racialism, perhaps, but undermining the power of whiteness still promotes the inclusive recognition of all humanity.

(4) When King decided to act on his sexism by banning women from leadership in SCLC, he relied on the support of other sexist men in his organization to enforce the policy.  Those who followed his direction on the issue are the classic embodiment of 'cronies.'

(5) I can speak the truth more freely in Germany, Switzerland, Spain, Great Britain, Ghana, Ethiopia, Kenya, South Africa, India, Brazil, Canada, and dozens of other countries ... the 'world' did not generate bin Laden; he is the direct product of the Western Cold War and its elite military-intelligence infrastructure.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2007, 03:21:47 am by wgreason »

Jenn

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #24 on: October 17, 2007, 08:25:24 pm »
I’m sorry, I just don’t get it? what exactly did Mos Def do to contribute to the benefit of mankind? To widen and broaden collective achievement? How much of his earnings from his rap music did he contribute to the victims of Katrina?

How much of your earnings did you donate?

I don't live in *white America" I live in the United States, I am not a white American, I am an American.

YAAAAAAAAAAY, white privilege!

Quote
Lastly "King and his cronies?" am I the only one that finds issues with this statement?

Who cares if you do?
« Last Edit: October 17, 2007, 08:27:05 pm by Jenn »

Offline Goat

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #25 on: October 18, 2007, 05:06:40 pm »
I’m sorry, I just don’t get it? what exactly did Mos Def do to contribute to the benefit of mankind? To widen and broaden collective achievement? How much of his earnings from his rap music did he contribute to the victims of Katrina?
How much of your earnings did you donate?

Myself and my two sisters secured a loan and gave ten thousand dollars to my father and my two uncles and aunt as well as each of us housed a number of members of our family for about six months until they were able to return to St. Charles Parish.

Were still paying off the loan.. AND YOU!!


I don't live in *white America" I live in the United States, I am not a white American, I am an American.

YAAAAAAAAAAY, white privilege!

No.. if you talking about my child hood it's more boooooo, cajun poor.. but thank you for your concern.

Quote
Lastly "King and his cronies?" am I the only one that finds issues with this statement?

Who cares if you do?

I do!

You don't know anything about me. Don't pretend you do.

Do you have any real opinion or are you simply looking to vent and bait me into some sort of white vs black debate because I don't appreciate Mos Def?  and this is exactly why I don't get involved with political debates here. Childish immature and a bigoted response from you Jenn. But I'm sure you will have some fire cracker response to go all Jennish on me and take the heat off yourself and your racist sentiments. Good luck with that.

As for me, I'm done and won't bother to read it. because when it comes to post such as yours. Who cares?

You may think that race has nothing to do with citizenship in the United States presently,

I neither said that nor think that? but I sincerely thought your response was akin to your position and opinion and value your thoughts on the issue.

To add, Wgreason.

Thank you, your response was both informative and to the point. I appreciate it.

I will give KRS-One and Chuck D a listen: sounds like a powerful song.

Thank you for your explanation of what you meant by Cronies. I see your point.

On bin laden, "Western Cold War and its elite military-intelligence infrastructure" I would have to agree here as well, yes, perhaps the proliferation's of arms to the region, even Bin Laden's education and motives can be attributed to the so called Military-intelligence (an oxy-moron! LOL) however I disagree that it was a *direct cause and more of another major contributing factor. Also this does not excuse the act of terrorism.
Thank you again wgreason, and Jenn get a Life!... and an education.

but don't worry Jenn, I'm done here, no need to get all foaming at the mouth. It's Sad when kids try to join in adult conversation.

Offline Goat

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #26 on: October 18, 2007, 08:50:51 pm »
Apologies, this is long.. dayam! it's dayam near "Supreme Ill" proportions!!   ;) anyway here goes, I'm taking a break from HEF for a while and just needed to get something off my chest before I do... so WTH..

Jenn?

why the lash out on me? yea I'm not African American.. I've never pretended to be, nor am I white since in Louisiana Cajun's are not considered as white and throughout their history have been subjected to their own brand of racism, we were the first race in North America to endure the act of genocide by the English after being betrayed by the French long before a single African was abducted and indentured to the atrocities of slavery in the south, and a decade before the genocide acts against the Native Americans. 

I have never claimed nor do I profess the ability to understand what it is to be an African American. At the same time I am sure you do not understand what an Arcadian is nor have the capacity to understand the tribulations my ancestors endured under the rule of the supremacist elite you hold in high discontent.     

All of this withstanding, I choose to strive to look beyond the color of a persons skin, beyond their religion and do my best to past judgment as to a persons honor based purely on the words they speak and the actions they take.

For some it seems certain topics are held to the belief that they are  taboo, that anyone who is not a black man or women in America has no right to hold an opinion on the issue.

If my opinion of Mos Def was taken as an insult by you then that was not my intention. I am not an authority on his beliefs. I am also not above being willing to hear the opinions of others and change my opinion if convinced and made aware of something I am overlooking. Hence, it was my purpose to state my opinion as it was at the time I wrote it with the acceptance to hear what others have to say on the subject and thereby become conscious of other factors. Only the person whose ego is inflated and over stressed to the point of not allowing humility lacks the ability to withstand ridicule and disregard the opinions of others as meaningless. I am not egotistical and I believe or at least I try to be humble enough to give others the respect and consideration the merit of their opinion deserves and if need be, change my opinion on the issue.

I write this because of only one reason, I have been a member of HEF since shortly after it’s inception. I was a member before we were hacked and the new HEF emerged. I have enjoyed the camaraderie and open minded membership of this forum. I stay open minded and have at all times respected the opinions and post of others on a wide variety of topics. I don’t hesitate to help or lend assistance for any who ask if I can be of assistance and  beneficial to a member than that alone is my reward.

I for the most part stay out of topics such as this, to avoid the miss-perceptions that sometimes generate from topics on politics and race. For the most part I simply laugh off topics that border line on racist views whether they are racist against blacks, whites, yellow red or brown makes little difference. I see them as irrelevant and non constructive.

My first post to this thread (which by the way has a title that in itself is racial) was only to LOL at the comment. “I like white folks” the humor as I see it stems from the realization that it’s a racist comment. I like white folks? LOL well I don’t!!  at least in the sense that I don’t like anyone simply because they are white. There are so many more factors that influence the acceptance and worth of a person in my liking them than the color of their skin. I’d say it’s so far done on the list that I put more importance on if they like dogs vs cats then their skin tone. Hell if they roll their socks down or wear em up is more important to me! So yea I thought it was humorous, and the comment was not meant as a deep sarcastically implied response. My second post was only because of how much I like Chierel and I felt sadness for her daughter having to be put in such an awkward position by a so called adult’s bigoted views. I was totally sincere in my offer to send a gift of pom-poms to her and Chierel understands what my intention was and my genuine sentiments. 

I think it was the connotation of Tank’s comment of “by all means enjoy your pom-poms” which I felt belittled my sincerity that got me in the mind to post a rebuttal to his post on the 60 year mark of the voting rights act.  I simply was looking for some explanation as to what he meant by his comment and my feelings on Mos Def seemed to incite others to voice their opinions. (surprising since I thought I was going to catch hell for the suff on Woodrow Wilson more than anything) and so the last post was a more direct “I don’t get it?” view on Mos and again was intended to LEARN and was not intended to insult.

And so we come to you Jenn, in all the time I have been a member here, not once by anyone on any topic or any issue have I been insulted, called a name and told my opinion doesn’t matter.  Nor have I done the same to anyone else. Now I’ve seen you go off on people here before, and I chalk it up to just your way and leave it at that, this isn’t a group of thousands of people, we are a bit over two hundred members and of that only a handful post on a regular basis.  I have never felt the need to be condescending disrespectful nor insult someone here let alone one of the few that post on a regular basis. Yet you seem to not give it a second thought?

This is what I meant by childish behavior. I also am not going to participate within an infamous Jenn flame war so you win. I’ll just goat back to my rap band, and sing my white supremacy songs.. with my posse.. Kool-Aid on bass, Opey on the drums, and Blanca Blond on the piano. Hell I think I even got a new rap name…
White-“T”    yo yo..    :(

Goat out.
Peace.

 

Offline Magic Wand

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #27 on: October 19, 2007, 02:56:01 am »
GOAT,

Don't let the likes of Jenn run you off the board.
I think I speak for most HEFfas when I say we value your opinion, your talents and your generosity and we like having you around.


Jenn,

We generally like having you around too.  So quit acting like such a caustic bitch and act right!
You are brilliant and funny and sometimes evil as hell!
Be nice!
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." --Aristotle, Greek philosopher

Доверяй, но проверяй

Offline Tanksleyd

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #28 on: October 19, 2007, 03:50:03 am »
Goat: Please stay. My "pom-pom/Mos Def/Woodrow Wilson" statement was my take on the belief that all things in Racial America are "cool and equal".

That being said, yes, there are factors on American Race that not even Blacks can agree on but whenever a "Nappy Headed Ho's" pops up the cohesion can surprise all, even Blacks. I have my own theories but I can say this...When two lovers are having a fight...tip-toe gently.

Goat....PLEASE STAY.

Offline Curtis Metcalf

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Re: What do we do with Whites when...?
« Reply #29 on: October 19, 2007, 07:44:18 am »
GOAT,

Don't let the likes of Jenn run you off the board.
I think I speak for most HEFfas when I say we value your opinion, your talents and your generosity and we like having you around.


Jenn,

We generally like having you around too.  So quit acting like such a caustic bitch and act right!
You are brilliant and funny and sometimes evil as hell!
Be nice!


Truth and wisdom right there.
Here's another appeal for civility, please.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2007, 10:27:39 am by Curtis Metcalf »
"Seek first to understand, then to be understood."
"Be hard on systems, but soft on people."