Author Topic: Doomwar #4 Preview  (Read 14557 times)

Offline 4sake

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #30 on: May 22, 2010, 04:11:55 pm »
But ultimately what I am saying, is give BP a victory where he wins because he is better.  Don't give him a victory where someone could say, "you only won because Doom took off his mask to gloat.". No, give him a victory like FF 200 where Reed refuses to quit, keeps attacking until he ripped off Doom's mask.

I agree...
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Offline sinjection1

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #31 on: May 23, 2010, 05:36:52 am »
But ultimately what I am saying, is give BP a victory where he wins because he is better.  Don't give him a victory where someone could say, "you only won because Doom took off his mask to gloat.". No, give him a victory like FF 200 where Reed refuses to quit, keeps attacking until he ripped off Doom's mask.

I agree...

I agree as well, 4sake. I believe DOOMWAR is absolutely on course to finish with a victory over Doom by T'Challa to rival and even exceed that described by Kip in FF #200. T'Challa hasn't ever quit against any opponent. Doom has exhibited stupidity/foolishness traits in the past, his premature ejaculation of gloating in Doctor Voodoo #5, for instance. After transmuting Nightmare from a physical being into one composed of pure energy which he then immediately absorbed, Doom began to gloat about his "ultimate victory" over Dr. Voodoo and demanding that the Eye Of Agamotto be surrendered to him. Doom was so arrogant, so foolish, so incredibly stupid that he didn't even realize he'd been defeated until Dr. Voodoo challenged him to kill him and when he tried to do so, discovered that he could not. He'd been possessed by Daniel Drumm. I appreciated the smooth, slick way Dr. Voodoo outmanuevered Doom and the humiliating manner in which Doom was dismissed by Jericho afterwards. I wish Jericho had hit Doom more than once however. He should have kicked the scum when he was down.

I want T'Challa's victory over Doom to be one that the greater comicbook-reading demographic will lament for years to come. I want T'Challa to stand up to Doom's armor's weaponry and his mystic attacks and then proceed to beat Doom to a pulp, ripping off his cloak and armor as he does so. rendering him as naked as he was when he fought and killed that lion save for his face plate. I want T'Challa to batter and kick Doom's bloodied, beaten body all through the halls of his Latverian castle in full view of Doom's horrified and helpless subjects/staff. I want Doom to cry out in pain and anguish. I want him to beg T'Challa for mercy. Then, I want T'Challa to rip away Doom's face plate and bash his vulnerable face against the walls and floor of the room they happen to be in at that time until it is a bloody pulpy mass of gore. I want Doom's teeth knocked the funk out of his mouth and his left eye GONE!!!!

At that point, I want T'Challa to approach the beaten, battered, whimpering slime that was Dr. Doom - the Spear Of Bashenga in hand. I want T'Challa to raise the Spear over Doom's quivering body and bring it down with all the force his now physically-enhanced body is able to muster. Whether or not the spearpoint penetrates Doom is a matter left to the writer.

T'Challa won't be granted such a well-deserved victory however, if his defeat of Anton Pretorious is any indicator. After fighting through lies, diversions, and attacks that left his body and mind battered, T'Challa finally fought his way to his mother's side. Pretorious entered the room and said, "Hello, T'Challa." T'Challa lifted Pretorious over his head intending to hurl him from the bedroom's balcony to his death below only to be prevented from doing so by his outraged mother, Ramonda. I wouldn't be surprised if Bast itself prevents T'Challa from killing Doom.
Mr. MajestiK, I like your style. You are the wiser, calmer, more articulate second coming of sinjection to "that other place". You do me proud.

Offline Seven

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #32 on: May 24, 2010, 01:10:57 pm »
Totally agreed. I like Doomwar...*but* as a fan of T'challa, I would be lying if I said that I'm not a bit pissed off that he is really not doing anything. So Black Panther finally gets a Marvel Event...and what happens...T'challa is pushed to the back ground? It's a good read, but as a BP fan...We are seeing a numbers drop, because you have fans that want to see T'challa...

Same with Storm...is Doomwar worth her not being in SC...(even though there is still no reason she should not be doing something over there...since SC is after Doomwar.).

If T'challa does not get a pure win...then Doomwar is not going to go over very well...watch. That is pretty sad, because I'm a big fan of the event...but with hopes that T'challa does something.

Seeing that Shuri is getting a mini and the Heroic Age one shot...I think that we need to see T'challa do something.

Offline Seven

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #33 on: May 24, 2010, 01:25:09 pm »
To be fair...this is what Maberry said...

Quote
Marvel made the decision to have Shuri wear the mantle of the Black Panther. It wasn't something Reggie Hudlin (who introduced the change) or I (as current) writer had a say in. That means that T'Challa and Storm are not the central characters in the book. Shuri is. Marvel has been shaking things up all across the MU, and there has been a strong focus on the power of female characters --many of who are being given a shot at leading a book.

That said, Marvel has some pretty interesting plans for T'Challa and Storm over the next year.

On the other hand, even though I've always been a huge fan of T'Challa, I'm enjoying writing Shuri. I have another mini-series starting later this year that explores Shuri's personality, her life as the new ruler/spiritual leader/hero of Wakanda.

As for Doom...well, let's face it...the book is called DoomWar. He will be sharing equal priority with the combined team of Shuri, T'Challa, Storm, the FF, Deadpool and the other guest (who will be revealed in #5).


So it looks like it was Marvel brain trust. So basically, they got the book cancelled by removing Storm and T'challa. So we can't really blame Mr. Maberry or Mr. Hudlin.

Marvel...Thanks guys.  >:(

The only thing that will fix this is T'challa becoming a member on the A-vengers. Anything less ...is pretty much BS.

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #34 on: May 24, 2010, 01:25:18 pm »
Of course that assume T'challa survives Doomwar.  Of course, I am starting to suspect based on a comment JM made that Doom maybe banished from earth at the end, and when that happens, T may go with him.  Of course that is pure guesswork.

Offline Kimoyo

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #35 on: May 24, 2010, 05:16:15 pm »
Not happy with this news.  Bait and switched, fake bill of goods and so on.  T'Challa has been under/misused for a long time!  Worse than waiting is paying and waiting for the promise of something greater.  I don't want to hear about interesting plans anymore.  We've been buying that for years now.  Show me my money!!!

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Offline Princesa

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #36 on: May 24, 2010, 05:58:55 pm »
I'm very thankful that Mayberry was so candid in his comments and actually they make me feel better. The BP was failing in sales and Marvel rather than cancel it tried inserting Shuri as Panther as a jump start--unfortunately she hemorrhaged sales at an unprecedented rate. At least we know what we complained about was not the creators fault. I hope there are T'Challa/Ororo plans...

Offline Seven

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #37 on: May 25, 2010, 11:52:33 am »
I'm very thankful that Mayberry was so candid in his comments and actually they make me feel better. The BP was failing in sales and Marvel rather than cancel it tried inserting Shuri as Panther as a jump start--unfortunately she hemorrhaged sales at an unprecedented rate. At least we know what we complained about was not the creators fault. I hope there are T'Challa/Ororo plans...

That not true. Black Panther was not failing in sales. The sales were fine after Jason Aaron's arc...and they were also great during Mr. Hudlin return...they started failing when they decided to make Shuri the Black Panther. That is a fact...yeah the Back to Africa arc the sales were falling...but it's because that arc was not all the intresting to a lot of folks who wanted something more...and they got it with the SI arc by Jason Aaron...you had people who never read the book now wanted to jump on to read about T'challa...and Marvel BLEW IT.

I agree about Mr. Maberry being candid...but it doesn't make me feel better. If they are trying to push a female...then WHY NOT STORM?

Shuri becoming the Black Panther and staying the Black Panther has killed the book. Not the other way around. Even with Doomwar you had fans jump on hoping to see T'challa vs. Doom...and now they are jumping off...because it's not T'challa vs. Doom...but Shuri and the Dora's doing all the action...

If Marvel wanted to help the book, they would give fans what they want. The title should have been retitled Storm and Black Panther...and then get Jason Aaron and Yost to co-write the book...with a good artist...and allow Mr. Maberry to continue to build on Shuri...and Wakanda...then I would agree...but the current moves are only making things worst.

Offline Vic Vega

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #38 on: May 25, 2010, 04:04:10 pm »
The sales fell when the Dark Reign crossover ended. THAT'S when everybody jumped off.

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #39 on: May 25, 2010, 08:14:36 pm »
We also don't know how many dropped the book because the artist change.  New guy was good, but not as exciting as KL.

Offline Seven

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #40 on: May 26, 2010, 01:51:32 pm »
The sales fell when the Dark Reign crossover ended. THAT'S when everybody jumped off.

Nope...they jumped off after Hudlin and Lashley left...AND Shuri became the Black Panther. The numbers show that...not just because of DR. If you still have DR on the title folks would have still jumped. Thus folk complaining about her being the Panther...for example Babs of Comicvine just did a artical blasting Doomwar, but the arcs before.

For example...the SI title didn't even sale much (the trade sold well)...in fact Hudlin's 6 issues out sold it...and Hudlin's issues have out sold Doomwar.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 01:53:31 pm by Seven »

Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #41 on: May 26, 2010, 02:19:27 pm »
<<Nope...they jumped off after Hudlin and Lashley left...AND Shuri became the Black Panther.>>

Except 1-6 is Shuri's origin so blaming her for a drop off may be emphazing the wrong thing.  It may have much more to do with the new writer and artist than Shuri.

If RH and KL stayed on BP and the sales dropped, then you could blame Shuri, but it was obvious early on that Shuri was the new BP and it didn't hurt those sales.

I don't think JM's Shuri and RH are the same "character".  I think JM took her in a completely different direction than where Reggie was leading her, number one being science vs magic.  Reggie's version was embracing "magic" by the end of her origin; JM turned her into a tech head who had other people doing the work. and he made T'challa the mystic.  He got it backwards.

Offline Princesa

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #42 on: May 26, 2010, 04:39:28 pm »
The sales of this franchise were trending steadily downward well before Aaron's highly successful  Skrull arc, we discussed what could stop the decline endlessly on here. We argued about it here and CBR were a few haters said this book was doomed (no pun) from the start. That's why there was a relaunch in the first place and yes it did well at first...then we got Shuri and she tanked the ship. She bled in a few months what took a couple years. I know not one person who bought this book for her or who wanted to see T'Challa and Ororo play her second and third fiddle. The opening act of the relaunch was great and did great, opening acts often do,  the 'power arc' was brutal.

So Shuri is getting a mini and that's cool. She will remain BP and I guess that makes since in I don't see a BP book coming back for a while because she can't carry a title. Ms Marvel and She Hulk well established characters, Power Girl, struggle to carry titles. But she has to get out from under T'Challa's shadow so I see them leaving Wakanda. If there are "interesting plans" most likely in the X Men, possibly Avengers. I could see Ororo pregnant. I do see them surfacing somewhere.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2010, 04:47:29 pm by Princesa »

Offline 4sake

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #43 on: May 26, 2010, 07:31:14 pm »
<<Nope...they jumped off after Hudlin and Lashley left...AND Shuri became the Black Panther.>>

Except 1-6 is Shuri's origin so blaming her for a drop off may be emphazing the wrong thing.  It may have much more to do with the new writer and artist than Shuri.

If RH and KL stayed on BP and the sales dropped, then you could blame Shuri, but it was obvious early on that Shuri was the new BP and it didn't hurt those sales.

I don't think JM's Shuri and RH are the same "character".  I think JM took her in a completely different direction than where Reggie was leading her, number one being science vs magic.  Reggie's version was embracing "magic" by the end of her origin; JM turned her into a tech head who had other people doing the work. and he made T'challa the mystic.  He got it backwards.

I disagree... :D
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Offline KIP LEWIS

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Re: Doomwar #4 Preview
« Reply #44 on: May 26, 2010, 07:35:19 pm »
Yeah, But I am always right.  :D