Author Topic: Civilized Debate  (Read 54954 times)

michaelintp

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #30 on: November 26, 2006, 05:48:26 pm »
I'm getting a little sick of this "what started out between two people" crap. If one person attacks another person repeatedly, the target of said attack does not make up the second half of 'two people'. It takes two people for a valid argument. I believe the word everyone is looking for is HARASSMENT. What started off as HARASSING one person became an all-out war on us all.

Thank you again Jenn.  While I can't be sure, I assume one of the "two people" referred to is me ... though I may be wrong in that regard.  All this is just too crypic for a simple-minded soul.   But yes, one reason I strongly came around to supporting the need for an ACTIVE moderator (a role that in the past I've been wary of) is precisely because of the harassment that was taking place on the board against "a certain person" (um ... I guess me).  So far I see that Lion is taking a very active role, to deleting threads and so on.  Under the circumstances, this is what is needed.

A THOUGHT FOR LION AND ALL OF  US:  I do think we need to be careful, however, that out-of-line conduct not be used intentionally to torpedo a good but controversial thread.  This is the reason why in the past I've been wary of moderators.  If someone doesn't like a topic, a sure way to kill it is often to intentionally provoke a fight (I guess y'all call it a flame war) in order to cause the thread to be shut down.  This can be a very insidious way to stiflle open discussion.  Of course the best solution to this problem would be to NOT delete the thread, but rather to warn the perpetrator to cease and desist, and if that person fails to do so, suspend his butt, and if he or she continues, ban the troublemaker.

A SECOND THOUGHT/QUESTION:  Many of the guidelines/principles we discussed will only work if everyone cooperates.  What do we do when that does not happen?  The idea of running to Lion like a bunch of whining babies anytime someone says something we don't like is, well, troubling.  On the other hand, our past practice of pointing out the vile conduct by confronting it in the thread itself has proven less than productive (though that might be because there was no active moderator).  I'm not sure how this will work out in practice.  Any thoughts?

Offline karaszero

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #31 on: November 26, 2006, 05:59:40 pm »
Mike I will offer you the same apology I offered J; the 2 party statement was not meant to mean 2 people who began to argue and then it got out of control i meant that there were 2 opposing viewpoints. I include myself in the 2 party statements because I have had disagreemnts with people although of course nowhere near the intensity and outrageous nature that you or Jenn have had

Offline karaszero

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #32 on: November 26, 2006, 06:02:18 pm »
MY fault again I stated that you two had disagreements I misspoke you two have been harassed

michaelintp

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #33 on: November 26, 2006, 06:19:21 pm »
Geeze Karaszero, forget the apologies.  No need.  I'm just glad Jenn pointed out what she pointed out.

ANOTHER QUESTION:  Is it possible for a moderator to "block" a member from posting on a thread without closing or deleting the entire thread?  That would be a perfect solution if one Board member begins actively insulting one or more forum members on the thread (with name calling, intentional mischaracterization of what they've said in an insulting manner, etc).  In short, "block" the flaming insulting bad guy from the thread while leaving the thread open for all the normal folk to have an adult discussion.  Is that possible with the technology this forum is using?

For topics where we do have strongly divergent opinions, but where some of us really want to discuss the issues without the personal insults, this would be most welcome.

Offline Lion

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #34 on: November 26, 2006, 06:37:33 pm »
To answer your last question...

Nope.

Jenn

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #35 on: November 26, 2006, 09:51:55 pm »
J I apologize for the mischaracterization of the harassment However, my point was it escalated into a racist diatribe which affected the entire board. Do you forgive me?

Ain't nothin to forgive bruh! S'all good.  ;D

Offline JLI Jesse

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #36 on: November 27, 2006, 05:53:36 am »
great post Lion.  Some people...well, most people on the internet can get carried away, and its always nice to have a moment of clarity. 


michaelintp

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #37 on: January 02, 2007, 05:26:56 pm »
I wonder if we really need this thread "stickied" at the top of this section anymore?  In light of developments on the forum and the fact that everyone is embracing civility and all ... I personally don't see the need.  At this point, thankfully, it seems like a recap of very old news. 

Maybe it should be allowed to move down the list like all other threads ... into the dustbin of history.   ???

Offline Reginald Hudlin

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #38 on: January 02, 2007, 06:10:28 pm »
Consider the sad cycle of psychos that periodically invade the Panther Pages, I fear that some other entity will turn the Vox Populi section into a war zone once again.  I say we leave it up so we never forget. 

michaelintp

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #39 on: January 02, 2007, 06:55:04 pm »
Consider the sad cycle of psychos that periodically invade the Panther Pages, I fear that some other entity will turn the Vox Populi section into a war zone once again.  I say we leave it up so we never forget. 

OK Reginald.  You're the boss.  Yes, as a reminder, lest we forget.  As they say ...

"NEVER AGAIN!"

Offline Lion

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #40 on: January 02, 2007, 07:03:52 pm »
Agreed!

Offline Sam Wilson

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #41 on: January 03, 2007, 05:18:47 am »
Agreed!

Word. (sorry, had to get that in there...)  :-\

michaelintp

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #42 on: January 03, 2007, 06:46:19 am »

Offline Curtis Metcalf

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #43 on: January 14, 2007, 07:04:06 am »
Here's my pick for post of the month:
Hmmm Am I the only one that feels AJ comes off as a bit antagonistic? Action J, what diff does it make if it was a typo or not? The point was made that BP has been treated as a second rate character pretty much since his inception, I find that hard to disagree with. The point was also made that Priest gave a valid attempt at elevating the character to a more awe-inspiring member of the MU. Again I don’t see anything to disagree with. And the underlying deliberation of this thread is that most of us feel that RH should continue the trend of bringing BP into a more enriching and formidable portrayal of the character. Again I totally agree with this as do most of the folks here. I’m not sure what your stance is and I will not attempt to proclaim “you actually meant something other than what it looks like?” since only you know what you meant not I.

But I will say this, there is a lot of agreement here at HEF on things and there is also a lot of disagreement but no one here takes things to a personal level and when clarification is needed it is simply asked for and given. There really isn’t a need to become either aggressive or defensive in your stances on any of the subjects discussed here. And please don’t take my statement here as an attack on you. It’s not! Just because someone disagrees does not mean it is a personal attack on you. It is simply a disagreement and it goes hand in hand with the willingness to discuss or deliberate the subject in a open and friendly manner. And when all that fails we simply bring out our secret weapon.. The JENNamator!! LOL! believe me you don’t want that! LOL!

Relax a bit and have fun with the debates, since that is “the way” of HEF.

Peace.

Thank you Goat.  That is a fine description of the ideal we strive for here.
"Seek first to understand, then to be understood."
"Be hard on systems, but soft on people."

Offline The Evasive 1

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Re: Civilized Debate
« Reply #44 on: January 20, 2007, 05:04:35 pm »
Wow. I actually just read this and I find it funny because I'm not sure if we all are really practicing this here at HEF even after this discussion. I will be the first one to say that I have been guilty of doing somethings that this discussion is supposedly trying to stop. But a few people in this discussion (no I will not say names) are still guilty of some of those negative actions in their posts.

It WAS a good idea to leave this thread up for folks to come back and review form time to time so that we can all say "Never Again". However, I don't think enough of the HEF community is doing this that based on some of the posts that STILL are appearing on the forum boards. Hopefully alot more of us will read this thread or RE-read this thread to make our discussion here at HEF truly more civil.